Wonder who or what is wrapped up in the tarp??
That was one tall Mother-in-Law.
Possibly a well used 1918 non starter T. The carrier for the "body" is attached and does not seem to be a temporary unit. There are two folding chairs( ?) behind the "body"
Look at the doggy !!!
Nah, I say a tarp or tent. Everyone is looking too happy unless......
The folks are fixing to go camping. They have some wooden folding chairs stuffed behind the tent.
I have to say that's the first Model T pic that shows some homemade wood slat luggage and etc carriers!
Looks like the dog is going along too.
I don't know! The look on that dogs face is suggesting a fairly strong odor coming out of that "tent". I guess I'd rather see them haul her that way then wrapped up and sitting in the "mother-in-law" seat.
Darrel, I figured, based on the gas cowl lights, the two man top, vertical windshield and 5 piece quarters/rear body section it was a non-electric car somewhere between '17 to '22. What clue leads you to think it's a '18?
What a great photo.....love the dog and the kids.
Looks like it has round felloes and uneven windshield hinges, thus I think it could have been between late '17 (the hinges) and sometime in '18 (the felloes)?
The original " Family Vacation " film.
This is a publicity still.
That is Imogene Coca as Aunt Edna wrapped up
on the floorboard - she was a little bit younger
in this original film .....
Florida Freighter Jim
Thank you Roger. That's today's lesson in Ford Model T identification.
The wood wheels look early. I would have to look up the changes in the spokes and fellows in the T book. It is the wheels that make me think 17-19.
Probably an 1918.
The felloes were changed to “square” instead of
being rounded, apparently in late 1917 or early 1918
according to a letter dated April 16, 1918 at the Ford
The wooden felloes were no longer rounded between
the spokes (the so-called “square felloe” wheels).
Initially, apparently, the felloe was truly “square” but the
edges were given a 1/16” radius after a short time
The metal bows are oval and those were last used in 1917.
By the look on the kid's face above the dog, I would say it is a funeral procession for the Grandma.
I think they did ol grandma in so they could collect the insurance and get a car with the complete hood, new top, proper luggage rack. They told the little guy in the back seat who is frowning that if he wasn't good they pin it on him or he would join grandma.
To go camping they take the crappy ol' touring (obviously).
Who's gonna make sure no one steals the nicer car in the rear of the photo?
Oh, maybe the other car IS the crappy one...
Great pic Steve!
Lots of good data to date the logical time frame the car was produced. First -- our estimates are based on the assumption that the parts have not been changed from the time the car came off the assembly line. It clearly is not a new car -- but assuming the parts used to date the vehicle all came off the same assembly line together I think it is a typical mid-1917 to the time the combination light switch and horn button was introduced with the 1918 model year car.
Above is a photo of the Rip VanWinkle Jun 1917 Model T Touring. Note it has the same unequal length windshield hinge; windshield to body brackets, round felloe wheels and oval top sockets. It and the car in the original photo both have the horn button mounted on top of the steering column rather than using the combination horn light switch that was introduced early in the 1918 model year. Ref: Hap's memory -- boy that isn't worth much!!!! Both Bruce's on-line encyclopedia and the MTFCI Judging Guidelines 7th edition list the 1918 models with only the combination horn and light switch. The 7th Edition indicates the combination light switch was introduced during 1917 production. But from memory -- not a good enough reference for me -- but I need to run an errand -- I believe that several early 1918 model year cars were documented as having the horn switch on top of the steering column. Hopefully someone will post those links or later this weekend I can find them.
For sure Mid 1917 works...
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Love the spare tire carrier !
Revised estimated date the car was produced: Apr 1917 to Jun 1917.
At http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/doc17.htm it has:
APR 19, 1917 Acc. 78, Ford Archives
Windshield hinge (with the unequal length arms) noted.
That same link also has:
JUN 14, 1917 Acc. 1701. Model T Releases, Ford Archives
Drawing of steering gear box changed. "Brought up to date by specifying this case to be nickel plated instead of black enameled."
But we note on the Rip Van Winkle Ford with a Jun 1917 time frame (ref caption on page 264 of Bruce’s book top left hand photo) that it has a nickel plated steering gear case (ref page 269 Bruce’s book “Model T Ford” the caption and the photo.
I suspect that the information above combined with the statement “Brought up to date….” On the drawing indicates the nickel plated steering gear housing was already being used and they noted that change on the drawing to reflect what was already being done. But that is my limited understanding. I would welcome other comments on what it meant or may have meant. From memory again (not as reliable as a reference), I believe John Regan and others have posted about that subject in the past.
“IF” it meant that the nickel plated steering gear cases were already in production by Jun 14, 1917, and “IF” we are seeing black paint on the steering gear case in the original first photo, then that would date the car Jun 1917 or earlier. (Note they would have used up the black gear cases – so if an assembly plant had them – they would have used them – so perhaps a little later. So a likely time frame would be Apr – early Jun 1917. And it might be a wider range than that.
If the gear case in the photo is not black but is nickel plated – then the combination horn & light switch would bracket the upper date around Nov 1919 (again depending on how much overlap when both styles would have been used). Ref http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/156885.html John shared:
The hole for the headlamp switch was removed from the dash board drawing as of 10/2/17. Remember that this is the date that the design changed - not the on-the-car date. Thus there would still be inventory on hand of dashes with light switch hole on that date. Usually when Ford phased in such a change that totally relocated something - he coordinated that with inventory of existing parts so that it all worked out but also remember that he would continue to have replacement parts on hand so he likely still had light switches in stock when the hole was completely gone. There are ample examples in the "record of changes" where Ford stated exactly how old parts/materials were to be used up. It clearly would look like a 1918 phase in date since the 1918 model year begins on 10/1/17 and this change takes place after that date. If the change was phased in before that date then there would be dashes with empty holes in them and I have never seen that but that does not mean it to be impossible. I think more likely the change to the new switch occurred when the new dashes started to show up and if the dash had a hole in it - they used the old switch. They had not yet rerouted any wiring formally.
On 12/8/17 they added pilot holes to the front side of the dash for mounting the dimmer coil which was not used with the push/pull switch. The dimmer coil was a tapped inductor that had 3 wires and was used in conjunction with the combo switch.
ON 12/18/17 they moved the junction screw for the headlight wire from its location just to the right side of the carb hole to a new location just to the left of this hole. This would seem to indicate a new route for the headlight wire at least slightly since the switch had moved so it makes sense to probably reroute the wire and its junction screw.
Again I must remind you that all of these dates are design change dates rather than on-the-car dates.
End of John Regan’s comments
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