Shifting Warford Transmission

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: Shifting Warford Transmission
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George schmidt on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 11:29 am:

I obtained this Warford 920-1 three speed Transmission and have a question on how it should shift.
Per the attached photos, once the shaft is in place, shouldn't it move forward and backwards, like a regular Transmission to move between gears. I took off the inspection cover and the forks are in place but seems to be frozen in place. After removing the forks, the gears do slide back and forth, as designed.
Any suggestions on what is wrong or if I'm doing something wrong.

Thanks
George WarfordWarford


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 12:08 pm:

First off you are missing a part. There is a cupped washer that fits under the cover that holds the spring down. The teeth have to be lined up to shift. At the back of the cover where the cotter pins go thru, there is a plug, spring and ball bearing on each side then between the two shift rails there is another ball. If you are trying to move both rails at the same time the ball between the two will not allow that. I would start off by pulling everything down on the cover to check and lube. If the balls need replacing, they should be a standard off the shelf size. I think they are 7/16 dia. There is a pin sticking out the side of the 1/2 ball that fits in the slot on the cover, is that in place? if everything in the cover is good, then try rotating the input shaft as you shift so the gear mesh.
Are the shift forks installed correctly;


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 12:47 pm:

George, Sometimes those Warfords are hard to shift when they are just sitting on the bench. Especially when the gears are not rotated when you are trying to shift it. I would think you have already checked the shifter rods to make sure they are free. The rods have a spring loaded ball and dedent to keep them in place like Mark suggests. It's best to secure the tranny in a vise or some other way and I'm betting you'll be good. it might be possible to reverse the cover but it should be clear as mud to you. Good Luck


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 01:55 pm:

Correction, there are 2 balls between the shift rails. To get the balls and springs out, remove the cotter pins and clean the holes out. The plugs do not screw in and are just held in place with the cotter pins. Crud and paint in the holes needs to be cleaned out first. There is a small tit on the plug, it goes to the spring side.



Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim B Boyer on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 02:10 pm:

George,
I notice your shift lever has a off set, it might try to turn in the housing and cause a bind on the shift rods? Just a thought.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris Bamford, Edmonton AB on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 02:29 pm:

Hi George the front of the transmission is on the left in your second photo. You probably know this. The shifter assembly is installed correctly.

The front end of each shifter rod has a U-notch facing to the other rod. When these notches are lined up the forks are in neutral. It is possible to put the cover plate on with the forks in the wrong spot, which, when I did it, locked the sliding gears in direct drive and the shifter would not move.

Photo below is another view of the missing spring-holder cup that Mark mentioned. Also shown here is the pin Mark described that fits in the slot on the left side of the shifter tower. This keeps the shifter aligned correctly.

Gene is correct about holding the transmission securely when attempting to shift. It can be a pretty stiff action.

Shift pattern is right-and-up for underdrive, right-and-down for direct drive, left-and-down for overdrive. My 920-1 is 50% under and 25% over.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 03:06 pm:

Chris;
Thank you for posting the photo showing the "PIN". I was going to do same but had not gotten to it yet. I don't see one in his. Mine is just a little more worn then yours so will be removing it to replace. I don't think it riveted in just a press fit. You should be able to see the other end to drive out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George schmidt on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 04:23 pm:

To Mark, Gene,Jim and Chris.I found the cup washer that goes over the spring and placed in place. I will now clean out the port containing the spring and balls. I will update you with the results.
As for the offset handle, it was fabricated by the previous owner, to avoid contact when in the car. I may try to find the standard shaft

Thanks to all.
George


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Friday, December 09, 2016 - 05:47 pm:

Mark, My Alum Warford which is different, the cover only had One ball each? Wonder if lost them or why two balls?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George schmidt on Saturday, December 10, 2016 - 10:22 am:

Mark, Gene, Jim and Chris, as I stated, I found the cup washer and it's in place. Have not cleaned out the plugs or balls but have been able to shift the Transmission into all three gears. It is very difficult to move between the gears but I believe the short shaft is the main reason . I will still clean the channel out but will start looking for the original type shaft.

WarfordWarford


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris Bamford, Edmonton AB on Saturday, December 10, 2016 - 11:50 am:

George, that might be an original shifter that has been modified with the heat wrench. Mine is 15" long above the shifter tower and the threaded end is just like yours. I bet your transmission will shift pretty easy once the mechanism has been cleaned up.


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