Alright Ebay, this time you've gone too far.......

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2008: Alright Ebay, this time you've gone too far.......
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chuck Hoffman on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 08:32 pm:

This is a rant! I can't believe this. I listed some HO gauge trains on the bay and in the description, I stated that I would also accept cash or checks (beside their money grubbing Paypal). I just got an email saying They had cancelled my auction because I had put "cash" in my description. I guess the next thing is to have the mark of the beast (or bay) tattooed on my forehead in order to be able to sell...............Adios Ebay, it's been a fun 10 years.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 08:48 pm:

You might want to check with a lawyer. I just looked at a dollar bill and it has printed on it, "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private." I'm not sure that e-bay is legal in trying to forbid cash payments.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bob sell on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 08:49 pm:

yes e bay has become something you need a college degree to do anymore!
same thing happened to me i put my $65,000.00 boat on and said i would accept cash upon delivery and wammo off i went and they charges me the fees all over to relist without the word cash!

e bay has went down hill since they allow all that new junk instead of antiques and collectables. i feel your pain i have been on e bauy since 1998 too, and i used to list over 30 items daily . now i am lucky to list 30 a year!
you think they would ask why?
but that might take a real person who cared!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob McDaniel (Indiana Trucks) on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 09:05 pm:

I wish something would replace the e-bay of pigs soon. They are getting way to fat from the fees and now this too. I know a little about hog futures, hogs have no future! I am another 1998 member that can't sell anymore because of the way they make you do things. After Jan. 15th you can't even take a check or money order or they will pull your ad. I think they went way to far with that one. Paypal is owned by e-bay and its way to risky for the seller. Don't ask how I know but they can and will take back payments from buyers after you send out your item someday.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 09:10 pm:

Guys

You can slam eBay if you want, but I still like this source of t parts. I have bought and sold a lot on eBay, starting in 1999 with money order or checks only. Later I got PayPal account, and my sales when up because of security for buyer and seller.

My only bad experience was when a guy said he would mail cash, I sent the item, no cash arrived. I emailed the guy, he said he mailed it, post office must have lost the letter. He wanted the item, I wanted the cash. He said he paid, (I trust he did), US Post Office fault, what was left to do, he was honest (had favorable ebay rating) so it was my lost.. Now with PayPal and NO CASH, I feel trouble free.

Quote below from EBAY:

""Why does eBay have this policy?

Safety and convenience are at the core of eBay’s policies toward payments. This policy is designed to promote safe online shopping, and to encourage online payment methods that are safer, easier to use, and offer high levels of protection for users""

Leave eBay if you wish, its your right. I think the no cash policy is right. Milage will vary, MHO only.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 09:25 pm:

Like it or not,love it or hate it, Ebay keeps the hobby alive. Instant access to rare and not so rare parts, especially if you live in a remote location with few swapmeets. I actually use it all the time, and look forward to the "brown santa" aka "UPS"... showing up with a package for me!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 09:50 pm:

A seller that only accepted cash was not verified by e-bay as legit and could not use PayPal.

A seller that could not take PayPal was a very risky seller to buy form on e-bay.

One of those sellers scammed me out of $225 and has since saved me a lot of money on e-bay purhases that I didn't need anyway.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:04 pm:

OK you take your stuff to a 2 day swap meet. The space cost $60 for the two days. You had to take time to load be there at 6am to set up, when done, take down reload take it home and unload. For thoes two day and all thoes hours you sold $30 of little stuff..how much did it cost you in outlay of cash time etc. And don't forget the over priced consession food!
I like going to swap meets, I have sold at two. I found it is just not my cup of tea to sit there for 1 or 2 days. I love ebay, sit down list the parts if they sell great if not I re-list them and try again. I would be rather be taking a package with a sold item to the post office then repacking my unsold stuff to bring it back home.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Gould on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:19 pm:

Ebay is great for buyers in general, good for sellers of relatively inexpensive parts and bad for sellers with large dollar items. How'd you like to pay a listing fee, a final value fee and Pay Pal fees on a $2500 item. If so, I hope you purchased the part you are now selling for peanuts. You'll cough up a large chunk of profit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:21 pm:

