Headlight Rim Markings

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Headlight Rim Markings
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cameron Whitaker, Oklahoma City on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 07:15 pm:

My wife has been working on repainting Lizzie's headlamp rims. Long story short, one fell off while driving and we lost it. Chaffin's garage was nice enough to donate a good original to the cause. Miraculously, one month later, I found the one we lost in a storm drain!

Anyway, while getting both the replacement, and the one that fell off of the car, ready for painting, she noticed that one just says "Ford," while the other one is labeled "Ford,T.J.C. Lamp Co."

Our question is, what is the difference? Did Ford outsource some, but make the others?




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 08:08 pm:

Good catch in that storm drain!

Likely Ford used many suppliers over the years.

Interesting, have similar outline type script on this rim, but this is the early style for the plain round glass, prior to 1922. Has the small clips for round lens, not the later "H" fluted lens.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 08:16 pm:

From the online encyclopedia at http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/I-O.htm#lamps under the 1915 entry it has ďLamps were supplied by E & J, Brown, Victor and, perhaps others.Ē

So yes, lamps were supplied by various companies at different times. While up until today I have not seen a photo or actual lamp marked T.J.C. Lamp Co before, today you have posted your finding. And using Google there was a set in an estate sale back in Sept 21, 2015 complete with photos. Based on the photos from that sale, I would encourage you to look at the back of the lamps where the connector goes in and see if there is any writing around that as shown in the photo below: Other photos of the lamps are located at the same site at: https://www.ebth.com/items/2381941-pair-of-antique-ford-headlamps





Do you know if your lamps came from that estate sale? If they did not, then there are more than just the single pair of them.

I looked but I did not find a photo of the Ford Scrip with the double outline on the headlamp rims. Iím sure there are lots of photos of Ford scrip on headlamp rims Ė but Iím not having any luck finding them tonight. I think I have seen that double line script before on a headlamp rim. But I donít remember when or where.

Thanks so much for sharing and please let us know if you do or do not find any writing on the back side of the headlamp bucket.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cameron Whitaker, Oklahoma City on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 08:35 pm:

Hap,

I did not purchase these from an estate sale. They came installed on my '24 Touring when I bought it back in 2011. I assume they're original to the car.

The backs do say "T.J.C. Lamp Co." as well. Note that I moved the focusing screw in order to rotate the contact sockets so the lamp filaments would be horizontal instead of vertical. At least my high and low beams actually work like they should now :-)




Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Phil Mino, near Porterville on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 10:11 pm:

TJC Lamp Co stands for Thomas J Corcoran Lamp Co

Here is an E&J 1156 rim with the double script outline.

E&J-3


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 10:13 pm:

Ooh, I wish you hadn't done that Cameron--you could have modified the socket instead.
oh well. . .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Sunday, February 19, 2017 - 10:32 pm:

The only ones that I've ever seen or had were marked either Ford or Ford Brown.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 01:22 am:

We Canadian supplied T owners have it lucky. No manufacturer's brand or Ford script on most I have seen.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Menzies on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 04:40 am:

The Canadian Lamp and Stamping Co.(CLASCO) supplied kerosene side lamps with the CLASCO logo on the top. The company was in Windsor Ontario and they specialized in automotive lamps, but I don't know if that included head lamps.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 05:10 am:

David D., me too. :-( Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 06:55 am:

Phil,

Thank you for posting the double line Ford Script Headlamp rim. And also for pointing out that TJC Lamp Co stands for Thomas J Corcoran Lamp Co. Corcoran had been supplying headlamps and sidelamps to Ford starting in 1913 (ref: http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/I-O.htm#lamps ). So perhaps the company changed the name a little or they just decided to use their initials when they stamped things.

Thanks to all for your inputs.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Parker on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 08:09 pm:

Thomas J. Corcoran learned the automobile lamp trade by working for the Victor Lamp Co. He and his brothers then started Corcoran Lamp, acquired Victor Lamp, the J. W. Brown Lamp and the companies became the Autolite Company in 1930.

J. W. Brown was in Columbus, Ohio, and the others were in Cincinnati. Another name the Corcoran's used was Cincinatti-Victor lamp company.

The Corcoran family owned both companies when "Corcoran" and "Victor" began supplying lamps to Ford in 1913.

Ken in Texas


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 08:39 pm:

Ken,

Thank you for the additional information!

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rick Olson on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 09:02 pm:

Great manufacturing history Ken! Never would have guessed they became Autolite.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ken Parker on Monday, February 20, 2017 - 11:13 pm:

This is the site (it may be the building behind the truck) of Corcoran Lamp Company at 712 Reading Road in Cincinnati. Black & Brass Corcoran lamps for Ford as well as the "T.J.C." lamps being discussed above were made here.



If you have Black & Brass Jno. W. Brown 16's, they were made here at 753 Marion, Columbus, Ohio. The two white buildings are probably all that is left of that new 1913 plant Brown put in to make the large order they had from Ford.



A newly constructed building is at the Victor site in Cincinnati but the biggest supplier for 1913/1914 Fords was Edmunds & Jones and their building still stands in Detroit out on Buchanon and Humbolt. All the brass, black & brass and round black era E&J lamps were made here.

1910 photo

today

A year or so ago I was just looking to see what was still standing in the way of plants that made some of the parts for our cars. Most is gone but a little is still out there.

Ken in Texas


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robbie Price on Tuesday, February 21, 2017 - 06:34 am:

What would the Steel E&J Model 1156 rim be for?

I am looking for a Brass E&J Model 1156 rim if anyone has one for sale?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hap Tucker in Sumter SC on Tuesday, February 21, 2017 - 08:54 pm:

Robbie,

The Steel E&J Model 1156 rim would have been introduced when Ford phased out the brass headlamp rims along with the brass chimney & door on the side lamps and tail lamps.

Ref: http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/doc15.htm JUN 19, 1915 Acc. 575, Box 19, Ford Archives

Headlight door. Change from brass to black steel specified.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR on Wednesday, February 22, 2017 - 09:28 am:

Robbie -- When I bought a 1915 Touring car 15+ years ago, it had one #1156 brass rim on it. I looked for 3 years to find another, which was on ebay. I paid $160 for it, then had a body man work out the dents. I've seen a couple of steel ones in the past; if you could find one of those you could have it brass-plated. Good luck in your search.


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