OT - But involves Richmond IN

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: OT - But involves Richmond IN
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 09:21 am:

The Netherlands Embassy posted this link on Facebook:

http://nlintheusa.com/storm-eindhoven/

By clicking on "Progress of STORM" and going to Day 67 (October 20th) you can see the estimated arrival in Richmond and the departure the next morning.

https://www.storm-eindhoven.com/World_Tour_2016/schedule/day-67-october-20-2016

This is probably as far from Model Ts as you can get, but if it were coming through St. Louis, I'd go see it. Those of you in and around Richmond may find it interesting.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 09:36 am:

A coal fired motorcycle is neither sustainable nor innovative.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 09:48 am:

Royce, you call to mind the apocryphal story about Charles H. Duell. God forfend we should experiment with new technologies!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marv Konrad (Green Bay Area) on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 12:19 pm:

Dick, you need to be nice. (Even IF the T's happen to have a water pump!)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 12:42 pm:

C'mon, Marv... I was nice. I shared something that I thought might be of interest and dutifully flagged it as "off topic" for the benefit of those who don't want to read non-T posts. My response was a grumpy reaction from the forum's resident wet blanket. :-)

In fact, I suspect that Royce and I are pretty much on the same page when it comes to the current anti-fossil fuel fanaticism that is all the rage in certain circles these days. That said, I think that a bunch of students at a technical university who are experimenting with current and potentially new technologies should be encouraged. Who knows what they may come up with?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 01:03 pm:

I like the looks of it!! The actual beauty of the thing is people are thinking! Please keep up the good work Dick!! Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marv Konrad (Green Bay Area) on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 01:43 pm:

Dick, Bud, Royce.... So "Why?" do so many get so bent out of shape when someone inserts their own ideas for their T's? (Color, chrome vs. nickel, as examples.) Our grandkids are much more tech-savvy than we'll probably ever be, but different viewpoints help to expand our knowledge, don't they? BTW, I like the looks of the bike, too!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 04:58 pm:

Marv,I like a brass model T painted red but Grandmaw say's no!! On the other hand red would probably keep me out of the OCF but after 102 years i own it not Ford!! Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marv Konrad (Green Bay Area) on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 05:13 pm:

Hey, Bud!
YOU own it!! 'Zactly' what I've been saying.... We are fortunate there's an abundance of knowledgeable people willing to share!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 07:10 pm:

It's much like the Tesla or Solyndra I suspect. Big government grant pays for "new" technology and subsidizes production at taxpayer expense. When the subsidies end, the company goes out of business and a few fat cat politician's buddies get richer while the taxpayers get the shaft.

Tesla is averaging a $4000 loss per vehicle before taxes and subsidies. You can't make up for that through volume.

Electric vehicles, like "hydrogen powered" vehicles, are not new technology and don't preserve the environment.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 07:39 pm:

Royce, it's the Dutch government and Dutch taxpayers and I can't recall any "fat cat" politicians in Holland. It's engineering students experimenting with technology. Your wallet is safe.... :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 07:43 pm:

Ok so they are here in the USA why? To promote their idea. To make money.

I don't believe for a minute that Dutch politicians are any different than Russian, or British, or American politicians. After a brief time in office they suddenly have more money despite no apparent source of income.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Walker on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 08:00 pm:

Yes, Royce, using the force of law to define winners and losers is not good for America. Sadly, we've been tortured by the political animals for a long, long time. Will it ever end?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 08:35 pm:

Hey, Royce, what do I know about Holland? I only lived there for almost nine years and represented the country in St. Louis for 29. Royce's Universal Law of Political Venality trumps any experience I might have. :-)

For the record, not every government operates like the Obama Administration, and personal enrichment is not the goal everywhere. (Here, yes. Everywhere, no.) Believe what you want to believe. I will try to find out when they are passing through St Louis on their way to Richmond and try to meet them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Thursday, October 06, 2016 - 09:15 pm:

Dick,

Thank you so much for the heads up. I think this might be a great opportunity to have some photos of the STORM taken at the Model T Ford Museum next to some of the Ts. Or maybe drive a T down to where the bike will be and take photos there. I plan to send a note to Susan Yaeger our club's Executive Director who is in that area.