I started Ebay in January of 04.I loved ebay the first couple years.Alot of fun,and I made some space in the basement and I made a little scratch to put towards T parts.
I have a paypal account that I set up thinking it would be so good.
Wrong.
I had several items up 1 week and several sold.All but 1 payed by money order.1 wanted to use paypal.It was over a week before Paypal come thru to my checking account,the money orders were allready in,cashed and the items shipped.
Pay pal is exspenive and slow to transfer your money to the bank checking account.My theory for that is simple.They want you to use a Paypal credit card.Leaveing the money you earn with them longer so they can earn intrest off of it.It is all a money makeing scheme for Ebay.
What really urks me is to get on there and be searching for something and a bunch of imported,new Junk will be listed.I aint to lazy to go to the family dollar or hardware to get new items.I am on ebay for vintage parts and such.
I had 1 bidder in the years I sold stuff that sent cash.I waited till it showed up,then sent the item.I did suggjest differently but he was to far from a place to get a money order.
I used to get the complaint," It is to much trouble to get a money order" from people wanting to bid on my stuff.Geez,doesnt anyone go to town anymore?
When I sold items it was vintage car radios,owners manuals for tractors and carburators and such.I had and still have a purty good pile of stuff that dont fit anything I want to fix.And Ebay was a good way to flip that stuff and turn around and get T parts.

I do believe if someone of stature would start another auction site,with all legit forms of payment acceptable,it would go over great right now.

And for those that automaticaly assume non paypal users are fraudulent sellers or buyers,that aint a fair assumption and does not fit most ebayers includeing me.
I value my name and reputation and was allways honest in my dealings with ebay sellers and buyers.Frankly why would I want to do folkes any other way?Some folkes I bought from are regular posters on this forumn.I found that out when I said something about a pulley not being what it was advertised as.The seller saw my comment on here,emailed me,and sent CASH to my doorstep.That my friends is the way to do bussiness.Be honest,and if you make a mistake,deal with it in a honest and prompt manner.granted,I shoulda emailed him first.That is a lesson I learned.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Schrope on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:32 pm:

I wonder if the guvment is pressuring ebay to use paypal so there is a paper trail of the money. Think how much taxable income is being lost here. Also, what about state sales tax. I've been expecting some sort of law to be passed that would somehow collect sales tax on interstate sales. My bet is that itsa commin'


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:40 pm:

Well,Fred,I think you are on the right track.But for the guvment to go after the taxes from Ebay sales and get far with it would be a daunting task.You take for example I buy a part for 10,sell it for 20,pay the paypal fees and selling fees and such,by the time it is said and done,the "profit" is not that much and records would be difficult to keep if you sold alot.It would be a bussiness actually.
I dont consider Ebay to be any different than a yard or garage sale.How many of you pay taxes on the profits you make from your yardsales?
And besides,if Ebay falls into the tax routine,that will be the final nail in thier coffin.People would just quit useing it.Just check the stock price graph that Ricks posted on another thread.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 10:49 pm:

Another point(s) to ponder! How many people out there are not members of any T club? Do not have any connection to T people! Think of all the parts that sit on shelfs gathering dust. Ebay has got thoes parts out into the hands of people that need them. I am talking about stuff that without ebay, the thought of selling that part would have never crossed their minds. I think Mack it right the task would be huge to collect tax.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glenn Pullin on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:05 pm:

My humble view - coming from a law enforcement and managerial background in a federal government environment (in Aust not US) :
It would be an administrative nightmare to monitor and ensure appropriate taxes are paid on every ebay transaction. Why expend resources (and in an example like this, considerable resources) to monitor transactions whereby only a dollar or two may be payable.
Perhaps you may even consider that this type of transaction recording (paypal only) may be Ebays way of ensuring that they are paying the appropriate taxes - after all as a global company the last thing they want is any government crawling around their books and records - US or otherwise.
Even consider that paypal only transactions are ebays method of ensuring that taxes are recorded and paid appropriately by the individual. In a cash only environment, no government can be sure that the individual pays the right taxes. This may be ebays way of removing themselves (as a corporate entity) from any issues of tax evasion by an individual using their services.
Finally, even consider that paypal only is Ebays way of making more money and has nothing to do with taxes. This may be just a simple case of corporate greed.
Personally, i choose ONLY to use paypal for its protection (which has come in handy twice since 2001 from me) and have no problems with using it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fred Schrope on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:17 pm:

Mack & Mark
I agree, difficult to collect. So what? When has common sense ever been used in the same sentence as government?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bob sell on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:26 pm:

it is just plain getting rediculous and harder to use. we need a vintage only site and asap!
they have become a mall for everything and now dictators of how you run your business!
i am a licensed auctioneer and can overcome all of the legal things thru my business but the no money orders !
that is dictation plain and simple!
i agree
"legal tender for all debts public and private!"
lets all get together and start a t parts and vintage related auction here!
i love the format here ! sides i woudnt mind paying the club the fees i pay e bay!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By bob sell on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:26 pm:

man u started one here!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:27 pm:

Did a little digging.
Google this name.Looks to be a intresting site.I forgot to copy the propertys to get the full link.Duh.

