Closed Car Door Locks & Keys

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2009: Closed Car Door Locks & Keys
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 08:00 pm:

I'm trying to locate photos and information on the different types of door locks used on the 24 - 27 Coupes, Tudors and Fordors. If anyone has an original door lock handy, could you look to see if there are any numbers on it and let me know what they are.

There should be two versions of the Yale lock (one has a swinging cover and I think the other does not), a Baird lock, a Briggs and Stratton lock, and a Miller lock. Ultimately I'm looking for some detail photos of each type of lock and the series numbers on the locks - but I'll take whatever partial information I can get.

Also, if anyone has any original door keys, I am looking for photos of those as well. I have an original Yale DF series key but I need photos of all of the rest.

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard G Goelz on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 09:11 pm:

Dave, i have an original door lock that has the number DF900 stamped on the side it is rusted up inside and i don't have a key. 24 Fordor, it will just fill the hole in the door.
Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 09:35 pm:

Rich,

Could you take some photo's of that lock for me. That is one of the Yale locks that I am looking for. My key is a DF793 which is the same series.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard G Goelz on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 10:05 pm:

Dave , i will be glad to, but i will be gone for about a week.
Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George House on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 03:47 pm:

Dave,
I'm the 2nd owner of a '27 Ford coupe. The nicely nickeled outer door lock has no markings or identification but the key has a Ford script on one side above the number 31113 and that number is above the letter 'A'. On the obverse side of the key is written: Briggs and Stratton Corp Milwaukee Wis USA with the letters BASCO inside an elongated diamond. Sorry, no digital camera


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By DAREL J. LEIPOLD on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 04:56 pm:

This is from my notes on Ford keys. "V) DIGIT system keys: Will Fit the1928-30 ignitions, tire locks and The Model T Ford door safety locks starting with the 1923 model fordor. Model A use did not include the ignition. Fits some of the spare tire locks. Used on Fordor blind- back sedans 1928-29 and probably the 1930 Fordor with a seperate door lock (not in the handle). (I have a pair marked “TIRE”) Round head with or without Ford script. Numbers of some will convert to 1928-29 ignition key numbers.Numbers 11111A - 33333A (Not every number, about 248) Grove 1 blank (ILCO 1098M or Curtis B1)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dare on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 05:29 pm:

May 26 1926 Tudor , door key original with ford logo one side F688 on the reverse on the small rectangular part Miller works key.

David


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dare on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 05:56 pm:

Pics of above Tudor / Miller Lock works key







Hope these Help.

Cheers David


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Miles on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 07:04 pm:

door lock on '25 coupe -- key has Briggs& Stratton on one side; other side has Briggs & Stratton Corporation, Milwaukee, Wis.U.S.A. with number stamped below -- H784; letter "B" underneath the number. Don't see any numbers on the lock itself. Have always assumed it was an aftermarket add-on, but maybe not?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Morse on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 09:48 pm:

I have a lock that came with my '23- '25 tudor body. No name or words on it, only the number DF725 on the side of the barrel. Any idea the manufacturer or if original? Any idea where I can find a key for it?

Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 01:54 am:

Thanks everyone for the information and the photos.

Mike, the DF725 is an original Yale lock. It is one of the two styles (the one without the little door). My coupe also has the DF series lock and I was able to find a DF series key at Hershey (but not the right one for my car or yours).

Scott, not sure about your Briggs & Stratton key. I just got a B&S lock I bought on Ebay. It has the 12312A number stamped on the side of the square shaft which falls in the range Darel specified above. I don't have the key - still need a photo of the B&S key.

David - excellent photos - thank you. The Miller lock is also an original lock. I have one other person report a Miller lock with an F series number.

Still looking for some good photos of a Yale FC series key (this is the lock with the swinging door). Also need the Yale HM series lock and key (don't know what they look like).

Thanks again everyone,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 02:59 am:

How is the lock mechanism removed from the door? I would like to take mine out and take it to a locksmith and see if he can make a key. Thanks in advance, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lee Crenshaw on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 08:17 am:

David, on my wood-framed late '23 coupe door
there is a set screw in the jamb area (adjacent to the lock) that secures the lock assembly in place. Loosen the screw and withdraw the lock from the outside of the door.
Lee


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 10:54 am:

David the door lock on my 24 Coupe is on the passenger side. If your door is like mine open up the door and on the side of the door frame you will see a small hole. This is where the lock set screw is. It is a slot head screw. Loosen the screw and you can push out the lock assembly from the inside. It will be tight but it will come out. Just push on it. The lock has a tail shaft on it about 2 1/2 inches long. On the side of the shaft is the key code. Go to your local locksmith and tell him to use the older hardback code books to find the correct key for it. Its not a big mystery to get a key for it. If they cant find the correct reference they can inpression a key for it. My door lock is the one without the cover. You might have a little trouble finding an original key. I removed mine and had 2 keys cut for it. It cost 16.00. Good luck!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By DAREL J. LEIPOLD on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 01:02 pm:

Here a photo of some of my keys. This board is for the Model A, but the Miller and Yale were used on the T as well.keys


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By DAREL J. LEIPOLD on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 01:11 pm:

Here are some Model T Keys. Sorry that the pictured is sideways. My scanner sits to close to my Imac.