I looked for, but I could not find the list I have seen of the things that were said by various people that turned out to be way off base with the passing of time.

A couple that come to mind:

Aug. 17, 1807: ‘Fulton’s Folly’ Steams up the Hudson – the first commercial use of a steam boat. And it led to others that helped move the world forward in ship transportation. [ https://www.wired.com/2011/08/0817robert-fulton-steamship-fultons-folly-hudson/ ]

Concerning the early automobiles, “It will never replace a good horse!”

Concerning the early airplane, “If God wanted man to fly He would have given him wings!”

English philosopher C. E. M. Joad could not bring himself to see real human motorists as anything less than mortal threats to all civilized refinement. In a 1927 book (whose subject was, significantly, the pernicious influence of everything American) he came straight to the point: “motoring is one of the most contemptible soul-destroying and devitalizing pursuits that the ill-fortune of misguided humanity has ever imposed upon its credulity.”

Many new ideas have been met with skepticism in the past. And while many of the ideas may have failed to be financially practical, many others went on to change the world.

Someone once had an idea:

"I will build a motor car for the great multitude...constructed of the best materials, by the best men to be hired, after the simplest designs that modern engineering can devise...so low in price that no man making a good salary will be unable to own one-and enjoy with his family the blessing of hours of pleasure in God's great open spaces." And I'm glad he did.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jesse L. Ashcraft on Friday, October 07, 2016 - 11:57 am:

>>>A coal fired motorcycle is neither sustainable nor innovative.<<<

The vehicle is only one leg of the triad. Charging your bike or car from solar panels on your house is another and having a modern electrical grid is the third leg. My understanding is that in Germany, some businesses (which also have panels on the roof) offer a place to charge up your car while at work where the employee's cars doubles as a battery sink for the business. Win-win. I think we need to cut off the fossil fuel industry from our taxpayer subsidies and start vectoring money to fuels that will never run out and don't pollute ie solar, wind, biomass, geo-thermal, etc. The health care costs alone saved from not breathing burnt carbon all the time makes it worthwhile not to mention fossil fuels gets more and more expensive and dangerous as the sources dry up.





(Message edited by jesselashcraft on October 07, 2016)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Friday, October 07, 2016 - 12:07 pm:

I really like wind because every quarter i get a check!! Bud in the Wheeler Wind farm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jesse L. Ashcraft on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 09:46 am:

Tell us about that, Bud. Are you leasing your property or did you invest in some windmills?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 10:05 am:

Quoting Jesse L Ashcraft ". I think we need to cut off the fossil fuel industry from our taxpayer subsidies and start vectoring money to fuels that will never run out and don't pollute ie solar, wind, biomass, geo-thermal, etc. The health care costs alone saved from not breathing burnt carbon all the time makes it worthwhile not to mention fossil fuels gets more and more expensive and dangerous as the sources dry up." End of Marxist quote from Jesse L Ashcraft

Wow, that sure sounds like typical Marxist pandering. Take money away from honest businessmen and give it to companies that could not make a profit because they have a business model that makes no sense. A real nighmare, something that could only happen in a place where there was no law and no United States constitution.

