Help dating engine

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: Help dating engine
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke Markham on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 07:12 pm:

I have had a C-cab model T for a few years now and haven't been able to date the engine because the serial number is not completely legible. I have looked through the forums to find different methods of dating the engine. I have look for a casting date on the block, but there isn't one there. Attached are several photos of the serial number, cylinder head, and overall engine. any help would be greatly appreciated.

C-cab guy

serial #Head NumberEngineSerial Number


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke Markham on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 07:21 pm:

the 2nd photo is of the rear of the cylinder head.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 08:13 pm:

Luke

This info was in an old forum post from 2008, haven't tried this ever, but might just work. :-)

By Deputy Dog on Friday, March 07, 2008 - 01:19 pm:
Years ago, I was a Deputy Sheriff. We used a battery charger clamped to a cotton ball, soaked in sulfuric acid to raze serial numbers on stollen guns and cars. The molocules were compressed by the original stamp, and the old number appears as dark impressions.

Here is an inside secret. Don't tell car theives this though. If you weld over the old number before grinding it smooth and restamping, the old number is gone forever! Can never be raised again.

Deputy Dog


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Hjortnaes, Men Falls, WI on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 08:21 pm:

Try a piece of thin paper over the number and then use the side of a pencil lead to lightly rub over the paper. They use this method on old tombstones.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed in California on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 08:24 pm:

2561705


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Justin H. - Western PA on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 08:29 pm:

Welcome. I can't help with the serial number but do you have any pictures to post of your C cab?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Saturday, June 18, 2016 - 08:51 pm:

Thanks to all y'all for responding. Justin, you asked for pictures and at the moment I have the fenders, running boards, and hood off for painting. here is an old picture though. Henry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 02:18 pm:

I forgot to mention that the car does have an electric starter.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 02:43 pm:

It is a 1919 or later engine. The cylinder head is a low head from about 1914 - 1917, so it is not original to this engine. The truck body appears to be home made from plywood, in a pleasant style. Probably no earlier than 1960's construction.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 02:52 pm:

thank you for your help Royce. the body was constructed probably about 12 years ago. the guy we bought it from said that the body that was on it was completely rotted out except for the dash and wood frame underneath. He said that he traced the body pieces onto plywood and cut new ones.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker, Ramona, CA on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 03:11 pm:

I seem to remember that the cast numbers on the cylinder head are the day and month of the casting, not the year. Really quite a shame for us restorers...
What is the extra pulley on the fan belt for?
You can see an extra piece of metal under the fan bolt and it appears to stop the insertion of a split pin from holding the bolt.
Just asking.....

(Message edited by Tony_bowker on June 23, 2016)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 03:19 pm:

its just a tensioner. I think the guy we bought it from had a belt that was a little too long and needed something to pull it tight.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 06:20 pm:

Nice looking truck, and interesting headlamps.
Cannot tell for sure if the valve side cover is one piece or two piece. (I think it looks like a one piece.) One piece is '21 or later, two piece is '22 or earlier. More than a year of overlap between them.
The head does appear to be an earlier low head. Probably cast on December 15 of 1913/'14/'15/'16. There are exceptions with full dates, but most head casting dates gave month and date only, not the year as Tony B mentioned.
Looks like a great truck!
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 11:26 pm:

thanks to all y'all again for responding. I do have 1 question. would it be possible for somebody to have replaced the transmission cover (no starter) to one with a starter? the reason I ask is if Ed's comment is correct, the date of the engine block would be march of 1918. thanks in advance.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eric Hylen- Central Minnesota on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 11:52 pm:

While it's common to replace an early transmission cover to a later one for the purpose of using a starter, it doesn't change the features of the block that we use to identify a year range. Your block has provision for a generator, making it '19 or later, as Royce said. If I recall correctly, the one piece valve cover makes it '21 or later. If it does not have two bosses with threaded holes at the bak of the block near the mag post on the transmission cover, it's '25 or earlier.

What's the vin number on your title? If it matches most of the numbers on the block, it might be the original number. With that, we can really narrow the range.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Friday, June 24, 2016 - 05:44 am:

The cast and machined boss where the serial number is stamped is odd for a 1919 and later engine - usually they are wider with a narrow "neck" going down to the water inlet?

Here's Jeff Perkin's 1919 engine from this thread http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/178201.html for comparison:


Hh


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Luke on Friday, June 24, 2016 - 10:35 am:

Eric,
Thank you for the information. Really glad to have y'all to help with this. sadly, we do not have the title for narrowing down the date.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Friday, June 24, 2016 - 04:12 pm:

Then too replacement engine blocks were supposedly sent without a serial number stamped there and the garage stamped the same number on the new engine block to keep the papers correct.


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