My model T will be used for weddings where crowds notoriously cause delays and stop-go-traffic. I've tested a puller electric radiator fan that I plan to mount, which will also solve my lower pulley rattle problem.
I'm considering a thermostatic control in the upper radiator hose, but will start with a manual switch in the cockpit to prove the concept first.
If anyone can post a picture of a model T with an electric fan I would love to learn from other set ups.
Really trying hard not to be "negative" here Chris, but asking for photos of a Model "T" with an electric fan, would be about like asking about a high capacity magazine for your AR-15 at a PTA meeting! Model "T" Ford guys "DO NOT" use electric fans! That's "hot rodder" stuff!
I also hate to be Mr. Negative, but based on this and some of the questions you had about pressurizing the fuel system, you seem hell bent on defeating the inherent simplicity of the Model T.
The fuel system uses gravity and the cooling system is thermosyphon. If you are looking for reliability, this is about as good as it gets.
With respect to your cooling system, find out first why it is overheating. Second, inspect the radiator. If it is original to the car, it is very possible that you have blocked tubes. A radiator in good condition (new radiator available from Berg's or Brassworks is recommended) and a good flushing of the water jacket will solve 99% of all overheating problems provided you do not have something else going on that is causing excess heat such as running the engine lean.
I have run my Model T in Independence day parades without the slightest indication of overheating, with a completely stock system. No thermostat, water pump, etc.
It is possible.
Yeah, ditto what Harold and Dan said, and when you order your new radiator, make sure it's a flat-tube. That's all you need. No other modern contrivances. I'm off to a 4th parade this weekend. Bone stock, except for a flat-tube radiator.
Thank You and I both understand and appreciate your purest perspectives. Nothing I ever do will harm a car because I always make sure it is reversible.
Years ago the Porsche club criticize me for "mixing years" to create what some of them called "FrankenPorsches" but all of my modifications had a purpose and were reversible. Now that is a very popular trend. I cannot take credit for starting it because I never gained much momentum and they even tried to disqualify me from some track events. My car is all went on to be sold to purists who never saw a difference because I managed each car with care.
My car has no overheating problem but the inherent platter of the blower fan pulley seems to have no resolution. I started a different thread because I understand many people will not want to participate in modification conversations.
Err.. Clatter of the lower fan pulley... Sorry and Thank You
Don't worry. My car will be as pure as yours when next it is sold.
Chris - With all due respect, this has nothing to do with being a "purist". We're only trying to inform you that things like electric fans and thermostats are of absolutely no benefit and add more failure points which decrease reliability.
I have a saying "What man can make, man can fix." I suggest fixing the actual root of the problem instead of making tangential modifications.
I put an electric fan on our race car. Also an electric water pump, so no power is lost to the belt. For your stock T a better way to go would be to get a new aluminum pulley that clamps down on a worn crank to prevent noise. Then make sure your radiator is good and fan in good shape too.
. This should get the purists in a tizzy
Chris for about $50 you can solve the loose pulley problem. The compression type aluminum one is readily available from multiple vendors and is fairly easy to install. So to be kind, it is your car and you can do anything you want to with it however many of the issues you are concerned with are solved by having good period style components. Many of the posters here are not trying to ridicule some of your ideas though it may seem like it but rather to let you know that with good reproduction and period components there's no need to add anything that changes the general operation or outward appearance. Now I say that with a little hesitation because I run aluminum pistons, higher lift performing cam and many other things internally that doesn't change the overall appearance outwardly but does improve the performance, safety and longevity of the model T internally.
I appreciate you being pedal to the metal enthusiastic, don't lose that, in this case just hearing some of the contributors out before rushing into an unwarranted change. In most cases they are not obtuse, the reaction is from love of the simplicity of the model T and not in response to perceived stupidity. Let them help you on your journey, they have as an aggregate centuries of experience. Good luck.
Chris, the only place I use an electric fan on my 25 Fordor is on the air conditioning condenser, and that is mounted under the car. My crank pulley runs the air conditioner compressor and the 12V alternator. I have an oil pump in the generator hole to pressurize the mains on my A crank. There, that make you feel better? OH, I also have an electric oil pump to bring up the oil pressure before I start the car with a 12V starter. My 23 runabout is "pure". Whatever" floats your boat". Did I mention the disc brakes on the 25?
I agree that a good radiator is indispensable.
Maybe if you could find a fan that would run on the magneto you may get some points. Anyway, most who are familiar with model T's will tell you the farther you go from stock the less reliable it will be. I have have driven very original stock cars thousands of trouble free miles. At the other extreme, my race car goes about 20 hair raising miles on average between major repairs. Most of my cars are somewhere in between, closer to stock. I am a fan of improved heads, cams, and cranks.
Thank You for suggesting that an aluminum replacement to the lower pulley will solve the noise problem. The previous posts suggested not to rely on aftermarket solutions. I have zero interest in a water pump at this point, if that helps explain my perspective .
I have a fleet of modern stretch limousines and party buses that have a hard enough time sitting in the 96° sunshine waiting for brides. The stock fan does not even have a shroud, so I know it's not pulling very much CFM through the radiator when the car is sitting still.
We can never have a clattering or broken down vehicle in front of a wedding, so I am quick to jump to consider commercial level upgrades rather than slowly trying a series of smaller steps, and I very much like the sound of simply replacing the bad part if that will work.
As somebody more important than me must have once said, "I've never met a car I didn't like."
Here is Derek Kiefer's new fan set up. The only drawback is that it requires a very long extension cord.
Hal, brakes depend on the car. All of my T cars and trucks have auxiliary brakes of some kind. I use the "Rocky Mountain" repro brakes which are a copy of the old AC brakes. These are used in conjunction with the tranny brake as a backup in case I have an emergency going backward, just stab the pedal to the floor. My TT dump truck has an original set of brakes, very complicated and robust, self energizing and effective in either direction but no name anywhere. The T race car must have four wheel brakes because of FAST rules. It races in the unlimited class and is insanely quick. We use a Ford Pinto rear end and its hydraulic drum brakes. In the front we are using Wilwood disc brakes on Saturn rotors adapted to the T front end using MG hubs and wire wheels. The front axle has twin links to the frame to handle the brake torque, and no drop. It stops almost as well as it accelerates.
Erik, Lets do coffee or something on one of your trips down this way. My T shop is part of Hal's Auto Care, now run by my son Mike.
Erik have you got eight plugs or dual points? Just curious someday I may want to try and beat you up a hill.
Dual plug Gemsa head, Nissan Z distributor in Bosch plate.
We will be racing in Utah in a couple weeks. Why? We built the car to beat the model A guys on their own turf. None of them took model T's seriously until we showed them we can run with the fastest A's. A couple of them are a little grumpy about it.
Chris, I am not trying to preach, you asked for a picture and here is one, enjoy. The only time I use it is when standing still at a seven way traffic signal with a long wait for my light to turn green. I use a manual switch and as I said I only turn on the switch when stopped and I don't answer a question with a lesson in protocol.
Thank You very much! It looks like the same 12v fan I might try. I'm told it won't last long on my 6v system but it will be a proof of concept.