Ran great then it doesn't

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Ran great then it doesn't
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 06:55 pm:

A friend bought a 12 touring, it didn't run well so we rebuilt a set of coils for it. With the new coils it was primed (choked) 4 cranks (ignition off) and then it started on compression.

The car drove very well, had power, life is good. 20 minutes after shutting it off again primed it 4 strokes, it has never fired since. There is spark to all plugs.

We removed all 4 plugs, sprayed the off (dried them, (they were wet)

We have tried setting the carb at 1 1/2 and at 1 1/4 turns CCW

the gas was new, compression seems normal (judging by the effort needed to crank it).

Interesting the Holly 2 screw (Detroit) carb leaks gas out of the throat when you crank the car (not choking it)

Again it does not fire at all.

Questions:
Why would simply cranking it cause gas to leak from the choke plate end?

If the float was waterloged it doesn't seem likely to have caused trouble in the 20 minute time it was off.

Where would you place the timing and throttle levers?

I'm gonna learn something interesting on this one.

Thanks

Ben


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:01 pm:

Ben-
What type of coils? Heinz? Kingston or later Ford/ KW coils?
Is there spark?

Carb should be about 1/2 turn open. 1/4 more if starting cold.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:08 pm:

Late Ford/KW type, all 4 show a spark at the tip of the plug (screwdriver to the head)

1/2 to 1/4? Am I mixing up Model A with Model T? or is this carb extremely different form an NH?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Wrenn-Monroeville OH on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:16 pm:

Ben...try an NH and see what happens. Yes, the Holley 2 screw is very different from the NH. I use the correct 2-screw for show and judging, then run on an NH as it performs better.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Val Soupios on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:18 pm:

How much gas is in the tank? On one of my T's gas would pour out of the carburetor when cranked but it would not run even though there was a gallon of fresh gas in the tank. I added 2 more gallons of gas and the problem disappeared. If that is not it, check to make sure an intake valve is not stuck open. No matter how much gas there is in the tank it won't run with an intake valve stuck open.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Charlie B actually in Toms River N.J. on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:28 pm:

Wet plugs. Flooding. Over priming a warm engine when no priming or choke should be necessary. If the float were bad it would probably leak constantly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 07:34 pm:

I agree with Charlie, sounds flooded. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 08:39 pm:

I thought flooded meant the plugs were wet. Since we blew them dry I thought it eliminated that notion. Do I not understand what flooding is?

Like I said, I'm gonna learn something

Ben


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 08:47 pm:

Agreed, flooded.
Next time you get it running, turn the carburetor adj knob in until you find the sweet spot. Then get a sharpie marker and make a line from the center to 12 o'clock for a reference point.

At idle you should have the spark at about
3/4 way down. Throttle at 2-3 notches.
All cars are a little different, so it will take a little bit of playing, so enjoy the learning!

There are a number of good reference books that I would recommend, like the Service book and a Ford manual. Do a site search for other recommendations.

I'm curious, does the car have the fore-doors attached?

: ^ )


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tim Lloid on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 08:55 pm:

I have not had any issues with my T s with NH carbs. They seem simple to maintain and easy to build. Just my experience. Tim


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 09:09 pm:

2 doors


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 09:11 pm:

What I would like to know is where do folks set timing and throttle for starting knowing that things vary from car to car


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Norman T. Kling on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 09:21 pm:

I would agree that the engine was flooded. It's too late now to check, but it would be of interest if the gas was coming out before you crank it. If it was, that would indicate a problem with the fuel intake needle or the float. However, if it happens only after you crank it, the richness mixture might be too rich. Try cranking it with the throttle all the way open. That might help you to get the excess gas out of the cylinders.

Anyway, I don't think your problem is with ignition, but with the fuel system. I have had cars which would start without the choke when cold and would not start when warmed up. Definately running too rich. Float was too high.
Norm


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Townsend ; ^ ) Gresham, Orygun on Saturday, May 20, 2017 - 09:29 pm:

Ben
When cold I open the throttle 8-10 notches then prime it about 4 pulls.
If starting on battery, spark fully retarded. If starting on magneto, advance the spark about 6 notches.
Play with it as your mileage may vary...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ben Umberger on Sunday, May 21, 2017 - 09:06 pm:

Thanks everyone, it was flooded, started right up today


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