onlineauction

An interesting way to address the loss of rights to leave negitive feedback.
www.bidderblacklist.com


And to further support Ricks graph,looks like things werent going well for a while.

http://genuineseller.com/ebay-layoffs-what-effect-will-it-have-on-you/


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By andy samuelson on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:34 pm:

Later this month Ebay will cancel your listing if you even mention any other payment other than Paypal. As a seller it sucks, Ebay has already collected 2 fees. First a listing fee then a final value fee. Then they want a paypal fee.
The new CEO must be looking for a bonus. If the gov was involved they would not go along with this as it really hurts their sales of money orders.
Personaly I think what they are doing is ilegal.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:36 pm:

Most of us Scotchmen feel that E-Bay and the British invasion at Chickasha drive up prices which is good if you are selling and bad if you are buying.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed Niedzielski on Monday, January 12, 2009 - 11:54 pm:

If we look at the origin of this thread started by Chuck, the topic at hand is about "choice". When we as clients of eBay are TOLD how this game is going to be played with really no input from us, then that kind of smarts.

No question that PayPal is a convenience to many; however that payment version is not without its problems either. Otherwise you would not see some people in the past state "no PayPal period" in their auctions as sometimes they have been burned by buyers who fraudulently told PayPal they never got their purchases and had the transaction reversed.

The PayPal connection is a profit grab by eBay, which I guess they are entitled to do in a capitalist world that we live in. If we do not like it, we can leave, but then what is the alternative? As soon as a competitor pops up to compete, eBay crushes them. With regards to taxation, in Canada, our government has been after eBay Canada to turn over all client records of the power sellers so that they can be "sigged" after for taxes. I have not been following this battle and do not know what the current state of affairs is on that story.

However, the aspect of being able to use cash as legal tender is an important democratic aspect and should be viewed as the main learning point of this discussion thread. If you are wanting to buy or sell something why should you have to pay a fee/charge for access to the capital world versus just pulling some bucks out of your jeans and doing the deal? (You know, we are not only "Mechanical Archaeologists" but Philosophers as well, judging by the many viewpoints I have read in all these discussion threads!)

As I work in the financial world, I see how institutions are wanting people to move to a cashless society so that they can increase profits and gain more control over clients (for lack of a better term). The governments are liking this move, because just think how easy it will become to do an audit on the average Joe, especially one who is industrious and maybe does some cash jobs on the side, curbs the odd car to get ahead. All they have to do is call up your debit/electronic card transactions to see every pack of gum you bought, because we would be in a cashless world which could maybe happen if one day someone will do a survey and they will say, "well, only 30 percent of the population is using cash so we will do away with this-then it will be too late). This is not a conspiracy, rather it is a strategy. Look around you and you can see it happening so slowly it is just underneath most people's radar screens. Hence, use cash whenever you can for this and other reasons, (such as why make the banks more rich on your service fees?)

Yikes! It just occurred to me that a spouse could easily see every part you ever electronically bought in the possible future as well! Now this sends chills up my spine! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Berch on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 12:11 am:

My son just bought a car from "Craigs List" and I just listed a tree spade with them. It's free and easy. They don't have all the tattle tale features that ebay has but it works well on larger items within driving distance, where you would be dealing with the seller face to face, which is probably the only way I'd buy a car anyway. It works for me.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By aaron on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 12:28 am:

Craigslist is a good way to buy a car. I've done it 3 times.
I emailed or called the owner, drove there, drove the car, made a deal and bought it-or them.
I have bought stuff on eBay that was less than a mile out of my way and the seller refused to let me just pick it up. He made me pay shipping charges and wait.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ray Elkins on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 12:42 am:

There is talk about taxes from profits, but most of us in the hobby that sell used parts don't really make a profit. If one figures his labor, storage, etc., there is really no profit as a hobbyist. Mack mentioned taxes on profits from a yard sale, but the fact is that yard sale items are usually sold at a loss. The stupid tax man doesn't seem to understand that I bought the items 20 years ago, and hell no I ain't got a reciept, don't recall what I gave for it, and therefore cannot (and will not) try to calculate what part of the sale price is profit.

I'll still buy on Ebay I guess, but my selling days are over. I don't mind paying a fee for the final value and listing since that is part of doing business, but where I refuse to play is when they charge me a percentage of the shipping fees when the money goes through Paypal. The shipping fees should be exempt from the Paypal charge. Like has been said already, I think what they are doing is illegal and wouldn't stand up against a class-action suit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 12:53 am:

Part of Papal's move is defensive. . Chiselers who list a small part for a dollar, and with $20 for shipping, have helped bring this on.

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By janise on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 12:56 am:

If you accept cash through the mail you are a fool.

