Looking for a good restoration shop

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration
Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2017: Looking for a good restoration shop
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald Evans on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 03:27 pm:

I have a 1923 model T that I would like to send to a reputable shop to get restored. Car ran one year ago. I want to set up for durable touring. I live close to Chicago and would like a shop 300 miles or closer. Any references is greatly appreciated.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Matt Lindberg on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 03:56 pm:

Do it yourself its more fun and educational that way. If you have a model T you have a project for life anyway.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thomas Mullin on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 04:02 pm:

Ron, I go with Matt. But, be sure to join up with your local MTFCA or MTFCI chapter. That way, its even more fun.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed in California on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 04:17 pm:

Take a heart defibrillator with you. You are looking at at least 75.00 dollars an hour, times about 1000 hours, plus parts and materials. In the end you have a very expensive restoration worth less than 10k.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 04:38 pm:

Ronald,

Ed is correct. I'm working on '20 Center Door restoration. I went into this project knowing the job would cost in excess of $15,000 and ultimately be worth $12,000 on a good day. For me, it's the challenge and end product. Something I can be proud of, and enjoy, not to mention the preservation of history angle.

I realize, hands on restoration is NOT for everybody. Some people do not have the skills or time. If a person wants to have the work done by someone else and is willing to pay for it, that's just fine.

Sorry, I do not know anything reputable within your area.

Good Luck,
Terry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill's Auto Works Wakeman, Ohio on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 05:04 pm:

It is right at the end of you mileage range, but Manns Restoration in Festus, Mo is one of the best in the business!
God Bless
Bill Squires(owner)
Bill's Auto Works


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Schreiber- Santa Isabel Ecuador on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 05:12 pm:

Maybe I'm reading too much into the OP's statement that he wants it set up for durable touring. I read that as a long term ownership. In that regard, while Ronald won't get his money back, he will get to enjoy that 23 touring all that much sooner.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Kohnke Rebabbitting, Clare, Iowa on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 06:46 pm:

Ron, just call Les Anderson, of Anderson Restoration Service, in Kanawha, Iowa

There is none better!!!!!!!!!

641-762-3528

He does the jobs no one else will take on. He does all kinds of cars that you don't see!

Also a very nice Guy, and his wife Vicky. Have known him for over 45 years.

He even builds many first time showing point car.

Even if you don't use him, it would be worth the trip over, just to look around, and talk to him. He has several men working for him!

Herm.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald Evans on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 06:50 pm:

Thanks for the replies,
Gary is right. I just need to get it up and running better. Im the third owner of this T. I don't have the time right now to get it where its fun. Im trying to keep it original as possible.
Haven't found clubs that are close to me without traveling two hours.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 07:41 pm:

If you have the money you will find a shop that has the time.
If the body is pretty good and solid you could spend a reasonable amount to have a top notch driver.

Just be sure to get a good itemized bill of what you want done and the amount of time from the builder that it will take to build your T.
On something like this you need to get more than just a handshake no matter who you take your car to.

Getting the running gear in good shape is one thing. Restoring the body and a nice paint job will add a lot to the cost which you may not need.
Just trying to being realistic about it.
Good luck!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy Myers on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 12:02 pm:

I would highly recommend Adam Doleshal from Oconomowoc Wisconsin. He is relatively close to you and he specializes in the Model T. Adam does great work and is very reasonably priced.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Gregush Portland Oregon on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 12:35 pm:

Not that I can help in your location but I get the impression you are looking to get the car running IE running gear rebuilt rather then the car restored. If that is the case you would be looking for someone to do the running gear not restore the car.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dallas landers on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 12:40 pm:

Andy Loso up by St. Cloud MN. Does restoration. He is on the forum also.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 12:52 pm:

Once again thank you all for the replies. I will be calling on the names given. All the advice is helpful. For now the running gear is the most important. Magneto is bad, runs on battery. So to pull engine I'll just go through engine and transmission. Top and seats also need replacing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Coleman-Grand Marais MN/Detroit MI on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 01:27 pm:

Had a complete engine, transmission, magneto, and running gear restoration by Andy Loso in St. Joseph, MN. Superb workmanship.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By ROBERT BERGSTADT on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 03:33 pm:

Sanders antique auto restorations
Rockford Il
Bob


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brent in 10-uh-C on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 03:35 pm:


quote:

By Ed in California on Tuesday, October 31, 2017 - 04:17 pm:

Take a heart defibrillator with you. You are looking at least 75.00 dollars an hour, times about 1000 hours, plus parts and materials. In the end you have a very expensive restoration worth less than 10k.




Very interesting comment Ed. Is this $$ & hourly time figure based on firsthand knowledge of restoration shops -or is it just speculative?