Key Board


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 04:47 pm:

Darel,

Thanks for the photo's. Any chance of getting some close up's of both sides of the Ford Briggs & Stratton key. Is the Yale key Ford script and either an HM or FC series key? If so, could I get close ups of both sides of that as well?

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Dizer on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 09:08 pm:

Dave, I sent you 3 photos of my 25 coupe key and lock to your email address since I don't know how to post them! Mine is a stamped steel key with ford on one side and the number on the other. The lock has been painted so no number visable on the outside. I think it still works but have had no reason to try it recently. Feel free to post the photos for others if you want! Bill Dizer


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 10:07 pm:

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the photo. That is an original Yale DF series key.

Yale DF
Yale DF Key


Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tuser on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 11:05 pm:

Here is my contribution from a '23 4-dor.
LOCK
KEY


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 11:33 pm:

I replaced the lock on my 27 Coupe with a 1950's vintage Ford door lock. It was new then but its an antique now and still works well.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 11:47 pm:

tuser,

That is one of the keys I've been looking for. Is the other side Ford script? If so, could you post a photo of that side?

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tuser on Friday, October 30, 2009 - 01:19 am:

No, this is the key that came with the car from the original owner and it is marked YALE, as is the lock.



Hope this helps,
Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Friday, October 30, 2009 - 08:35 am:

That lock assembly is the same as the one used up to 1948 on the pickup truck and is listed with most Model A parts list. The only difference is that about an inch the square shaft has to be cut off. The price with two keys is about $12 to $15.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By DAREL J. LEIPOLD on Friday, October 30, 2009 - 02:10 pm:

The yale key is blank - no Ford or number. Here is the B & S key.

key Board


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 01:45 am:

A little off topic, but what is a good way to tighten up the door latches on a '25 coupe. Mine have about 1/4 inch slack in them and rattle like crazy. I don't see any adjustment to them short of welding up the latch and striker plate. Will replacing the rubber door bumpers solve this? If so, does anyone reproduce them? Also, how does the driver's side door lock? Thanks in advance, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 01:49 am:

Oops, I forgot. Dave S., my door lock doesn't have any numbers on the outside that I can see. I will let you know if I find anything when I pull the lock. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 11:26 am:

David, the inside drivers side door lock on my 24 Coupe has a small nickel plated lever which locks the door from the inside. The lever is about 1 1/2 inches long. It is mounted on the lock assembly and has a small estucheon behind it. The rubber door bumpers are avaliable from Langs and I think Macs.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 03:19 pm:

Thanks John. My coupe doesn't have anything but the inside door latch. It was reupholstered in the early '60's and maybe they covered it up. Can anyone post a picture of the lock? Many thanks, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 06:51 pm:

David
I tried 3 times to upload a pic of the lock with no success. I did send a pic to Dave Snosski of the lock. Maybe he can send you a pic.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 02:03 am:

John, thanks for trying. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 09:57 am:

MACs offers three different locks that all work when the shaft is cut to a proper length. Langs and Snyders also has the lock.

Click http://www.parts123.com/parts123/yb.dll?parta~partsort for MACSs on-line catalog showing the lock.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Aber on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 11:22 am:

For some reason some browsers will not connect to the above link. If you get an invalid error try:
http://www.macsautoparts.com/


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 12:50 am:

Everyone,

Thanks for the photos and information. It's been a great help.

John,
Here is the photo you sent me. It's a good thing you found the escutcheon plates, they are almost impossible to replace.

Inside Door Lock Lever

David,
I had the problem with a 1/4" slack in the door. The problem I had was that someone replaced the striker plates with ones from a Centerdoor sedan. The ramp on the centerdoor ones are about 1/4" shorter than the coupe ones. Don't know if that's your problem or not, but if you post a photo of the striker plate I can tell if they are correct or not.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 02:18 am:

Thanks Dave, that is a possibility. They don't seem to be worn that bad. I don't have a way to post pictures, but if you could give me some dimensions maybe I could tell what I've got. I definately don't have that lock mechanism, apparently it is covered up and the lever is missing. Again, many thanks. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 09:58 am:

Dave,

I found this photo. The cast one on the right is for the centerdoor. The stamped metal one on the left is for the 24-25 closed cars. The 26-27 are different again - a two piece adjustable one. I don't have the pieces handy right now, but if you need dimensions I can measure it tonight.

