Is there a thread on spin pouring on T rods?

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration
Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: Is there a thread on spin pouring on T rods?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Tuesday, August 30, 2016 - 11:37 am:

Trying to learn how spin pouring Babbitt is done.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Tuesday, August 30, 2016 - 12:10 pm:

A Google search for "spin pouring mtfca" revealed these hits:

https://www.google.com/#q=spin+pouring+mtfca


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Barrett in Auburn Ca. on Tuesday, August 30, 2016 - 10:06 pm:

Paul, we spin pour rods at 1300 RPM. Check out the 2011 thread for photos. Much harder to do, but results in a superior bearing. PM me if we can help
Erik


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Adam Doleshal on Wednesday, August 31, 2016 - 12:06 pm:

I investigated into "spin pouring" babbitt several years ago. One of the important points I found is that among modern industrial companies who specialize in babbitting, there is a formula which considers width, diameter, eventual thickness of the babbitt casting, and a couple other factors. The formula determines the ideal r.p.m. and that ideal speed is plus or minus 30 r.p.m. If the speed is too low, you can have potential issues in the casting such as poor bond, porosity, cold-shuts, etc. If the speed is too high you end up with a poor-quality, weak bearing because the constituent parts of the alloy that give the babbitt bearing its durability have a tendency to segregate to the top surface where they are generally removed during final machining.

As far as determining if a bonded bearing is properly bonded to the shell, the modern, industrial method is to perform an ultrasonic test. This can be done on each and every bearing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie Spokane, WA on Wednesday, August 31, 2016 - 04:46 pm:

In the Montana 500 there have been folks who ran spun poured bearings. They have often failed even with plenty of oil. Our static cast rods almost never go out, unless they are run out of oil. So, in my opinion, either spin casting is not so great, or someone doesn't know how to do it right.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting, Clare, Iowa on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 12:24 am:

99% of people, including most Babbitters wouldn't know a spun poured rod if they were looking at one.

All the rebabbitters I know don't have a Spinner to do any, or would know how.

I do know venders that have advertised rods as spun, but they are not.

The last new rod castings that were spun poured, had lead Babbitt, and were made in the late 70's, and early 80's, but they are no longer in business.

Herm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Erik Barrett in Auburn Ca. on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 02:11 am:

OK so l will share what we have learned from experience and also input from Herm and others. Pouring babbit bearings is an art, and temperature and timing are paramount to success. Pouring the bearing is where the game is won or lost. You can pour a bad bearing and it will machine just beautifully, and fail just as impressively. It is all about the chemical bond of the bearing to the rod, cap, or main cap. This rule is the same no matter if you are spinning or static pouring, so a rod that fails will do so either way. Adam, your research is good. We pour rods at the lowest RPM possible to prevent the constituent elements of the babbit from settling out in the process. You must agree that a model T rod is about the smallest bearing you can pour in a centrifugal mold. Also, any babbit bearing benefits from chilling as rapidly as possible after pouring to prevent the same separation of the alloy's elements from happening. We use water jets to cool the fixtures even as they are just finishing pouring in case here are leaks that can be chilled before the bearing pours out on the floor.
Adam, Herm and I know how to determine if a bearing is properly bonded. I agree ultrasonic testing would be better but who has that capability and equipment? Respectfully, Erik


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 10:26 am:

It appears to me that spin pouring has more issues then I care to get into.

I have confidence in Tom Carnegie so will check into his static poured rods.

Thanks for information on this subject to all who posted.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 10:34 am:

Herm,

Don't you spin pour rods? It seems you made a posting, with photos, some time back didn't you?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting, Clare, Iowa on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 01:04 pm:

We spin many bearings, such as all cam bearings, 216 Chevy rods, electrical bearings, and others.

Model T's, we have spun over 33,000, and even more Model A's, and about 25% of that for Model B's.

We do Model T rods for the engines we build now, but we jig them, and the hi cost comes from the pre machining, so the Babbitt won't leak.

We true the thrust side, and true the rod bores.



Spun poured cam bearings 023.jpg Spun poured cam bearings 025.jpg Spun poured cam bearings 027.jpg Spun poured cam bearings 029.jpg Spun poured cam bearings 030.jpg Model T, Pre-Maching Rods For Pouring. 015.jpg Model T, Pre-Maching Rods For Pouring. 034.jpg Model T, Pre-Maching Rods For Pouring. 044.jpg Model T, Pre-Maching Rods For Pouring. 058.jpg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting, Clare, Iowa on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 01:05 pm:

We spin many bearings, such as all cam bearings, 216 Chevy rods, electrical bearings, and others.

Model T's, we have spun over 33,000, and even more Model A's, and about 25% of that for Model B's.

We do Model T rods for the engines we build now, but we jig them, and the hi cost comes from the pre machining, so the Babbitt won't leak.

We true the thrust side, and true the rod bores.




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting, Clare, Iowa on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 01:06 pm:

We spin many bearings, such as all cam bearings, 216 Chevy rods, electrical bearings, and others.

Model T's, we have spun over 33,000, and even more Model A's, and about 25% of that for Model B's.

We do Model T rods for the engines we build now, but we jig them, and the hi cost comes from the pre machining, so the Babbitt won't leak.

We true the thrust side, and true the rod bores.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Thursday, September 01, 2016 - 05:26 pm:

Erik spin pours rods; has spent considerable time researching and creating his fixture, and working out the "bugs" in the systems.


Add a Message


This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Username:  
Password:

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration