Sheared off bolt in starter shaft. Gonna try.

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Sheared off bolt in starter shaft. Gonna try.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:00 am:

I knew that was an issue during the assembly of my 26/27 engine, but didn't address it until I knew the engine ran. Now it does and now I have to.
Bolt on the Bendix to starter shaft nearest the starter was sheared off by Bubba when I got it. I want to pull the Bendix and see if I can drill out and clean up threads or tap if necessary while starter still in car. If not, I'll have to remove. And, worse case scenario is get rebuilt starter and replace.

Seems the wood firewall I installed is for a non strter car and it will not allow me to remove the starter without removing the firewall or cutting the firewall to allow access. So I'm gonna try to leave both in the car.

Any gu suggestions on how to drill out, clean up or re tap the bolt on the starter shaft?

If I need to remove the starter, do I need to drain the engine oil? The manual shows it on an engine out of the car, so I presume they had the oil out as well. I recall putting in gaskets on both sides of the starter when assembling, so oil in that area must be an issue.

Any help appreciated and prayers as well.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:04 am:

No need to drain the oil. You should be able to remove it using a reverse drill bit and an EZ - out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By ALAN FAIRCLOUGH from Houston, TEXAS on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:05 am:

no need to drain the oil. Best to remove and rebuild the starter.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:08 am:

Robert
It would help if you pointed out in this photo which starter Bendix drive bolt you are referring to.
1
You do not have to drain the engine oil to remove the starter. There are two gaskets involved. One is between the starter mountain bracket and the other for the Bendix drive cap.
The only praying required is wehn you are installing the inside Bendix cover bolt nearest the hogshead.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:20 am:

Please ignore initial meaning of post. My son put his eyes upon it and thre is one bolt that goes through the Bendix drive and has a small shaft on the end that locks into the starter shaft. This tab has broken off and I was feeling the broken end of the bolt and the short recess in the starter shaft and presuming if was sheared off.

Seems all I need now are the two bolts and the two washers with the bend up tab for the Bendix drive to starter shaft.

Think we got it sorted out. Sorry for the misleading issue. Welcome to my world!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:23 am:

Robert
The two Bendix drive spring bolts are different.
1
The bolt on the right pins the drive spring through the drive head and to the starter shaft hole shown above.
The bolt on the right pins the other spring end to the drive shaft (only) and does not go into the starter shaft.
If you remove the bolt on the right from the spring you should be able to slide the complete Bendix drive and drive head off the starter shaft, sometimes the drive head is difficult to remove first because the end of the starter shaft is burred. Ford made a tool to remove a stuck drive head.
2
After removing the drive shaft you should be able to procedure Royce pointed out above.
The two bolts are special bolts and you need to get exact duplicates for re installation.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:25 am:

Correction: The bolt on the left pins the other spring end to the drive shaft (only) and does not go into the starter shaft.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:37 am:

Robert
Be sure you get the correct Bendix spring bolts and keepers.
1
If you use the wrong bolts you take the chance of the Bendix drive forcing the Bendix cover off the hogshead.
I am sure you can imagine the results of this if not discovered soon.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 12:14 pm:

That little piece from the tab might not be any problem, but if a bolt or anything big falls into the crankcase, it could stick on the magnets and tear up your magneto or even break the gear on the flywheel. So be sure nothing falls down in there. You can also rotate the flywheel while you have the bendix cover off and inspect all the magnets to see if anything is stuck on them and remove it.

There is one part which has not been addressed in the posts above. That is a small woodruff key which is shaped like a half moon. The curved end fits into a groove in the shaft near the end of the shaft. The flat end goes in the slot in the head shown in the second picture by Ron. I like to turn the shaft so the slot is to the top and put in the key, then carefully tap the head on until the bolt hole lines up with the round hole in the starter shaft.

Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Brough on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 09:44 pm:

thanks for the tech tip on the magnets. We did rotate the engine and examine the ring gear and had two or three teeth that were chipped, Bendix looks good. We will do the same tomorrow and examine the magnets and see if my missing Rolex turns up.

Correct bolts are on the way and we are aware of the importance of the key and slot. I always try to turn my slots facing up on the hubs or any shafts that I have the option to as it makes it easier for me to insert the key.

Seems like overkill to have the key and slot as well as the tab bolt sticking down into the shaft, but the fact that it was sheared off tells me some pretty signicant torques are put on that operation.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Matthiesen on Wednesday, January 18, 2017 - 11:38 pm:

They serve two different purposes: The long pin bolt anchors the Bendix spring to the starter shaft, the woodruff key anchors the starter drive end to the starter shaft. Yes there is a lot of torque on the starter drive.


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