Reverse Drum without a Curb

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Reverse Drum without a Curb
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Tuesday, April 25, 2017 - 12:12 am:

Recently I picked up three drums still connected together. When I got them home and ready to separate the three drums I found that the reverse drum did not have the usual curb or raised ridge like other reverse drums. Close examination shows that not only did it not have the usual ridge but never had one. I have worked on my first transmission in 1949 and many, many since and have never seen a reverse drum without the ridge. Anyone got any suggestions other than the ridge was removed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Tuesday, April 25, 2017 - 12:13 am:

Reverse Drum Without Ridge????

no ridge


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Tuesday, April 25, 2017 - 10:37 pm:

Still no answers, Strange. I did notice that the drum had the ford logo inside and the same number indented as other reverse drums T 702. I think I may keep it and try it next time I do a transmission for myself.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan George Long on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 01:23 am:

Hi Dave. Sorry but I have no idea about your question. But for those who have a reverse drum with a cracked or damaged lip It would interesting to know how important it really is. Knowing the real reason for the lip / if it's necessary or not would give you confidence to machine the lip off. I have just looked at the three spare drums I have and all show contact of some form on the side of the lip. I wonder why the need to prevent the band from moving forward? Does the low gear band prevent it from moving rearwards? If that is the case, why didn't the brake band have a guide also
Regards. Alan in Western Australia


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank van Ekeren (Australia) on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 01:36 am:

It's there for a reason, to keep the band from moving forward enough to get chewed up by the triple gears.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 02:31 am:

Hey Dave, Well, your third post answered my first question. Ford script. If it didn't have one, I would have wondered it it could have been an el-cheapo after-market replacement. A script pretty much eliminates a really early variation also. Pretty much means the lip must have been machined off? But your first post suggests that it appears to have never had one. Most curious. Could you post some pictures of the webbing and bushing structures?
I can't help but wonder if this may have been somebody's bright idea to make changing bands easier? Doesn't sound like a good idea to me for the very reason stated by Frank v E. I did run a model T for several years with about two inches of that ridge broken off. I filed the rough edge smooth and rounded. Never had any trouble from it. It never hurt the cotton linings I ran in those days. I had figured then that the remaining ridge was plenty to keep the band away from the triple gears. Without the ridge, they would be too close for comfort.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter Kable - Kiama NSW OZ on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 02:34 am:

What is the diameter? is it the finished size or the size of the lip? maybe it snuck through without being finished to size.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 11:12 am:

Frank,

Bingo. Correct.

The lip has been removed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 11:19 pm:

Jerry VanOpteghem, No lip has been removed. It would show. The running surface is ALL THE SAME ALL THE WAY ACROSS. So no bingo, correct.

I would guess that the brackets on the hogs head would keep the reverse foot pedal from moving very far forward.

Wayne please see the picture of the webbing and how close both reverse drums match up in diameter.

webbing

diameter


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 11:36 pm:

I looked the webbing over and they look the same to me. Also when the two drum are stacked there is no over run on either one, The diameter is with in reason, the SAME.
My first reaction when I saw the reverse drum while still on the stack with out the lip was maybe it was a very, very early one before they started putting lips on the reverse. Until I removed the driven gear all three drums were tied together. If that is the case I may donate the drum to the MTFCA Museum, if they would want it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Wednesday, April 26, 2017 - 11:43 pm:

I didn't say it very well, about the lip keeping the band from moving forward. I believe that the bracket on the hogs head would keep the foot pedal shaft from moving very far forward. this would keep the band from moving forward, In other words I don't see how the band could move enough to be damaged by the triple gears. Maybe it would?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank van Ekeren (Australia) on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 01:41 am:

That's true enough Dave, but the band is hanging there like a pendulum, with out the rim the bottom of the band has nothing to keep it square to the drum.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Jelf, Parkerfield KS on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 01:47 am:


Like Wayne, I had a reverse drum with a chunk broken out of the flange. I smoothed the rough edges and used it. I wasn't as lucky as Wayne.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 01:54 am:

That is a good one Dave! I don't know what to make of it. I wish I could come by and look at it in person (just because I am a hands-on person that way).


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 04:05 am:

Steve - that looks bad, did the car suddenly want to reverse and drag some time after you began to use the engine or did it start to drag right from start?

The ridge in the drum looks to be higher than the usual slack in bands so the remaining ridge should stop the band from getting caught by the edge?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 07:24 am:

Wayne, I think I left a complete transmission on your back door step one time in Grass Valley. You were not home. If that was your house, when I left I went down the steepest street I ever drove down in my motor home. I would have turned around and went back a different street but I had a trailer with a Center Door behind me so I could not turn around. I think there was a Cancer Thrift Shop at the bottom of the street. Wayne: if you want to inspect the drum I will ship it to you if you would return it. Come out some year for the LEAF PEEPER TOUR, you would really enjoy it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 08:31 am:

Dave, is it an optical dillusion in your photo or is the drum without the band lip wider than the other normal one.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jerry VanOoteghem - SE Michigan on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 11:09 am:

Dave,

"It would show. The running surface is ALL THE SAME ALL THE WAY ACROSS"


Well, I'm not saying it was done by some hack. Would it not be possible to take a nice skim cut all the way across?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 07:54 pm:

Wayne, I think I left a complete transmission on your back door step one time in Grass Valley. You were not home. If that was your house, when I left I went down the steepest street I ever drove down in my motor home. I would have turned around and went back a different street but I had a trailer with a Center Door behind me so I could not turn around. I think there was a Cancer Thrift Shop at the bottom of the street. Wayne: if you want to inspect the drum I will ship it to you if you would return it. Come out some year for the LEAF PEEPER TOUR, you would really enjoy it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 08:19 pm:

James; That is just the photo. The Diameter is the same. In fact all three drums had the same width and diameter.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Thursday, April 27, 2017 - 08:44 pm:

Dave H, I don't think you have ever been to my house. we have been here only eleven years now. That does sound like the place where Terry Horlick lived when we moved here. He has since moved out of town to nearby Penn Valley when he retired.
As for me wanting to see the drum myself? That should just remain among my too many wishes. Things are simply too unstable around here these days for me to promise to return anything. I do hope all is well with you.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Horlick in Penn Valley, CA on Friday, April 28, 2017 - 11:17 am:

Dave it sounds like you were on Lucas Lane, the steepest darn street I've ever seen. It is about as steep as Lombard street would have been if they ran it straight down the hill without any switchbacks! I used to test my model T on that hill (cliff?), if it could go up the hill it was in perfect shape... or better. Even then most T's won't do the hill... nor some moderns.

After a snow that is THE sled hill, I don't know how kids kept from dying at the T intersection at the bottom... I never let my daughters sled there!

Dave you were around the corner from my house, but I never found a transmission on my porch, dead possum yes, transmission no! I wish you would have stopped by!

TH


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Huson, Berthoud, Co. on Saturday, April 29, 2017 - 02:15 am:

Terry, if I left the transmission on the wrong back porch, someone must have been surprised when they got home, I wonder what they ever did with it. No one but T heads would know what one is.


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