Lead additive

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Lead additive
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By harold Chambers on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 08:34 pm:

Does anyone run a lead additive in their model t ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 08:47 pm:

Not needed. Leaded gas was introduced to support higher compression in aircraft engines in the 1930's. When the Model T was new gasoline was 60 octane if it was excellent quality.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 08:57 pm:

Over 20 years ago, when folks were going into withdrawals as tetraethyl lead was disappearing from gasoline, there were a number of snake oil concoctions purporting to be lead additives or lead "replacers". It was questionable then whether "real lead" could be added. Are there products available nowadays that really provide tetraethyl lead to add to gasoline ?

Next thought is that low-compression, irrepressable Model T got along fine for nearly 20 years before leaded gasoline even became generally available. Why would it need a lead additive now ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David A. Siver.......De Smet, SD on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 08:59 pm:

Lead was added to gasoline for other purposes than to boost octane, it was also added to prevent wear on valve seats and guides.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Don Allen - Conroe, TX on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:05 pm:

Interestingly....Ethyl Corp, the company formed to produce lead for fuels, is still alive and well.

I pass by their facility on the Houston Ship Channel almost every day.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:13 pm:

Nonsense as far as lead being added to reduce wear on valve guides or valve seats. Absolute nonsense.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:18 pm:

Royce, that's true for a Model T, but I had a 1970 Dodge Charger that I ran for many years with its original cylinder heads. When I finally tore down the engine for a rebuild, the exhaust valves had pounded their way into the seats by 1/8 inch.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rich Bingham on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:23 pm:

Tetraethyl lead was introduced to prevent pre-ignition as higher compression engines were developed. In fact, the lead caused fouling problems which necessitated the development of yet other additives to gasoline.

A beneficial aspect of leaded gasoline was the formation of lead halides on valves and seats which prevented microscopic weld-back and extended the life of valve faces and seats, but that was a by-product, not the primary reason for lead in gas.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:33 pm:

One of my favorite idiotic ads of recent years was one in Hemmings that advertised a Model T "remachined to run on unleaded fuel". :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:33 pm:

Mark the fact is this is a Model T forum. I have other cars too. The cheapest unleaded gas that you can buy is fantastic, wonderful, and way too much octane for the Model T. Lead additives are not a factor that needs to be any part of fuel for a Model T.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Pergande, Essexville MI on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 09:53 pm:

I, unlike many others, believe lead additives do reduce wear on non-hardened valve guides. I also use it because it can help keep the carburetor and other fuel line components clean. It's my money, and my car and I'll put into it whatever my little pea brain thinks works. Yeah, I also run a water pump in my T and it too works great.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Royce in Dallas TX on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 10:13 pm:

What a load of poo.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Noonan - Norton, MA. on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 10:19 pm:

If its good enough for paint and pencils, then i guess its good enough for my T...Oh wait, never-mind. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Osterman on Friday, March 03, 2017 - 11:58 pm:

Is lead additive actually lead ... ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Pergande, Essexville MI on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 01:07 am:

Yes, tetraethyl lead, the compound added to gasoline starting in about 1923 was actually lead.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jack Pergande, Essexville MI on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 01:09 am:

and it is in additives


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Lloid on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 07:45 am:

I don't run anything but fuel stabilizer and what the gas stations signs in my area say is 100% gas. I only run this gas because in the months we don't get to drive much it supposedly doesn't go bad as fast. So everyone is saying. I did have the fuel go bad in my 26 rpu in 3 months. I work 12-15 hours 6 days and sometimes they just have to sit a while, until I get to crank them again and go for a ride.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Rogers - South of the Adirondacks on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 07:47 am:

I tried to keep my mouth but have failed once again.

Royce and others are correct- it's snake oil.

I challenge anyone to produce documented proof that "lead additives" significantly reduce/prevent wear.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charlie B actually in Toms River N.J. on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 07:53 am:

" I reject your reality and substitute my own". Adam from Mythbusters said it and I've taken it up as my motto. Gets a lot of use here. Especially concerning subjects like this one. I have no proof, might actually be doing harm, yadda yadda.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan Danbury, WI on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 07:56 am:

Looking back at my misspent youth, I can remember tearing down engines and having to deal with lead deposits in the chambers and on the valves. Adding tetraethyl lead was probably a cheaper way to raise octane levels than the extra steps and costs in the refining process back then. I do remember the whole marketing deal about preventing valve wear, but the downside was the increase in deposits on the valves, plugs and in the chambers. No lead fuels have been much nicer on engines than the old leaded stuff.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dallas landers on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 01:05 pm:

Harold, I run 100% gasoline with no ehtynol. Nothing else. I am fairly new to Ts but after watching a thread go on for days on this topic thats what I came away with. If you really want to see a long bitter thread ask about Marvel Mystery Oil. Welcome to the T world . Gas it up and drive the wheels off.
Drive safe and often


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 08:29 pm:

When unleaded fuels were introduced here, in the 80's as I remember, fuel additives were all the rage to prevent valve damage. My local machine shop had heaps of iron cylinder head work at this time. One Chrysler Valiant 6 cylinder head had valves so deeply pocketed that the hydraulic valve followers could no longer compensate for the wear. The valves were opening and closing in a recessed tube and eventually would not lift out of the tube. There was no hardened replacement valve seat deep enough to make the repair.

Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 08:39 pm:

More Mopar OT, avert your eyes :-)

I once bought a cherry 1969 Plymouth Valiant 100 2 door sedan with only 45,000 miles on it. When I owned it, I could tell it was time to adjust the valves when the engine started idling roughly.

Inevitably, I would find that one or more exhaust valves had sunk a bit into their seats and used up all the lash. I would reset the lash and continue motoring for another 6 months or so until they needed it again. I drove the car for five years, then sold it for the same price I bought it for. Cheap daily transportation!

pic1

pic2


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Hood -Long Beach, California on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 08:39 pm:

The wear of the valve seats that the lead was preventing was caused by the high RPM and subsequent higher valve spring pressures needed to control the valves at those higher RPMs in modern engines. Low RPM Model T engines with light valve spring pressures do not pound the valve seats and do not need extra additives.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Don Allen - Conroe, TX on Saturday, March 04, 2017 - 08:59 pm:

Love those slant sixes Mark.

I had one almost exactly like it.


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