Also, while on this topic I would be curious to know what Mr. Evans feels is a fair amount to pay to have his car restored.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Coco - Winchester Va. on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 03:56 pm:

There is a lot of antique auto restoration business going on in the area where I live, Shenandoah Valley I-81 corridor of Virginia.

Individuals with one man shops (wood, metal, upholstery) are getting $50 an hour.

Restoration shops are getting $65 to $85 an hour, though I do know of one specialist shop charging more.

One shop I know of that has restored Model A's, the cost is $80-100K for a "perfect" restoration. Usually it's some sentimental reason that drives someone to spend that much money on a car that will end up having less value finished than money spent.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed in California on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 04:28 pm:

I am probably high on the number of hours needed for a restoration, but the labor is about right.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Albert Lemon on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 04:37 pm:

As for a Andy Loso recommendation, CONSUMER BEWARE !!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 06:28 pm:

And then there is the view that you can buy a nice running T that's really road worthy for half or more what you would pay for a restoration of your own car. Which is true.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Loso St Joseph, MN on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 08:47 pm:

Wow John, where did that come from? I never have restored anything for you. All I sold you was a mostly complete touring car. I had purchased it thinking I would restore it, but after almost a year of moving it around and tripping over it, I decided to move it. I sold it to you for the exact price I paid for it after multiple attempts to sell it higher. I described it as it was sold to me. I even gave you the previous owner's phone number because you wanted to know more about. I never heard more from you and I figured you were satisfied. I have always been fair with everyone and if any of my customers are not happy I work with them until they are. A phone call or email would have been better than airing your 2 or 3 year old anger here.

Dave and Dallas; Thanks for the kind words.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brent in 10-uh-C on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 02:25 pm:


quote:

By David Coco - Winchester Va. on Wednesday, November 01, 2017 - 03:56 pm:
There is a lot of antique auto restoration business going on in the area where I live, Shenandoah Valley I-81 corridor of Virginia.

Individuals with one man shops (wood, metal, upholstery) are getting $50 an hour.

Restoration shops are getting $65 to $85 an hour, though I do know of one specialist shop charging more.

One shop I know of that has restored Model A's, the cost is $80-100K for a "perfect" restoration. Usually it's some sentimental reason that drives someone to spend that much money on a car that will end up having less value finished than money spent.




Hi David, I'm pretty sure you recently participated in a very similar topic on another forum where we all determined the average price around the country was in the $50-$60 range with the exception of the NE as their prices were higher.

As the owner of a restoration shop that does a large amount of Model-As, my findings over the years has been that it really isn't sentiment at all as you suggest, but more about desire. Their desire is to have a vehicle that is well above average in both aesthetics and mechanics (in other words, where everything works correctly and it looks like it is supposed to.). Often times they tell me they have been looking for several years and what they find on the market does not meet their standards, so they have a car restored to their level of expectation. Generally speaking, for that person it really isn't about the money or ROI. Two other key points to consider is that few people go thru life expecting to buy something cheaper than they can sell it for. Just this morning I purchased a new vacuum cleaner, and after just one use I doubt I could resell it for Ĺ of what I paid for it just a few hours ago. I didn't go to store with that intent, and I could probably have found a used one cheaper, but again that is not what I wanted. The same thing applies with new cars, new boats, new clothes, and on & on. Second, is some folks have talent yet they also have priorities. For example, I have a nice lawn mower in the garage, and I also can do a good job mowing and trimming my lawn at home however I hire a professional to do my landscaping at home as this allows me the freedom to do other tasks that have equal or greater priority. I realize I am likely 'preaching to the choir' here but folks really need to get over this dislike for a professional restorer or outsourcing work as the prevalence of this will likely increase in the years to come as fewer & fewer owners will have the talent or time necessary to do the job to the standards by which they are wanting.


Ohh ...and Ed, I think you are going the wrong way if you are adjusting your time estimate downward. Granted we have not discussed just how much of the restoration you are outsourcing, but for a shop capable of doing all of the work in-house, I think you are going to find you are way underestimating the time necessary to do the job correctly. Why don't you take a few moments and jot down on a piece of paper listing all of the tasks necessary to do a restoration, and then establish an estimate of time you feel it should take. Then add up your numbers and let us know what you come up with.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Joseph Kowalczyk - Nampa Idaho on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 03:08 pm:

I must add my two cents on Andy loso:

I just bought some nice parts from Andy, price was fair and he was very professional and a pleasure to deal with.

In the future, I will purchase more parts from Andy, he does a great job at packaging and quick shipping at a fair price.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dean Kiefer - Adams, MN on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 03:51 pm:

I have Andy do all my motor and transmission work. He does a very good job.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Albert Lemon on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 04:55 pm:

I see that you have made yourself out to be a saint, so I have to respond. You knew I wouldn't be driving out to get the car because of major medical issues and taking strong pain medications. The driver later told me when loading that the parts just didn't match the car pertaining to condition. Parts that wasn't pictured in your advertisement was absolute JUNK. So bad that they were rust/welded together, broken in pieces just didn't match the car. It was obvious that you cleaned out your dumpster and still didn't have enough parts to complete the "95% complete" as advertised.

