How do you shorten the gap between the rear body and rear doors?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: How do you shorten the gap between the rear body and rear doors?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 05:46 pm:

how do you shorten the gap between the rear body and rear doors?

I raised the rear body 5/16 - little over a quarter inch and it helped the door closed with a click, but did nit appear to shorten the gap.

It is cracking the bend in the round part at the bottom of the body outside the door.

Any suggestions is appreciated. Thank you in advance. Bob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Albert Belling on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 06:08 pm:

Did try shimming the door hinge.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 07:22 pm:

I would raise rear mounts at least another 1/4 inch


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 07:53 pm:

I don't like the looks of that crack though, is it the same on both sides?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 08:22 pm:

the crack is the same on both sides. Worse on the passenger side.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 08:25 pm:

the crack occurred when I lifted the rear without loosening the center bolts.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Garrison - Rice Minnesota on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 09:07 pm:

You probably stretched the metal around those bolt and might have created some structural damage as well. You can probably put a bandaid fix on it with some shims but the resulting twisting and fatigue probably won't be good farther down the road.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 09:18 pm:

What year is it? I read somewhere that the 13 had a problem with the back seat falling off. They added a reinforcement later to prevent that problem. You might need some new wood in the body sills or weld some of the metal.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian Dowell on Thursday, January 14, 2016 - 09:49 pm:

Bob I bought a 15 Touring. Same problem. On mine the wood sills along the frame has broke loose from the risers just in front of rear seat at the back of the back door right where yours is cracked. Stand behind the car and push up where the top is stapled to the back have someone watch the door gap close. If this is it it is dangerous the rear of the car can break off. I lifted mine about a half inch. Then two of us grabbed the top saddle and lifted the whole back off.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 03:44 am:

Robert, the gap between the door and the body is wider at the top, indicating that the rear of the body needs to be raised as Jack suggested. Was the body painted off the frame? It may be that things have shifted a little on assembly, and there needs to be some correction when it is in its final position.

Hope this helps.
Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Rosenthal in Cincinnati Oh on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 08:19 am:

Bob:
I'm suspect of the integrity of the structural rear wood of this body. I needed to shim the door fit on my 12 Touring, but those door alignment misses were no where near this extreme. Others here may determine this is no big deal, but I find this troubling. Am I recalling correct that you had previously reported some shifting of your rear seat pedestal sheet metal and trim?...I would get this looked at first hand by someone who is familiar with this body construction, no matter what frame to body shimming may result in.
Regards,
Scott


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 08:42 am:

Again thank you for all your thoughts.

This is a frame off restoration - very armature, but professionally painted.

I had the same door gap problem when I reassembled thar car before the paint. Fixed the gap with shims and it was just fine.

After paint and reassembly the shims don't work as well. I will try this weekend putting a shim on the driver side middle bracket and the passenger side rear bracket. This might twist the body a little because the driver side door is a little too tight.

I also am concerned a little about the wood integrity as others have said.

I will keep you posted when I get it resolved.

Bob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thomas Mullin on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 11:20 am:

Robert, Looking at the basic structure of the rear of a touring car, you see the importance of the wood sill rails in supporting the rear seat. The rest of the support comes from the rear door pillar and the heel panel. It is a cantilever construction with the passenger load causing things to get worse. You might check your sills to see if they need reinforcing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Sommers on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 02:27 pm:

I have a 13 Touring, and the front edge of the rear doors are about 5/8" above the edge of the rear part of the front seat. I looked at David McCalley's book which showed reinforcement brackets. My car has none of those. How do I identify a sill problem? I have looked underneath, but I am failing to understand where and what I might need to reinforce.
Thanks for some insight....
Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Poane on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 03:51 pm:

I put 7/8" shimms and no appreciable closure of the gap. Hmmmmmmmm? The gap does close when I push the rear seat forwards and up. Hmmmmmmm?

I will keep trying but most likely live with the gap rather than stress and strain the wood.

Mike S, you might want to start a new thread as your question might get lost in this one - or not??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 04:30 pm:

Robert, That makes me even more suspect of the integrity of your wood sills! You need to get under there and watch what happens when someone else lifts & pushes the back seat--you'll probably find the wood cracked at least. I would be leery of putting anything in the back seat area, especially people!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Sommers on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 04:48 pm:

Thanks,
Until I can understand how to figure out where any structural failure exists, that could compromise the back seat... I need to reserve that seat for my mother-in-law, only...

Regards


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 05:41 pm:

Well. . . yeah, that's an option I hadn't thought about!
:-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Daron - Brownsburg IN on Friday, January 15, 2016 - 05:42 pm:

Michael,I have a 13 touring with those rear braces in it.I am currently working on rewooding the body.If you are in the Indy area,you are welcome to come look at them. Special note to Dr. Poane,You need to crawl under the 12 and look it over very closly.The time to fix it is now,before you dump any more money into a restoration.This could be a serious safety issue.


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