Dyna Beads or Other Balancing Methods

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Dyna Beads or Other Balancing Methods
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 07:59 am:

Gene Carrothers posted in another thread about the use of Dyna Beads. Not wanting to hijack the thread, I started this one.

How many of us use Dyna Beads or other IN TIRE balancing methods?

What are your thoughts on doing this?

How well are you satisfied or NOT satisfied with this balancing?

Is it worth the time, effort, and expense?

Thanks for your input.

Terry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jon Crane on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 08:05 am:

I used Dyna Beads in my 32 ford and it is awesome.
I would like to figure out why and how they work, but they certainly do balance the wheel. First few miles are rough and unbalanced, then it gets better and by 50 miles all is well.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter McIntyre on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 08:22 am:

We have them in all our pre 1916 cars. They work great. Totally stops that rough road shimmy that you can get with 30 in tires. Use a tiny squeeze bottle and a lot of patience to get them in the valve. Also if you put Dyna Beads in as a keyword search a lot of info pops up


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Corey Walker, Brownsboro TX on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 09:31 am:

How fast do you have to go to notice the difference? I know in my modern car I have to hit 60 or so before unbalanced tires start to vibrate or bounce. Seems like my T does that at about 40 but I don't usually go that fast. I have non-demountable wood wheels.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Keith Gumbinger, Kenosha, WI on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 09:47 am:

I have them and really like them. I think they are working in about 2 miles at T speeds.

Keith


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Hatch on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 10:35 am:

If you use the right tire sealant it will do the same thing and stop flats. Dan


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 11:04 am:

Thank You Gentlemen. I thought there would be several good reports.

Dan, are you talking about Slime? I have used that in several wagon and dolly tires with good results. I always wondered about the balancing angle.

Thanks Again


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 12:08 pm:

I use the counteract brand of glass beads sold by Snyder's in the 21x4.50" tubes on my primitive pickup and they work amazingly well at all speeds from slow to 55 mph. Of course, they can't fix an out of round wheel, but they fix any balance issue on narrow tires like on antique cars and motorcycles.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Doris, AZ on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 12:26 pm:

Counteract beads here as well. Only have them in the front tubes. They appear to be doing as advertised, drives smooth with no noticeable vibration. As Peter stated, they do take patience to get them in the valve stem.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Karlsson, southern Sweden on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 12:35 pm:

I had to drill out the valve stem with a 4mm drill and knock on the valve while filling - would work with some kind of vibrating gizmo too.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 12:37 pm:

I put dynabeads in my speedster tubes (21" wire wheels with a lot of loose rust etc. in the rim bead) and they work great. Wheels & tires must be round of course but they keep that balanced feeling up to 70 MPH anyway. I don't need to know about any faster.

OK, so many years have past with the beads in the tires and no problems and just this week I have two flat tires on the speedster with it just sitting in the garage. THe only change is that I checked and topped off the pressure in the tires before they very slowly (over a few days) went flat. I'm suspecting I got a bit of dust or crud from inside the tube that kept the valve core from sealing properly. Need to air them up and do some testing. Has anyone else experienced this?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Hal Davis-SE Georgia on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 12:59 pm:

Is your air chuck new? Some of these new ones they're selling are pure JUNK. The center part that depresses the valve core is made too small and tapers to almost a point. It will go off to one side of the valve core and bend it preventing you from putting air in the tire and also preventing it from sealing very well and what's in there comes back out.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Hatch on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 01:10 pm:

Slime will do it. You should talk to someone that is into truck (big) tires. A few years ago there was a sealant for them that also balanced them. Dan


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dale L Myers on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 01:47 pm:

Dyna Beads can be a pain to install.
As roger Karlsson said "I had to drill out the valve stem with a 4mm drill and knock on the valve while filling - would work with some kind of vibrating gizmo too."




My son and I drilled a little dimple in the side of an old nut that was large enough to fit over the valve stem. Then used an engraving tool to vibrate the nut while pouring the beads down the plastic tube. It only took a minute or two to put the pack of beads in each tube.
It should work just as well with the tire mounted on the wheel.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 02:07 pm:

I had the same idea of using an engraving tool. The nut is pure genius. I really like that one. I just have to figure out how to get that many hands in on doing the job.

Thanks Everyone


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank Harris from Long Beach, CA on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 02:49 pm:

I have used them for years.. Our Speedster will do over 70 miles an hour and there is no vibration. I get a two foot length of the tubing and fill it with the beads. I blow air in the open end of the tubing in short puffs of one or two pounds of air pressure. Too much pressure and they will blow all over the garage floor so don't use more than a pound or two. The beads go in in under five minutes if you use air pressure with shorts puffs.

Rotate the tire so that the valve stem is just below 3:00 o'clock or 9:00 depending where you are. The short light puffs of air will blow the beads up hill and the extra ones will roll back down. Blow them back up and most of them will go in and just a few will roll back down. Use more beads because more is better and not enough will not do the job.





