Thinking about ordering a radiator hose kit for my'21. The catalog states "not for cars with waterpump". I think my waterpump outlet is the same length as the original outlet. I don't have an original outlet to compare to. Is it likely that the length is the same?
Well there is this solution.
It depends on what water pump you are using. Most water pumps use the same hoses as a non water pump T does. However, many of them require that the metal tube between the two lower hoses be shortened some. How much they need to be shortened depends on the pump used.
Do you have a pipe now? Is it corrosion free? Then just order the hoses. If you cut a new pipe you lose the ridge that helps keep it from leaking. So the other solution would be to eliminate the metal pipe and use one piece of hose from the water pump to the radiator which you could get from your local auto parts retailer.
If you aspire to maintain an original appearance, the local parts dealer probably won't be of much use. He is very unlikely to have the correct red hose.
I like the original hoses they look great on model T s and A s. Parts houses don't have those same hoses. Tim
Though I'm not worried about being original, I like the red hoses. And, my pump doesn't say Polar Bear on it, actually I see no markings on it, but I think it would take the same length pipe as the one in George's picture , give or take an inch. With so little pressure on the system , can I use a piece of pipe without ridges and just clamp it good and tight?
Personally, I don't cut nice original pipes, too hard to come by original nice ones. Many originals already have a rotted off end, so they often are perfect to be cut. A little Permatex Form-a-gasket around the cut end usually seals them okay. A brazed bead is easy enough to make if you want more assurance.
Being a borderline purist, I like to use hose clamps that look similar to the original Ford ones. But they don't work as well as the modern clamps (especially some of the flimsy repros!). What I usually do, is assemble everything, with whatever amount of Permatex I deem appropriate. Then I clamp everything together using modern worm gear hose clamps, good and tight. I leave those clamps on for awhile (depending on how much I drive it, a few days or a few weeks, till set). After which, I remove the modern clamps, and replace them with vintage looking clamps, just good and snug.
Another silly cheapskate thing? I have painted radiator hoses with red spray can paint. The really silly thing about it? People that did not know have complimented me about how good the engine looked with red hoses.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2
I have never been able to get those red hoses to stay sealed. Last spring I had the whole front end torn off so I cleaned everything up and put red permatex on the inside of the hoses and still they seep.
Troy, if you are using the original style hose clamps that could be your problem. I stopped using them on my V8s also and use the style George is using.
First of all what you need for comparison is the inlet, not the outlet! Second, I believe Langs had standard pipes, and shorter ones for waterpumps. I'm with Wayne on the pipes. Originals are darn hard to find, but I have some. They have the Ford script on them. I have a nos late exhaust pipe that also has the Ford script, about every 18".
Be careful when using worm screw hose clamps as pictured above. "All stainless" and some of those with plain steel screws are not vibration proof and will loosen up when you are running. How do I know!!!
I did use original style clamps. I think I'm going to go with the modern style ones. This leaking antifreeze is annoying and messy.
I too use band clamps tightened up snugly to stop the leaks. I drive my T a lot. About mid season I take the band clamps off and put the "original" type on. Since the system is not under pressure they don't leak because the original type red hoses are stuck then rather firmly on the metal housings and tube. The band clamp and the original type clamp will both fit snugly in the groove in the rubber.
In the above pictured water pump installation there is a glaring error in the routing of the timer rod. It should pass under the metal tube on its way to the timer. It should NOT pass under any part of the hose or clamp so if it does then shorten that lower hose until the timer rod passes only under the metal tube and start with a new timer rod. To set the timing you only need to increase or decrease the radius of the ARC in the rod at the timer end. Simply squeeze the arc closed a bit to advance the timing or stretch it apart a bit to retard the timing. DO NOT bend the other end and you will find you then have all the timing range you need for your T. If you have an outside oiler in the way - bend the oil line out of the way of the timer rod - NOT the other way around. Once you begin to bend the wrong end of the timer rod you will find nothing fits right and the timer rod is interfered with. I have seen some really "snaky" timer rods on some T's.
To stay with Mr. Sheldon's cheapskate theme, just cut a piece of schedule 40 pvc pipe to any length you need. Safe for the temperature, radiator is cool or only slightly warm at the bottom. Paint it black to look original.
I had one small leak on one end of my lower hose, so I did what John Regan suggested - I installed a screw type clamp in that location and tightened it down till the leak stopped, drove it like that for a month or so, then replaced the screw clamp with the stock clamp - no more leak!
To go along with Mr. Sheldon's cheapskate theme, just cut apiece of schedule 40 pvc pipe to any length you need. Safe for the temperature, the water will be cool or slightly warm. Paint it black to look original.
I don't know what happened. My first post disappeared as did Mr. Regan's. I retyped mine and when I posted it his and had both returned. Swine computer.
Personally I would not use PVC pipe. As the water temp approaches 200 deg. it will shrink.
Don't think I'd go for PVC either. I've used a wrap of teflon tape on a steel pipe with no lip or bump at the ends and that worked fine.The car had the org. type clamps on it. No pump. The orig. clamps seemed OK on the outlets with the lip but the pipe without them leaked a bit. Started out with a swipe of silicone on all fittings. Good on all but the pipe.
John, speaking from experience, it'll work fine. The water may be 200 or more going into the radiator but not at the bottom. Put your hand on the inlet pipe after your car has run a while. Cool or slightly warm. Plenty safe for pvc. But as always, everybody to his own kick.
I cut about two inches off my pipe to install the water pump. It was not original but a length of stainless welded tubing. The pump leaked through the shaft seal and left dirty rust marks on the red hose. Disgusting and the pump is sort of useless anyhow. I knew I could buy another length of stainless tubing but they would only sell pipe in 40 foot lengths. I then figured that even with 2 inches missing, the hoses were long enough to go back to the standard outlet and still use the shorter pipe. I sold the car before I could do this and the new owner really thought the water pump was great.
My dad ran a straight pipe without lips for years on his '17 with no problems. Of course the red hoses he had were purchased and installed in 1950 were either NOS or current production at that time so no problems with those.
Original Ford pipes with lips are heavier, far superior and, if you run straight water, last much longer than the reproductions. Even a used one in good condition is better than the reproduction in my opinion.
I had to use the modern clamps on my model A coupe but i drive it alot. I noticed the other day the new hoses i just bought this summer and put on my 29 sedan are already look to be cracking like they were old from sitting on the shelf or something!! I guess i will order another set but from Bratton's this time i think they sell a lot more and maybe keep their stock rotated out quicker... Maybe!