1913 Body Pinstriping - When did it Cease Being Done?

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2016: 1913 Body Pinstriping - When did it Cease Being Done?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Benjamin Morgan - Metamora, Indiana on Saturday, December 24, 2016 - 10:22 pm:

It seems the only reference to pinstriping of the bodies on the 1913 model year, is that it stopped sometime in "early 1913". I've searched around for previous posts, but I can't seem to find any direct answer on when the pin striping ceased to be done on the bodies. Anyone have a more specific time frame than "early 1913"?

If not, what time frame are we looking at when we say "early"? In the model year or calender year sense?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Saturday, December 24, 2016 - 11:13 pm:

Ben: My '26 coupe has what appear to be remains of pinstriping on the very rusty body. I'm interested to hear the answers from the 'experts' on this topic. jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Schedler, Sacramento on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 01:03 am:

No expert here....I did this with 1/8 red inch tape




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Benjamin Morgan - Metamora, Indiana on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 01:14 am:

I'm not sure on later cars, but I'm talking about 1913 models specifically, and when they stopped with the body pinstriping.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 09:12 am:

Benji...hopefully Larry Smith will chime in, as he seems to be pretty knowledgeable in all things '13. My guess, and it's only a guess, is right about April/May they stopped? My car is April 22, and the body is striped, so hope so. Not gonna change it anyway!! Ha ha. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 09:37 am:

The car that Constantine drove toMoscow had its original paint in many areas of the body. There was no sign of any pin striping on that car. It shipped in late May / early June of 1913.

I would not hesitate to pinstripe a '13 if that's what you want to do. I bet the dealer would have done it if the buyer demanded it as part of the sale.


















Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 10:47 am:

Wheels are striped on the car in the second picture though the body isn't. ??


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith, Lomita, California on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 10:58 am:

My opinion is there was no body striping on the cars after 1912. The wheels continued to be striped into 1913. I scraped and sanded very carefully the body on my touring, and there was no indication of striping.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 11:36 am:

This is a Canadian '13. Note the horn bulb mounted on the steering column:


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Codman on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 11:55 am:

Hey Royce, You don't have to go back that far for a dealer to have a car striped for a customer. I worked at a Ford dealer from 1963-66. We had several cars striped for customers. My dad had a '59 T-Bird that he bought new and had striped (White with red stripes).


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 01:43 pm:

This last picture is interesting, most of the restored body striping I've seen on '13s, the panel top line is higher, and stripes make a little scallop around the windshield support bolt. This is the second period photo I've seen where the top line of the striping is lower and clears that bolt.

Also this photo is interesting in that it seems the body is a different color than the hood and fenders, and they appear lighter in color than the body (not black ?) maybe a trick of old time film that was not panchromatic, or maybe that old boy is showing off a snazzy newer paint job (with striping) ? It doesn't look like the wheels are striped.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rick J. Gunter -- Sparta, Missouri, USA on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 07:32 pm:

If that last photo was a Canadian car, wouldn't it have a horn on the right hand side?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Carter - South Jersey on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 07:55 pm:

That picture makes it hard to tell if it is a RHD or LHD car. But either way the Canadian cars had opening doors on both sides so the horn bulb was mounted to the column.

Royce - thanks for posting that picture - very helpful.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Val Soupios on Sunday, December 25, 2016 - 09:51 pm:

My '12 has the prestolite bottle mounted under the running board like the one in the last picture of Royce's first post. I have never seen that before in a period photo and always assumed the way it was mounted on my car was just plain wrong. Does anyone else have this set up?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Benjamin Morgan - Metamora, Indiana on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 - 12:52 am:

Hope everyone had a good weekend!

Thanks for the pics and info Royce, and Larry.

I do enjoy the pinstriping, and never thought of the dealer option.

Does anyone know if you have pinstriping on a later 13 if it takes away points in judging? Im not sure if Ill ever have it judged, but I am building it to factory, off the line, specs and with original parts. Im still curious about any change card dates or anything to further nail down a closer date, even to the month would be interesting to know.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 - 07:10 am:

You should talk with Russ Furstnow. Once you start talking about judging you are trying to make the car fit a modern perception.

If I am restoring a car I would make it match an original image or images as closely as possible, using any factory information that I could acquire. That way you can justify and document everything that you do. No judge can argue against that.

You can easily prove that most '13 T's were not pin striped originally. Proving that it was possibly done at the factory is much more difficult.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith, Lomita, California on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 - 01:10 pm:

You need to visit the Ford Archives in Dearborn. Spend a day or two. Perhaps you will come up with some new information for us!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Benjamin Morgan - Metamora, Indiana on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 - 08:43 pm:

Royce: Im 99% in this to just build an original car as it came out of the factory, not really for judging. The 1% in for judging is where my curiosity is with a few things, but I understand where your coming from. Ive been collecting alot of images, as well as looking at pics of unrestored "survivor" cars. As well as have plans to see a couple in person, just for exactly as you are describing with documentation, as well as my own education on how they were put together etc. I find it fascinating.

Were bodies delivered to ford painted, or not at the time? And if they were painted by the body makers, I wonder if pinstriping varied by the builder until it was phased out? As well as, was the pinstriping, if 'factory' done, a hold over from the 12s into the early 13s.

Larry, I actually have plans to go up there this spring. Was going to go this fall, but couldnt make it. I will probably spend several days up there scrounging through things.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 - 09:43 pm:

Benjamin, I have a '13 as well, and I'd be much obliged to know of any items of interest you discover when you visit the archives. I will likely never be in a position to do any "primary research" there, even if i was knowledgeable enough about such things to do it right, so I'm mighty grateful and appreciative of those who can manage to make the pilgrimage. Good hunting !!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 09:03 am:

Benji...from what I've read, and if my memory doesn't fail me which it usually does, I seem to recall reading where around only 5% of the bodies were painted by Ford, the rest came painted from the body builders. To that end, I do think it's more than possible they may have been striped if only per customer demand. Like Rich said, and I know you will, we'd be interested in hearing what you find out if you make it to Benson Ford. I too would like to get up there, but probably never be able to fit it in.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lenney Glenn on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 09:18 am:

The seventh photo sure has a strange looking bumper. Anyone familiar?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 10:26 am:

The bodies prior to 1915 mostly came painted by the manufacturers. As of December 1913 (1914 model year) less than 5% of touring bodies were being painted in the factory by Ford.

Pin striping was applied in the factory by Ford prior to 1913 model year (summer of 1912).


Wheels were apparently still pin striped as late as July 1913. See Acc. 833, Photo 75, Ford Archives


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 01:45 pm:

Royce, does any documentation or lore exist as to the operations of companies that supplied bodies prior to 1914 ? Is there any possibility these companies might have erratically applied striping prior to delivery to Ford ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 01:51 pm:

Rich,

I have a photo of 1913 bodies being delivered by horse drawn wagon to the Ford factory with no pinstriping, fully painted. If you search for it you can find it in the online archives at Henry Ford dot org.

Ford extensively pinstriped bodies, fenders and chassis in house from its earliest Pre - T days. As the years went by it was reduced bit by bit until only wheels were being done by mid 1913. I have never heard of anything from chassis to fenders to wheels being pinstriped by anyone other than Ford or the dealer.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Thursday, December 29, 2016 - 01:58 pm:

Thanks much, Royce. It's all just my curiosity. By the way, what information is available on the body makers ? Who all were they ? My '13 roadster has a serial number beginning with a "W", I'm told it's a "Wilson" body.

Years ago, I knew Fisher made some of the closed car bodies, but until I joined this forum, I always thought the Model Ts were all made entirely "in house". Very interesting stuff !


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