I looked at the car when received in the trailer but did not go through it. Because of the medical issues and surgeries, I was unable to thoroughly go through the contents until a couple of months later. Then noticed things just didn't look right so we unloaded it and layed everything out on the shop floor and inventoried it. I had two other Model "T" guys look at the complete car. Both came to a conclusion that the parts didn't match the car and the car was not 95% complete as advertised. These guys checked it over on two different occasions, and said, "this car is only 25%-30% complete, that's a long ways from the 95% you advertised. You also advertised that the the upholstery was like new, you should have checked the boxes over more careful as I found the receipt from Snyders dated 1984 !!! This is just the "tip of the iceberg".

You guys that put in a good word for Mr. Loso may have had good dealings with him, but I got totally "sca-roood". It was my day, 47 years of dealing with antique/collector cars and have never got "shafted". I don't operate that way and expect the same in return. Mr. Loso woke one morning, feet hit the floor and said, "I'm going to screw somebody" and I was first on the list !!! WHY, there was no reason for it, you got paid cash, I got "dumpster junk" and a BOS. BTW: one of those guys that checked out the inventory and car use to be one of Mr. Loso's customer. Could not, would not believe it, then I showed him the BOS !!! I have absolutely NO REASON to lie about this, it happened and I sure's hell would like to know WHY ???


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ed in California on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 04:55 pm:

I agree, I probably underestimated the numbers of hours needed for a complete restoration, and agree itís probably more. I do not have a dislike for professional restoration shops, nor am I knocking them. I merely stated the obvious that most people are stunned at the cost of a proper complete restoration when presented with the tally. If I had the means, I would farm out work on some of my toys, but I donít so I have to do it myself.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dufault on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 06:09 pm:

Awww shucks guys.

Surely, there are two sides to the story...but really, shouldn't this be done elsewhere...like between the two of you?

Awhile back there was another he said/he sold/no he didn't kind of argument that - frankly - doesn't help either one of you.

I have had no dealings with either, so cannot speak with direct knowledge of either. I've read posts by both of you over the years, and you are both seemingly kind, considerate gentlemen. Oh yes, I have been burned during my lifetime...and I can understand that sometimes disagreements develop. I have also read too many threads with bickering that does nothing to help the situation....and if anything, makes a person think less of our group as a whole.

Please guys, will one of you call the other and make peace...for the good of the hobby?

Thanks,

Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Frost on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 06:26 pm:

I'm with Matt. Try doing the things that are in your comfort level and you'll be surprised at what can be accomplished. I'm enjoying the hunt for parts and the refurbish of the parts I've found. Have a mostly complete 26 Coupe that I plan on restoring, but for now the 26/27 RPU project is a great learning experience that will help me through the workings of these easy to work on historic vehicles.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john kuehn on Thursday, November 02, 2017 - 06:30 pm:

I agree with the above post. Sounds like the buyer should have called the seller and straightened it out before ranting and raving on the forum.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tony Bowker, Ramona, CA on Friday, November 03, 2017 - 12:44 am:

I think it was Jay Leno who said you buy a car for $3000, dump $45,000 into it and it might be worth $13000 if youíre lucky.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Coco - Winchester Va. on Friday, November 03, 2017 - 06:28 am:

"Hi David, I'm pretty sure you recently participated in a very similar topic on another forum where we all determined the average price around the country was in the $50-$60 range with the exception of the NE as their prices were higher. "

Yes, my comments were directed at my area and the Northeast.

I agree many people restore professionally due to high quality. Anyone who's driven a really properly restored early car knows the feeling, the "trucky" reputation of old cars comes from worn out ones, not properly restored ones.

As to sentimental, in one shop I know there was an early '60's Cadillac four door being restored, ground up, cost in the six figures. Owner of shop had told the guy that for what he was going to spend, he could buy 5 or 6 such cars in nice shape. Owner's reply was "yes, but I was born in the back seat of THIS one!"...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Codman on Friday, November 03, 2017 - 11:41 am:

I do not know either John Albert Lemon or Andy Loso and have never had any dealings with either, but if John feels that Mr. Loso took advantage of him, it is my opinion that he should have spoken to the gentleman before venting on a national forum. I agree with John Kuehn.


Add a Message


This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Username:  
Password:

Topics Last Day Last Week Tree View    Getting Started Formatting Troubleshooting Program Credits    New Messages Keyword Search Contact Moderators Edit Profile Administration