Model T PVC Valve

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: Model T PVC Valve
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kirk on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:20 pm:

Having smoke come out of the tail pipe is bad enough but I hate seeing it come from under the hood so I put this together and it helps with the smoke.

pvcpvc


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Doolittle on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:29 pm:

It seems that set-up might rob some of the vacuum that is needed to deliver gas to the intake valves. I could be wrong.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Seth in Alabama on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:30 pm:

That's a neat little setup. But, if you have enough smoke coming from the oil breather cap that you can actually see it, something is wrong and needs attention.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:33 pm:

Peter,
You need a piston, ring and cylinder job.

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kirk on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:35 pm:

The reason for the smoke is being addressed in another thread.

There is a slight change in the engine. I think the pvc valve controls how much vacuum there is. It's not a straight open line.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kirk on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:37 pm:

Andre, check out the thread titled

"Compression good but burning oil is it the valves"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 01:54 pm:

Years ago I ran a PCV (positive crankcase ventilation) valve on Rusty for a while. I can't remember why right now, but I remember pulling it off when doing engine work later and it is still on the shelf.

I don't see a PCV valve doing anything on most model t cars as they vent out the oil cap (you did plug yours),the throttle hole and between #2 & #3 cylinders and in the valve cover. It actually did something on my 1927 since I sealed the oil cap, have a valve cover without throttle rod hole (late 1927 part)and the #2 - #3 web is intact.

TH


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kirk on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 03:56 pm:

PCV not PVC

That's the problem when you're thinking about valves, piston rings, oil leaks, float settings, band adjustment, brakes, blue smoke, white smoke, flat tires, bad tubes, good tubes and every other thing that can go wrong plus a Ford Explorer that's leaking fluid like crazy

You say PVC instead of PCV at least it makes a good excuse


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 05:12 pm:


Dean Yoder runs his into the air filter and uses the manifold for something more important.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George John Drobnock on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 05:21 pm:

If your car survived two World Wars, economic down turns, multiple changes in fuel, and is now in its golden years and is smoking - there are no concealable problem. Why when new they all did that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Warren on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 09:19 am:

My car use to smoke out the breather and was very noticeable waiting at the traffic lights, I stopped getting on the brakes so hard and most of the smoke went away.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kirk on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 12:27 pm:

George, it's called having fun, trying new things, experimenting and just because we can.

Maybe Henry would have added a PCV to the car, better brakes and all the modern things we have today if he could. Some of it was because they didn't know and he wanted to keep the cost down.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Hoshield; Oak Park MI on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 12:39 pm:

Steve.... is that a horn or whistle? Cool, either way!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George John Drobnock on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 12:57 pm:

If you haven't looked may I reference you to my post called - Model T Ford PVC Valve part two

Look at the attached large drawing from a patent dated 1918/1919. It is showing an out line of the Ford T engine and a crankcase breather as being discussed.


In 1950 Fram Filters brought out a positive crank case blower and filter. My father modified one for his 120 Packard sedan to force engine vapours from the crank case into the air filter and eliminate the normal blow by. Those of a certain age will remember that motors of a certain age had a oil filler tube that was vented and the crank case has a "road" tube to eliminate vapour from the crankcase to the side of the engine and down to the road. The blower and filter purged the crank case and forced oil vapour into the oil bath air cleaner.

Thus eliminating the smell or hot oil from inside the passenger compartment.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Hagerty on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 04:10 pm:

Dennis,
Those are commonly referred to as Hollywood Wolf Whistles. They operate on vacuum. I have one a friend gave me. Thought it would be fun on the T but, I can't bring myself to drill a hole in the manifold! I'm just stubborn that way! I have played with a little bit of air pressure and it will work also but, they aren't intended for use that way. You can Google "Wolf Whistle" for a couple demos to hear what they sound like. Fun toy for us who are still "Kids at Heart"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris Laughary on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 06:40 pm:

PCV is said to be the system that increased engine longevity to 100,000 miles.

Good project!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan Danbury, WI on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 06:50 pm:

Chris, where did you get that from?? I remember when PCV's became mandatory and I don't remember cars running any more miles than before with straight crankcase breathers. What made cars run for more miles was unleaded gas, CNC machining, and better lubricants. Fewer deposits and vehicle folding tighter tolerances along with superior lubrication get the credit for that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 07:33 pm:

Kevin
I think the biggest increase in engine life is the result of;
1. Electronic high voltage ignition
BUT more importantly
2. EFI. No more washing down the cylinder walls with too rich of a mixture from poorly adjusted and poorly functioning choke systems during cold starts. Add to that, no more excessively rich mixtures from over use of "accelerator pumps"
3. Significant improvements in motor oils


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan Danbury, WI on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 08:17 pm:

Les, I'm sure all those things contributed to engine longevity in their own way. However, Japanese imports were slow to adopt either, and managed to have excellent engine longevity with point distributors and carbs. I wonder what the next evolution of the internal combustion engine will bring? 40 plus years ago, if someone told me my little 3.5L twin turbo in my F150 was going to be capable of kicking out 365 hp, I would have questioned what they were smoking. Thank goodness my Model T stays pretty much the same...and understandable.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed Baudoux Grayling Michigan on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 09:24 pm:

Speaking of engine longevity, the need for a "valve job" has all but disappeared due to the advancements. In 1971, Dad bought a new exhaust pipe bending machine for his shop, and paid for it doing valve jobs on Chevy Sixes.
I am considering some kind of crankcase vent system on the Fordor. The Wife doesn't like to ride in it because of the smell of the engine fumes.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chadwick Azevedo on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 09:52 pm:

Kevin,
The next evolution will be double or triple acting internal combustion engines.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 09:58 pm:

Chad
Are you talking about a "rehash" of the old Fairbanks submarine engines?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chadwick Azevedo on Saturday, September 24, 2016 - 10:29 pm:

Had to look it up but yup that would be double acting. Triple would involve a plate that moved between the 2 pistons and 2 combustion chambers if memory serves. Not a new idea but an application of an older idea that is forgotten. Just my guess as to the next "new" thing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Art Wilson on Sunday, September 25, 2016 - 12:09 am:

I read that the major reason for the increase in engine life is due to having better air cleaners.
They remove the very fine particles that mix with the oil film on the cylinder walls forming a lapping compound which wears out the rings and cylinders.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith, Lomita, California on Sunday, September 25, 2016 - 12:13 pm:

Milt Webb tried that on the 2008 run to Dearborn from LA, and darn near ruined his engine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George John Drobnock on Sunday, September 25, 2016 - 02:10 pm:

Two other things to consider:

1. The pistons create combustion in the cylinder head. They also create a small pressure in the crank case. This results in blow-by. If the piston rings are weak, oil vapour will be sucked into the compression cylinder and result in burning oil.

2. Another factor in longer engine life are paved roads. With the beginning of improved and paved highways dust was eliminated, not completely but sufficient enough that air cleaners could last 10,000 miles rather than every day.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Noel D. Chicoine, MD, Pierre, SD on Sunday, September 25, 2016 - 03:44 pm:

I had heard that one of the things leading to engine life was less pressure on rings thus less cylinder scuffing and wear. Also better oils and the things mentioned above.


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