22


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary London, Camarillo, CA on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 08:42 pm:

If you use original steel valve stems, install the beads after you cut off the rubber stem and before installing the metal stem. At that point you have a hole about the diameter of a pencil and the beads go in easily.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kevin Whelihan Danbury, WI on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 08:58 pm:

I use Franks method after struggling with the shaker bottle. Tried drilling once but found out the stem inserts didn't seal well for some reason. I like the balancing beads. They are finally a product that works as advertised. How they work, I can't say I understand. I just know they work.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Derek Kiefer - Mantorville, MN on Friday, July 07, 2017 - 09:08 pm:

Based on the forum posts, I was expecting the Dyna Beads to be much more difficult to install. I thought it was easy, and took no more than a few minutes each using only the bottle and tube that came with the kit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jason Given - St. Paul, MN on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 09:46 am:

I installed Excell or Counteract 7 or 8 years ago. They are great in the T. I followed the manufacturers recommendation on the amount (1 bag ea). I could feel the difference immediately. I had issues with the valve cores on two wheels this year,sticking. The local vendor I bought them from, gave me four new ones for free.

I put them in my truck, and hated them. Not sure why, but it did not work. Maybe I needed more weight. After 6 months, I removed them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank Seress, Prescott Az. on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 10:20 am:

There is a chart on the internet that recommends 6 ounces of beads for model T 30x3 and 30x3-1/2 tires. Isn't that too much, considering only 1 or 2 ounces is recommended for motorcycle tires that are close to the same size? Frank


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bob Doris, AZ on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 12:15 pm:

Frank, vendor recommendation is 4 oz. for wire wheel and 6 oz. for wooden wheels.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 12:40 pm:

Frank, I suspect that modern motorcycle wheels and tires are built to a more refined spec and are in far better condition than our 90+ year old wheels and SE Asia tires. I know it takes a fair bit of lead to balance the clinchers on my coupe and my speedster wire wheels are not the finest with pitting as well a loose rust and crud floating around in the bead.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Dwyer in Troy, New York on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 01:04 pm:

Could one of you smart guys post a real engineering explanation so i can understand why these beads should work? Being a bear of very little brain, it seems to me that any weight will want to get itself farthest from the rotational axis not closer. In other words it seems to me these beads should make the balance worse not better.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Strange - Hillsboro, MO on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 01:17 pm:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq263AYgyYg


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Phil Emerson - California on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 01:22 pm:

I don't know if Phil is using balancing beads.

Testing his user id.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gene Carrothers Huntington Beach on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 02:53 pm:

Some things in life work like Magic and I think the Dyna Beads or other brand is one of these. The video could have been a better example but still showed them working inside a small bottle. I've done that with a bigger nut and more beads.

I would Not use them with any of the flat fixes inside a tire. You have to think about how long it would take for the slimy stuff to work around inside the tire and if it got too thick or dry. The beads are made of ceramic so they don't turn to dust. I guess you could just put some sand inside or other with enough weight to counteract the wheel.

If you have rust and crud floating around inside your bead I'd suggest it's time for some maintenance. There shouldn't be anything loose between the rim and the tube...

the only thing is how much to put in. I use about 6oz or maybe 8 in the rear. YMMV


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Walt Berdan, Bellevue, WA on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 03:59 pm:

Gene, The bead I refer to is on 26/27 wire wheels and if there was a good way to get it out I would do that. The next time a swap tires I may drill a hole in the bead and inject some epoxy and spin the wheels to capture the rust & crud and then plug the hole. For now the loose stuff is captured within the rolled bead of the rim where it does no real harm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 04:13 pm:

Here is a very basic explanation without a whole lot of scientific jargon. As I understand:

Centrifugal force will cause any loose material to find balance and equality. Thus, as the tire turns, the force will throw the beads to the outside. With the tire being out of balance, the force will make the beads move to equal out the balance making the most even surface level (circular) layer of beads with respect to the weight distribution. This means the surface level of the beads will be an almost perfect circle even though the depth of the beads differs.

If there are too many beads in the tube, there will be a bead layer on the heavy side of the wheel as well as on the light side. The surface of the beads will be a perfect circle around the center of rotation, the axle. If there are not enough beads in the tire, then the perfect balance will not be achieved. Perfect balance is achieved when the beads have a perfect circle inner surface. Better too many, than not enough.

The distribution of the beads is not instant. It takes some revolutions of the tire to move the beads into equilibrium. That's why it takes the tires some distance to balance themselves out.

One drawback to using free rotation balancing methods is Unsprung weight. All of these methods add weight to the wheels where the springs do not counteract it. With just 1 1/2 lb added to the unsprung weight, we should never see any change in the handling of the vehicle. Too much unsprung weight can cause sluggish steering and throw off suspension spring rates.

Liquid tire sealants will accomplish the same balancing as the beads. You could do the same with water, but you would have to figure out how to keep it from freezing in the winter. Also, water is not the best thing when it comes to corrosion.

I know this is not the clearest explanation on earth but it's the best I can do. Otherwise the best explanation is PFM Pure F. Magic.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Peter McIntyre on Saturday, July 08, 2017 - 05:14 pm:

I was recommended them by a friend who races motor cycles. He commented that he did notice when he slowed from 160 mph to about 80 mph for a curve and then picked up speed again that there was a few seconds whilst the beads rearranged with the change in velocity.


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