I sent you $800 in cash three weeks ago. I have the registered mail reciept. Where's my parts? I called Ebay, sent them a copy of the reciept and they refunded my money and then took the funds from your account. I'm happy. I love ebay. I got $800 from you.
Or
I send you $300 and you claim there was only $50 in the envelope. Who's right?

Get the picture?


Can't pick up? Look at it from the other side. I sell you a $5 wrench and you take up 2 hours of my time jawing about more tools. And/OR you tell your buddies I have a garage full of old tools and they come over that night and steal them. I don't know you from some dope snorting crook. Why would I want you at my house?

Rules and policies are in place to protect people. Those that complain the loudest are usually the ones that try to take avantage of a situation. Follow the rules and it works.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Anthony Bennett - Australia on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 06:30 am:

Ebay Australia tried to make PayPal, its wholly owned subsiduary, compulsory for eveything except whole cars... They don't get a cut from direct bank transfers you see.

The Australian Consumer and Competition Commission soon sorted them out:-)

I can see why they do it, there's good reason but be bugered if they're going to be the only way of transacting.

my 5 cents anyway;)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By VICTOR BLOXSOME on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 07:45 am:

Ted Dumas , are you genuine ? SCOTCH is whiskey . SCOTS are men . We must preserve correct grammar and syntax ... English ( from Gloucestershire before 1838, Australian since then )but Granny from Dundee ,Ayrshire-dinna ye ken ? VICTOR BLOXSOME in BRISBANE .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jem Bowkett on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 07:51 am:

Scots or not, Ted can stop worrying about the British at Chickasha -we're all broke and the pound has slid 25% against the dollar.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce Peterson on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 08:07 am:

The Scots call whiskey WHISKEY. Only people outside Scotland call the whiskey made in Scotland Scotch.

Ebay is a well run business, one of the best. It is not a public service. They do what they do to maximize profit. I've got hundreds of successful Paypal sales and purchases. Never a problem.

If General Motors were run the same way as Ebay they would be the only car company on earth.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ray Elkins on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 08:44 am:

rules are made to be broken, and sellers' excessive blah-blah-blah longwinded "policies" make me want to puke. For example, payment expected in 3 days after auction end but they take a week to ship it. They might as well put in a policy against boogeymen under the bed too, as that crap is there to protect sellers from (for the most part) imaginary problems. I've personally had many more problems with deadbeat, lazy, lying sellers than buyers. Actually I've never dealt with a bad buyer. The sellers on Ebay that don't want to play well with others are those that are always causing the problems.

Every auction I ever ran just said "no ridiculous "policies", won't ask you to jump through hoops, just pay in a respectable and courteous time period and I'll return the favor."

As for "Those that complain the loudest are usually the ones that try to take avantage of a situation", well...I don't recall ever trying to take advantage of anything or anyone on Ebay. If I recall, this thread was about Ebay pulling auctions because the seller offered potential buyers the opportunity to pay with cash. What part of that gives the impression someone is trying to take advantage of a situation?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 09:11 am:

Don't you wonder that about half the cars offered don't meet reserve? You can bet some of them are sold off tbay to a bidder, thereby avoiding the commissions.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mack Jeffrey Cole on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 09:14 am:

janise,You just flat out insulted me.Be a man or woman and put your name in blue like the rest of us.
When I go to another mans shop,what is in his shop is no one else's bussiness and it aint mine to change that.For you to sit and bark behind a fence without a profile and insult folks like us that are honest is flat out uncalled for.
Anybody with any common sense can see that Ebay is not treating people right when they eliminate choices of payment methods.And it will bite them in the butt in time..


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 10:22 am:

Royce, close....

"A Scotsman who spells
Whisky with a n ‘e’,
should be hand cuffed
and thrown head first in the Dee.

In the USA
and Ireland,
it’s spelt with an ‘e’
but in Scotland
it’s real ‘Whisky’.

So if you see Whisky
and it has an ‘e’,
only take it,
if you get it for free!

For the name is not the same
and it never will be,
a dram is only a real dram,
from a bottle of ‘Scotch Whisky’."


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Berch on Tuesday, January 13, 2009 - 10:51 am:

Janise, My experience with buying anything outside or inside of ebay is that a seller,or salesman always has time for (jawing), and can't wait to show you the rest of their trinkets.
I've never sold anything on ebay but I've bought several things. I've always used postal money orders. I don't use Pay Pal and don't care to. I'm sure ebay won't miss my business when they go to Pay Pal only.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ray Elkins on Thursday, January 15, 2009 - 06:43 am:

Mack, don't be insulted. That person posted that with the sole purpose of insult. Don't give him any satisfaction. You're better than that, as most of the rest of us in the hobby are.


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