Thank you Jay! A timely posting to be sure. Maybe one of our more computer capable people can work on the brightness and contrast to improve the view?
Clearly a '13, I can't be certain because of the faded condition, but it looks to have all brass lamps on it? The change from all brass to black and brass was not cleanly done. While a number of early pictures exist showing black and brass lamps on late '12s, early '13s are sometimes also seen with all brass lamps. How much of that mixing and matching was from the factory? And how much was the result of things dealers did? Is open to speculation?
Some other interesting details I think I see in this. Nice.
Link to the discussion of a beautifully restored '13 touring for sale.
I'll take a crack at it:
Note the doors do not extend down to the splash apron and the front fenders have a bill . The 13's had doors that went to the splash apron and the front fenders did not have a bill. Some of the first 14's used the 13 style front fender with no bill. But it was reinstated using the bill on all 14's
That sure cleared things up ! Great photo.
Well, since I just bought a 13 I have been reading up a lot.
The rear axle looks like a 11 12 with no bumps for the bolt that bolt the halves together. Randy
Randy M, That is one of the "other interesting details" I was noticing. But I have been fooled in the past due to the angle of the photo hiding the bolt bumps. I was and am not ready to commit to that one yet.
I am also not entirely convinced about it being a '13. It could actually be a late '12. Several photos have been seen showing late '12s with '13 style windshields. The lamps appear to be '12 style, and all brass. I could be wrong, but it looks to me that the doors go all the way down to the bottom of the body (a la '13). Unfortunately, between the fading of the photo, and reflections in the paint showing some background behind the photographer, it is not clear exactly where the door bottom is. And could that be the angle cut behind the front fender where the '12 removable doors detach?
I am willing to stick my neck out a bit. I think it is an early '13. But I would like to see a few other opinions from some of our other experts (not that I think I am an expert yet, still working on it). It looks to me that the front of the body curves in on its approach to the firewall, more like the '13. I think (?) the slab-side '12's approach is more straight. But I could be wrong.
Rear doors look to open from the front so not a 12. I am thinking 13 but hard to tell, could be 14 and owner or someone changed or polished the lamps?
Which way did the rear doors open on a 14?
I think also in 14 the door handles were low and inside not sticking up on top of the door. you can see the right rear handle just below the mans right hand.
I believe the lower body beading gives this one away, 1913. The windshield, door handles showing are also '13 as have already been pointed out. Here is a photo of another 1913 touring where the bead along the lower edge of the body is clear.
That bead does not appear on the 1914 style body along the side until the back of the rear door opening.
However, the very early 1914 style touring cars (July 1913) have that bead along the lower edge of the center panel of the rear tub. Later 1914 touring cars don't seem to have that bead
The late '14/'15 style front fenders must be replacement. Both cars have E&J lamps.
Ken in Texas
(Message edited by drkbp on November 17, 2017)
No one has mentioned how different the doors were in '14.
That photo appears to be a very early '13. There is striping on the doors. It appears to have 1912 lamps too. Too bad the photo isn't more clear. It would give us a lot of information.
Definitely a '13...long doors, handle sticking out the top of doors, windshield support...like Larry said, probly early enough to "carry over" left over lamp stock. Henry sure made it difficult sometimes to "put a year" on things!!
Perhaps a few more details:
That's what I like to see! Lots of comments and speculations about good evidentiary photos by good model T people seeking truths about what was done by Ford back in the day.
Speculation again, but this has been speculated before, and by people that know more than I do on the subject. Those fenders may also be carryovers from 1912 with the front bill still on them.
I am pleased to see others spot the "tall door handle" on the rear door. I do not know the timeline offhand for that change. However, I also do not put a lot of faith in its being there. Even that early, door handle extensions were an available after-market accessory. The car also has a top boot (cover? Larry?). However again, the picture does not show much detail of it.
One thing I do know. I would really like to have a T just like that one for myself and club activities.