1912 Commercial Roadster

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: 1912 Commercial Roadster
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 05:43 pm:

Does anyone out there own an original or factory correct restored 1912 Ford Commercial Roadster? I am restoring one and would really like to see pictures of the front and rear floorboards along with the placement of the brass sill plates. I would really appreciate it if you could send them to me via email to john@modelt.ca. Thanks in advance!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 05:44 pm:

I don't think an open roadster would originally have brass sill plates in 1912. That was for cars with doors.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 05:49 pm:

Do you know for sure? Helpful if so.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 05:50 pm:

I'd stil like to see if there was anything covering the rear floorboards and if they ran lengthwise so any pix are helpful!!! Thanks!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 05:53 pm:

Oh and my 1911 has sill plates in front and it doesn't have doesn't have front doors of course.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 07:16 pm:

Maybe a couple of the pictures on this eBad listing can help?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Superb-1912-Model-T-Ford-Mother-In-Law-Seat-Roadster-Bod y-Brass-Era-Pre-16-1911-/181518586693

There is at least one shot of the underside of the body.
Is this the body style you are working with?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 07:41 pm:

John, here's one pic I found in my files of my '12 Commercial Roadster Pickup. Don't know if it'll help, and don't know if the sill plates are correct or not but they look nice! This is an older pic before I got an original Heinze switch for the coil box.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Saturday, February 04, 2017 - 11:57 pm:

Thanks. If yours is a pickup then the floorboards in the rear would be covered by the pickup bed. The pics on the eBay listing, which I've been through like a fine tooth comb) don't show the front sill plates or the rear floorboards. In those pics the rear floorboards are covered with something. Not sure if that is an original covering. If it is, I'd like to know what it's made of.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 02:24 am:

John-
The body on T-bay clearly shows the checkerboard front sill plate.
-Keith


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 08:14 am:

Thanks. If yours is a pickup then the floorboards in the rear would be covered by the pickup bed. The pics on the eBay listing, which I've been through like a fine tooth comb) don't show the front sill plates or the rear floorboards. In those pics the rear floorboards are covered with something. Not sure if that is an original covering. If it is, I'd like to know what it's made of.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 09:06 am:

John, the front floorboards on my '12 are basically the same I believe as most? At least they seem to be the same as my '13 and pretty close to the '20. I recall when I had a '15 they too looked a lot alike. I can't remember what things look like under the pickup bed, I had it slid back only a little bit over a year ago when I was doing restoration work on all the fenders and aprons and such.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By WilliamThomas Forsythe on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 09:24 am:

For comparison an original/unrestored '12 Torpedo Runabout, belonging to a friend. Perhaps it was produced at the end of the '12 production run as it has '13 side and headlights!
Tom '12 Torpedo Runabout


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 09:49 am:

People have been making reproduction brass sill plates for Model T's since the mid 1950's so many of them look quite old now, probably because they are old. Someone installed a very nice set of front sill plates in my 1910 touring.

Problem is, Ford never installed brass sill plates in the front seat area in 1910. How can you call something a reproduction when originals never existed? They are almost too wide to fit the narrow 1910 front sill. I will be selling them and filling the screw holes.

Tim that checkerboard pattern was used on 1913 sill plates. I don't think it would have been used in 1912. In 1913 the touring had wide sill plates in the rear door sills, and a skinny one in the RH front door. Not sure what happened in Canada where both front doors opened.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 10:18 am:

Don't know if all bodies got the sill plates, but they are listed in the early parts book.

According the Price List of Parts, Sept. 1912.

On page 38 Body Parts- 1911-1912 Runabout

#3768 Open Runabout and Torpedo Runabout sill plate

Same part #3768 is listed on page 39 for the
1911-1912 Touring Car, Front Sill Brass plate, 1/32" x 7/8" x19"

The Rear Sill Brass plate is #3769, and its 1/32" x 1 3/4" x 14 1/8"


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 11:08 am:

Thanks Royce. I always suspected they weren't right. Now I gotta find the correct plates. Anybody got a pair for a '12 for sale?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 11:31 am:

Does it have a separate entry for the Commercial Roadster Dan? The earliest price list book I have is from 1915, so it doesn't have those part numbers on those pages.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 12:50 pm:

John

That 1912 Parts book just lists the Open Runabout and the Torpedo Runabout.

This link takes you to on-line copies of all Parts Books and other Model T data.

http://www.cimorelli.com/mtdl/mtdl_year_title_list.htm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Free on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 12:57 pm:

Thanks Dan .. now all I need is a picture. Also, all the other comments have been helpful too -- the other part of this thread was what covers the rear floorboards? In the pics on ebay posted above by Wayne, it shows some sort of material covering them. Not sure if that's original.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Sunday, February 05, 2017 - 07:38 pm:

The checkerboard sill plate came out in late 1911. Here is one the front of a 1912 touring.




These are the 7/8" x 19"


Here are the rear sill plates for the touring, oval 1-3/4" x 14-1/8"



Interestingly enough, my 1911 car used the back seat type sill plates in all three places. There is NOT a sill plate under the driver side dummy door because it does not open.



Note that at least some reproduction sill plates are a poor representation of the original. Compare this original and reproduction rear sill plates:



Be careful what you buy...

: ^ )

Keith


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Monday, February 06, 2017 - 03:28 am:

John F, I just looked again at that eBad listing. I thought before, and after looking a little closer, I still think that material over the rear floorboards is pyramid rubber mat, white. Whether it is original or not? I do not know. However, material of that type was common back in those days, and I have heard that it may have been used in the rear of some Fords. I do have my doubts of that. Rubber mats of that sort were common in the day. Many cars used them, custom made in low numbers with edging, pedal spaces, and marque logos on them. Ford used white rubber mats in the front of all body styles. All made to order. I find it a little hard to believe they would have originally used a plain white pyramid rubber mat in the back floor area of their open roadster. That, however, is just an opinion on my part.
If you choose to use it in your car? It would probably not be the only one like it. Restoration Supply in Southern Califunny has the pyramid mat, in black, or white. I imagine that it should be available from other suppliers also, but I have bought from them a few times.

I wish I had better answers for you. I have a project pile for a similar open roadster. But nothing that really answers your questions. If I live long enough, I would probably use the pyramid mat in the back myself.
Hopefully, a few of the people on this forum that have good open roadsters can chime in here. I might someday want those answers myself.
Drive carefully, and enjoy, W2


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