Magnets

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration
Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Magnets
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 01:19 pm:

Does anyone have pictures of how Henry charged magnets or did he outsource them?----If only one minuet per magnet was used there would not be enough minuets per day for the number of Ts made.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 01:28 pm:

Now that is a great, original, question! I look forward to hearing the answer also.

Maybe someone with a copy of the Ford Shops and Methods and enlighten us? :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.V. Anderson on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 01:54 pm:

The "Engineering Magazine" in 1913 printed a nice clear photo of the Ford factory magnet charger. I'd scan and post the photo but I loaned my copy six years ago to someone who has not returned it. The machine was quite large and heavy, presumably able to charge a magnet almost instantly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 02:35 pm:

I'm going to guess that it didn't just charge one magnet at a time either.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 02:44 pm:

From Ford Methods & the Ford Shops: "The fly-wheel-magneto-assembling story will not be told in full at this time." There's a photo showing workers assembling magnetos, but I didn't find anything about charging magnets. It may be in there somewhere. I didn't pore over the whole book looking for it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 02:56 pm:

Here is a photo of the double sided Ford magnet recharging work station and describing text found in the August 21, 1914 American Machinist Magazine. These articles were the basis for the book "Ford Methods and Ford Shops published by Engineering Magazine in 1915.
These magnet recharging stations would have produced approximately 10,000 Ampere/Turns per winding to provide an adequate saturation charge of the raw magnet forgings.
1
2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 02:58 pm:

The magnet recharging tool made by American Bosch to repair Ford cars was based on the Ford factory method of magnet recharging.
1


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 03:14 pm:

Yikes! The text and picture imply that each charging station (if there were more than one, you would think that there would have to be) was manned by two workers, each of which charged one magnet at a time!

Can you imagine standing there all day, six days a week, removing each magnet from the tray, setting it on the charger, flipping the switch, then replacing each magnet back in the tray? Ugh!

Thanks for the info! :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 03:48 pm:

Thanks Ron-------I guess the machine was powered by DC-----wonder what method was used to power it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Seth - Jefferson, Ohio on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 05:49 pm:

I understand that Ford used this as a power source in order to save costs when charging magnets.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 - 06:48 pm:

Paul
Certainly DC powered. That is how magnets are made.
With this type of magnet charging system one very quick flash of power application would produce a satisfactorily saturated magnet.
Saturation Magnetic core power is a function of applied Amperes times winding turns.
The last two paragraphs I posted were not applicable to magnet recharging and should have looked like this.
1


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 06:12 am:

What I meant was did he start with AC then convert to DC Like a battery charger. Or did he have a DC generator.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, mostly in Dearborn on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 06:36 am:

My bet is DC due to his affiliation with Edison.

When I started working at the Engineering Lab building in 1980, there were still DC panels and wiring in the building. They were disconnected, but the generator was still in the powerhouse next door.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, mostly in Dearborn on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 07:52 am:

This completely slipped my mind. The Highland Park plant was run off DC current. There were nine 4000kw DC generators housed in the powerhouse out front.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 10:52 am:

As Tom mentions, Highland Park made their own electricity, so they could have used any type of current they wanted.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 10:57 am:

Thanks Tom-----A good 12 volt battery puts out lots of amps, some battery chargers with power to start a car without waiting with a dead battery will put out high amperage. A welder on DC will put out more yet but I consider it dangerous.

I have a magnet in front of me while writing charged a number of years past using only 17 feet of 12 house wire and a 12 volt battery----it still will pick up an exact 4 pound paint scale weight. It was flash charged with 4 half second bumps on a vintage floor switch. Lots more amps--lots less wire turns seems to work.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Patterson-Nicholasville, Kentucky on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 11:08 am:

Paul
Measure the current and multiply it by the number of turns. A Model T Magnet needs 5000-7000 Ampere/turns to create a full saturation charge of the magnet material.
John Regan and I measured the number of turns on my Bosch Model T magnet re-charger, photo above. The right winding has 296 turns and the left has 372 turns. At 30 Amperes that equates to 8880 A/T and 11130 A/T respectively.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Todd, ............Red Deer, Alberta on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 11:41 am:

With a 12V battery I measured 332 amps going through the 24 turns of wire on a magnet, that equates to 7968 ampere turns.

Charging a magnet

(Message edited by Ken_Todd on February 02, 2017)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Vitko on Thursday, February 02, 2017 - 11:42 am:

I am an experimenter and a tester not an engineer without the tools.
What was found was by many configurations of wire winding and tested by pulling from a fixed plate not by lifting dead weight. I could not get enough weight accurately with out a kettle starting with two four pound and two two pound paint scale weights then smaller weights until the magnet pulled from the plate. I am sure your charger is top notch as your electric work.


Add a Message


This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Username:  
Password:

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration