***Horn Button Assemblies 1915-1917, 1918-1925, 1926-1927, 1926-1927 Canadian***

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: ***Horn Button Assemblies 1915-1917, 1918-1925, 1926-1927, 1926-1927 Canadian***
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 03:55 am:

I thought I'd just push through the rest of the horn buttons for now, the only other horns left I think will be the air bulb horns. And as soon as I sort those out I'll post them here too.

Steering Columns are another thing I'm trying to sort out, there are just so many of the darn things and they anywhere from minute changes, to pretty sweeping ones, like the base mounting on a 26-27 goes from 1909-1925 as round and in 26-27 it's square (sort of). Now I'm not saying that 1909-1925 are all alike either, because they're not, there are some rather significant changes between those periods...which to me is the fun of my project...I get to see every detail as it changed through the years...trying to display those changes is sometimes a right old challenge, but like I say...fun never quits!









Anyhoo, if you see something amiss let me know and I'll change it straight away or at least as fast as I can (which sometimes is pretty damn quick). :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Warren on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 09:43 am:

Thanks, Martin, I love your work!!!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Bourgeois,Aldergrove BC,Can. on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 11:17 am:

Thank you Marten, I was wondering if anyone had the button for my 26 horn. All the rest is in good shape, but the button.
Your drawings are the best. So much detail.
Every time I find one of your drawings for my car, I make a copy for my reference book.
They sure help a newbie as myself, when working on the car.
Many thanks again.
Regards PaulB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Longbranch,WA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 11:26 am:

Lang's carries them, Paul.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Paul Bourgeois,Aldergrove BC,Can. on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 11:45 am:

Thanks Steve, just looked at Lang's and now I'm going to have to go look at the one I have. It looks different than the one on Lang's page.
I did find a few others with different numbers.
I was going to let Marten know about these.
Regards PaulB


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 04:20 pm:

What Lang's has is the replacement...A-But, the only part of the original assembly that Lang's has is the button...although, you might want to ask and see, because they have a lot of NOS in IP stowage containers outside. The contact plate inside is like any of the contact plates with the exception of the horn/headlight switch assembly. The only difference between the other contact plates and this one is the ground lug and the new ones have mounting lugs on the back (for the clam shell metal column housing), that grounds to the steering column. The 1915 - 1917 Assembly also has this contact plate but the ground lug lays flat against the column.

The original housing is the same also as the 1915-1917's but the housing lugs are bent down to mount to the steering wheels lock nut and takes the same screws as the 15-17 too.

My suggestion to you is, try and find at a swap meet or something the exterior housing, because that to me would be the hardest to find...everything else is replaceable with new parts, that you may have to rework a bit....but any NOS or a rusty housing you find at a swap meet, to my mind would be better than that "doorbell" button that the vendors are selling...or buy a "doorbell" button and scrap the housing in favor of an NOS housing for your car or a 1915-17 and bend the tabs. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Tomaso - Longbranch,WA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 04:26 pm:

The correct button for a '26-'27 is part # 6983-C:https://www.modeltford.com/item/6983C.aspx - Paul stated he only needs the button.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kurt Baltrusch on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 04:55 pm:

Wasn't the horn switch on 1917- 1920 models (those without starters) a combination light/horn switch with two headlight positions? It had a fluted button which is slightly different than the normal horn button, and the switch was unique.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 04:56 pm:

Martin,
I know for a fact that our Australian cars that came from Ford Canada had that steering wheel horn prior to 1926. Not exactly sure when they commenced with that practice. I am thinking possibly when the battery horn was first used.

Best regards, John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 06:07 pm:

Martin,

Something else I noticed is the brass contact on your drawing.

Pictured with a Red Arrow posted below.

Our Canadian horn did not have that.



Also pictured is broken one that I have.



That contact is exactly the same as its opposite.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 06:37 pm:

Then how does it ground? Must ground through the horn then I guess...ok I'll change it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Sims--Reed City,Mich. on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 06:39 pm:

I think that the Canadian horn button with the tab would be used with a two wire mag horn. this grounds the horn with one wire to make it work.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 06:44 pm:

Kurt, I've already drawn and posted the 18-22 Horn/Headlight Switch Assembly for Non-Starter cars. But I'll post it here so you can take a look at to it too. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 07:05 pm:

Martin,

The version I posted is a two wire horn mechanism, and as you say is grounded through the horn.