Let's bear in mind that oil companies do not receive federal "subsidies". In fact oil companies collect and pay more federal taxes than any other group of industries. What you are saying is straight from liberal manifesto speak, a set of talking points made from whole cloth, none of it real.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 10:13 am:

Jessie,No political BS sent in a private E mail! Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kenneth W DeLong on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 10:30 am:

My long retired Brother In Law Ron Told me when Saint RR was elected he promised to reduce the size of the Federal Govt! Ron was one of the Head Accountant's for Marathon Oil in Findly,Ohio and he told me who saint RR got ride of in the Federal Govt! He said saint RR got rid of the Federal Auditor's who's job it was to keep track of/report the amount of Royalties payed to the Federal Govt by the Oil Company's!!!! He said the Oil Company's had a heck of a time trying to find out how much to pay The Federal Govt!!!!!! Which is US, Bud.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By JohnCodman on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 10:35 am:

I don't want to politicize this, but since my T runs on gasoline, I think that writing about oil companies is fair game. I do own a little Exxon Mobil stock (wish I had a lot more), and I usually do read their annual report. I don't recall reading in the income statement any line item that said "subsidy from federal government". As I recall, Exxon Mobil is the largest single taxpayer in the United States. Having said that, basic economics says that no corporation involved in an ongoing business pays any taxes at all. All taxes are passed along to the end user of the corporation's products as a cost of goods sold. To repeat -economics rule one is that all taxes are paid by the end user.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chadwick Azevedo on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 11:00 am:

Its about greed plain and simple. If it was REALLY about "free" energy we would be seeing a boom in the "free" energy we have been making use of fo over a century, hydroelectric. This energy is proven and works so why are we messing around with solar and wind? In my mind the answer is simple, people and companies can get money "given" to them to research develop and build it. Lets go back a century to a Baker electric car being powered from say a city grid receiving its power from Niagra falls. We had "free" clean power for cars a century ago so why are we spending billions now instead of investing in systems we know work?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Semprez-Templeton, CA on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 11:35 am:

The problem is that there is not enough hydro power to go around. Therefore most of the "clean" electric vehicles are powered by coal and petroleum powered plants, as Royce pointed out.

You will also see that electric cars are now called "Emission free" which is a half truth, (aka half lie!)

A few years ago I worked for EPRI (Electric Power Institute) where we looked at the issues associated with electric powered vehicles. One major problem are the losses in the power distribution grid. A gallon of fuel burned in an efficient internal combustion engine will take you farther than a gallon of fuel burned in an electric utility power plant. Federal and local road taxes, fees and fines, make the cost of motor fuel to the consumer unrealistically high. If the same rebates and incentives were applied to motor fuel, the true cost to drive your IC car would be far less than an electric vehicle of the same capability.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chadwick Azevedo on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 11:53 am:

I would disagree with there not being enough hydro electric power in that I am thinking potential not what is current. True there are only so many rivers and flow can be seasonal but what about tidal? I remember a number of years back a fuel station actually posted the price of taxes per gallon at the pump on a small car that you could see while pumping. If memory serves it was about 2/3 the cost of the fuel!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jesse L. Ashcraft on Saturday, October 08, 2016 - 12:18 pm:

>>>End of Marxist quote from Jesse L Ashcraft<<<

Good grief. It would be cheaper in the long run. I thought conservatives were all about saving money.

link here


(Message edited by jesselashcraft on October 08, 2016)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 20, 2016 - 04:21 pm:

I went down to McDonnell-Douglas Hall at St. Louis University today to see the Dutch electric motorcycle and the students from Eindhoven Technical University who built it and are on an 80-day trip around the world with it. They were here for about a half hour and then continued on to Richmond (where I assume they will be arriving any time now, if they're not already there).



Arrival. Heading into McDonnell-Douglas Hall.




Slide in the lobby of the building.




The bike in the lobby.




My successor as Dutch honorary consul in St. Louis, Roel Harryvan, sitting on the bike with the Dutch students behind it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Thursday, October 20, 2016 - 04:25 pm:

Royce,

Does anything good ever happen anywhere?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 20, 2016 - 04:30 pm:

P.S. For those of you in Richmond. This is where they will be:

18.30-19.00: STORM presents motorcycle at innovation center Richmond. This event is also accessible to the public: Innovation Center, 814 East Main Street – Richmond IN 47374.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dick Lodge - St Louis MO on Thursday, October 20, 2016 - 08:27 pm:

Did anyone see it in Richmond?


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