1927 Overflow Pipe cracked - recommendations

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2015: 1927 Overflow Pipe cracked - recommendations
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Kelsey on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 12:23 am:

There is a crack in the overflow pipe on my 1927 tudor that I really don't want to have to weld again. This past summer, I borrowed a friends welder and fixed the crack, but put the parts together at the wrong angle. When I tried to bend it back, the weld cracked again. I really don't want to pay $30.00 for a repop that doesn't have the pressed steel nor do I want to bug my friend to borrow his welder again. Does anyone have a spare one they want to part with? Have any of you made one from scratch?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 12:31 am:

I thought the overflow pipe went down through the gas tank? You would have to really get tough on it to get to it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 01:31 am:

Jim, I thought the outer overflow pipe was just held in place at the tank with a set screw; not affixed permanently so it can't move. Or are you and I talking about two different things.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Todd, ............Red Deer, Alberta on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 11:07 am:

Overflow pipe, radiator? Or fuel?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Patrick on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 12:06 pm:

Here is a picture of the engine compartment of my '26 coupe. On mine, the overflows pipe is attached to the overflow connection that runs from the top of the gas tank, through the interior of the tank and comes out through a hole on the passenger side of the firewall, as can be seen in the second photo. You can see the overflow firewall pipe below the cast iron shutoff valve held in place by a small u-bolt. The pipe goes down through the engine dust shield and empties the overflow on the ground. These firewall overflow pipes are available at Snyders and Langs. Based upon the responses you have had, there appears to be a little confusion as to what your problem is. Using these photos, perhaps you can be more specific about your dilemma and what portion of the overflow pipe you are referring to.

Jim Patrick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Kelsey on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 12:35 pm:

I tried to upload a picture of the crack with my phone, but the forum wouldn't allow it, even when I shrunk it down to under 400 K.

The upper picture with the overflow tube on the firewall is what I am referring to. The crack is right where the hook is that holds it against the firewall. I believe it was from eighty+ years of viration that wore it thin and it cracked.

Yes, I can purchase them from Langs, but I would rather not spend $30.00 on a new one if I can avoid it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George n Los Angeles CA on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 12:53 pm:

Need to shrink pic to under 250K


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Leon Parker - Benton, Kentucky on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 01:13 pm:

Get some electrical 1/2" thin wall conduit. I bought one from one of the dealers and that is what I got with a small offset in it. I had to take my 1/2" bender and do more work on it to make it fit. If I knew that is what they used I would have made it. For the u-bolt get one that fits the thin wall conduit and cut one side off. That is what also came with the kit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 01:16 pm:

About 18 years ago I replaced my rotted out overflow pipe with a re-pop pipe. It lasted a very short time. I resolved to make a new one out of EMT. After 18 years it is right up there near the top of my "to-do" list. It might get done if it was on Terrie's "Terry to-do list"!

Here is a tweak of Jim's photo (left) and a photo of how I do my overflow pipe(right.)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 04:12 pm:

Jim, I was ashamed about not fixing my overflow pipe for 15 years so I went down to the shop and started the job.

I discovered why I had let the job go:

  1. the pipe seems to not be necessary, a little overflow seem to drip down the firewall harmlessly
  2. 1/2" conduit (EMT) is too large to fit


So I went ahead and fabricated the following:

Tapering in a lathe won't let it fit, but it will weaken the pipe so it can break again

Cut a slot

Swedge the pipe closed on the cut.

You can braze or weld the tube close if you want. I don't think there will be any problem with leaving it in the swedged condition.

Installed to check fit and for dimpling or drilling for a set screw.

TH


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eric Sole - Castelldefels (Spain) on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 04:27 pm:

Good looking job Terry.

I think the overflow pipe extension was thought to be necessary back when many gas pumps did not shut off when fuel reached the filler nozzle. It would be possible for quite a bit of gasoline to spill over the filler neck, accumulate in the tray and then pour down through the overflow pipe past a hot exhaust manifold and down onto the ground.

Just my conjecture...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 08:19 pm:

Eric Sole makes a good point. No gasoline dispensing pumps in the model T era had reliable automatic shutoffs. And automatic shutoffs of any kind were rare. The common and well known "visible" pumps with the large glass top in the 1920s and early '30s were not accurate and began being outlawed in the early '30s. They were an improvement for the customer over the non-visible type pumps. The problem with the non-visible pumps was that an unscrupulous clerk could easily charge for (say?) four gallons of gasoline, but only dispense three or a little more, pocketing the difference in cash.
The way the visible pumps worked, was that the customer would ask for four gallons of gasoline. The clerk would then pump gasoline into the glass top until the four gallon marker was touched. The customer then had the opportunity to SEE that there was actually four full gallons there, and trust not to have been shorted (hence, "visible"). The nozzle valve was then opened, the top glass allowed to drain fully into the tank.
The problem with this system (other than it was still fairly simple to trick and cheat the customer), was that if the customer over-estimated what he needed? He would ask for (say?) six gallons of gasoline when actually only needing five and a half gallons. The valve to release the gasoline from the glass would be opened? The car's gasoline tank would overflow and a half gallon would end up all over the tank, car, and ground.

The world may have changed a lot in the past hundred years? But unscrupulous cheating has always been around. A long time ago, I twice saw unrestored "visible" pumps that still had rocks in the bottom of the glass. Because the glass on a lot of these pumps sat higher than most customers could see, about a half gallon of rock could be put in the bottom of them and not likely seen. An extra dime in the clerk's pocket.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Wednesday, December 16, 2015 - 09:27 pm:

Wayne, an extra dime doesn't sound like much, but it would be charged on every transaction!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, December 17, 2015 - 12:16 am:

Terry, And in days when a fair wage was two bucks a day, it was a lot of money.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By paul iverson freeport ill. on Thursday, December 17, 2015 - 12:31 am:

Wayne I never heard that about rocks I heard it was a common trick to drain the hose into a can between customers for the pump boys own car!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, December 17, 2015 - 01:48 am:

Paul I,
I have heard that one also.
Thank you!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Kelsey on Monday, December 21, 2015 - 03:42 am:



Terry:

I took your advice and used electrical conduit. I think it will work out just fine.


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