There is a wire to both contacts.

I am hoping someone will come up with a starting date for these Canadian Steering Wheel horn buttons.

They certainly had them on the 1923 through to 1927 here in Australia.

Best regards, John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 07:09 pm:

Jim, wouldn't it still work if it were grounded through the horn instead of the button? As long as there is a ground somewhere in the circuit, it should work...right?

And as far as I know this button is not a magneto horn set up...unless they've got this same set up prior to the starter cars. Canadian cars are sort of an anomaly really, they're most times nothing like our domestics and usually sport stuff we've never seen before on any car. I'm pretty sure none of them used a magneto horn with this set up, but then I really don't know, only the Aussie's and Canadians would know for sure.
I just assumed it would be like the 15-17's horn button assembly which does have a ground lug, since virtually they're the same assembly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard Erfert on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 07:13 pm:

My Canadian Ford horn button is as shown for the 26/27 without the tab. Ours is a '25 if that makes a difference. It was restored in upper Michigan several years ago but I don't know by whom.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jim Sims--Reed City,Mich. on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 07:45 pm:

The one wire mag horn is grounded thru the horn and the only wire goes from the horn to the button and then to the mag the two wire horn has one wire from the mag to the horn and then another wire to the horn button that is grounded.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Frank van Ekeren (Australia) on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 07:50 pm:

Horn ground, live wire to horn button and returned to the one and only + post on the horn. Having a tap would only short out the circuit.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris Bamford, Edmonton AB on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 08:05 pm:

Very interesting.

The three photos below show the horn button on my 1926 Canadian Touring. This is a very original car and I assume(d) this unusual horn button assembly with the heavy curved "stand-off" was also original. It is certainly a manufactured part although I suppose it could have been some factory other than Ford's.

I'm curious if any North American or Colonial '26 Ts have this same set up.

Three further notes: My internal contact assembly is the same as that partial plate pic posted by Page; I added the two rubber grommets to keep the metal from chaffing the insulation; and the horn button shown is one I made to replace a poor original.






Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 09:24 pm:

Looks like some body adapted a 1915 horn button to fit your Canadian touring car...the 1915-17's have the flat flange for mounting on the column behind the quadrants. Note the hole coming out of the side on the button housing? That's where the wire(s) would come from on a 1915-17 American domestic car.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Wells, Hamilton Ontario on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 09:46 pm:

I know the 1920 and up Canadian cars had the steering wheel horn button. I think 1919 and earlier were different.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 10:06 pm:

Dave, did they look exactly the same or were there small differences betwixt them?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vic Patterson. Grande Cache, Canada. on Saturday, September 16, 2017 - 10:56 pm:

This was on my 1920 Canadian Touring


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Sunday, September 17, 2017 - 12:11 am:

I have just found this image on a past Forum discussion.

NOTE:- The ground connection appears to be a separate piece, so that base could be used with either one wire or two.

http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/411944/503116.html?1419089627



Best regards, John Page, Australia.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Chris Bamford, Edmonton AB on Sunday, September 17, 2017 - 12:12 am:

Yes Martin, parts of the 1915 horn button drawing are the same as mine.

That curved metal stand-off is still a mystery it is definitely a well made piece, right down to tapped holes for the button housing screws.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Sunday, September 17, 2017 - 01:17 am:

Vic, did 1920 Canadian Touring cars have slant windshields or the straight ones like we had here? Because the car in that picture looks to have a slant windshield placing it somewhere between 1923 and 1925...there's too much wood construction for 1926-7.

John, yes I know of this picture it's what I used to make the drawings for both the 1915-1917 and the 1926-1927 Canadian horn button assemblies...it is also why I thought that the non-power side of the contact plate ran a ground lug to the steering wheel lock nut....because as you see it there that is exactly how it looks for 1915-17.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Page on Sunday, September 17, 2017 - 01:44 am:

Martin,

Ford Canada had the slant windscreen before the USA production went into operation.

SEE LINK :- http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/35088.html?1188808811


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Martin Vowell, Sylmar, CA on Sunday, September 17, 2017 - 08:59 am:

Like the bow clamps on the back...seems more solid than the straps we've got...ok, so Canadian cars had slant windshields afore we did...makes me think the Canadian cars were the guinea pigs for production improvements.


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