When closed, the latch slides over the end of the piece, not just the notch. The one on the right is about 1/4" shorter and doesn't hold the door fully closed.

Strike Plates

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John on Monday, November 02, 2009 - 11:37 am:

Dave. Thanks for uploading the pic of the inside drivers door lock for David and everyone to see. David you are probably right that your upholstry is covering up the shaft that the handle and estucheon fits over. The shaft is very short and the buldge wouldnt show under the upholstry. I was very lucky in that I didnt loose the lever and the estucheon over the years. They were left in a can in and old storage bldg and had fell out of the can into the dirt. I just happened to see them after laying in the dirt for over 15 years! John


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:48 am:

Dave, thanks for those pics. Mine are different than either one of those strikers. They are a rectanguler shape with just two attatching holes rather than the T shaped styles in you pic. The recessed area of the wood that they set in have the same rectanguler shape, no place for screws to the outside of the rectangular area. I'll try to get my daughter to get some pics and see if we can get them posted. I figure I've got you completely confused by now! Many thanks, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 01:23 am:

Dave,

If they look like this:

http://www.modeltford.com/item/50060-1X.aspx

They are 26-27 Coupe and Tudor.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:38 am:

No Dave, they don't look like those either. They are similar in over all shape, but are made differently. Thanks again, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 09:50 am:

If you can post a photo I would like to see what they look like. When I went back through my notes on these I noticed a big read note to remind me to do more research on these. I had two different part numbers down for this part.

I just looked in the parts book again and here is what is listed.

T-9060 = 15 - 23 Coupe and Centerdoor
T-17276 = 24 - 25 Coupe and 24 Tudor
T-17490 = 25 Tudor.
T-50060 and T-50061 = Assembly for 26 - 27

I also looked through my photos. While I don't have a good photo of the 25 striker plate, it appears from what I do have that the 25's may have used the 26-27 adjustable style. Can someone with a 25 Coupe (steel doors) please post a photo of their strike plate!

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 09:54 am:

One more thing, the strike plates do fit into a rectangular slot in the door post.


1924 Strike Plate

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Morse on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 10:13 am:

Dave S., do you know if anyone is reproducing the strike plates you are showing? I'm looking for a pair for my '24 wood-framed tudor.

Mike


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:20 pm:

Hi Mike,

Nobody that I know of is reproducing them. I was lucky in that last year at Hershey I found some for one of my coupes. I'd been looking for years!

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 12:51 pm:

Dave, I have an extra door latch with the escutcheon plate if anybody's looking for one.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Morse on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 02:07 pm:

Dave, thanks for the info, but that's what I was afraid of. I'll figure something out eventually.

Jack, I'm interested. Would you mind emailing me with condition and price?

Thanks!
Mike
mhrbmorse@myfairpoint.net


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 05:35 pm:

Jack, are you talking about the door latch or the inside lock lever and escutcheon plate? I need the latter. Thanks, Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 06:40 pm:

Here is what I sent to mike.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 07:50 pm:

FYI, those door latches are for a 1924. On the 1925 version, the piece that sticks out to hold the door closed is wider and is stamped steel instead of cast. The lock lever and escutcheon plate are the same for 24 and 25.

Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Tuesday, November 03, 2009 - 07:58 pm:

The plating could be better on the pieces,but they are so difficult to find. I picked this one up at Chickasha two years ago.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 02:03 am:

Jack, I sent you an email.
Dave S. The piece that sticks out to hold the door closed on mine is stamped, as are the striker plates. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 08:01 am:

No email here yet anyway.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 01:25 pm:

OK, tried again. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 05:13 pm:

Dave ,try jackdaron@aol.com


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 05:29 pm:

The Cole Y-11 repro key blank fits most of those locks.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave_Sosnoski on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 05:55 pm:

Jim,

Thanks for the info on the repro. locks and keys. I'm working on the lock and key section for my book on the 24 - 25 coupe so I really need photo's of the original locks and keys as supplied by Ford.

I have found most of the locks. The only one missing is the Yale HM series which doesn't seem to exist. There appears to be two versions of the Briggs & Stratton lock as the Record of Change on June 6, 1926 says it was updated to the sample provided by B & S. I have a B&S lock patented on Dec. 29, 1925 but I'm not sure if that is the early or late style or what the difference is. If anyone has an earlier or later patent date could you please let me know.

Thanks,
Dave S.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dare on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 06:06 pm:

Why is Ford ignition key # 55 the most common key ???
I have that key too.......why not key 28 or 61 , why 55 , does that mean l can start and drive away quietly, the greatest number of T's with my ignition key ?

David.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 06:12 pm:

OK Jack, I tried it again. For some reason I can't seem to send you an email through the forum. It always says message sent, but it doesn't get there. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 06:17 pm:

Dave, I can send you a photo of the new repro and an old repro key that I just found today.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A. Golden on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 06:54 pm:

Dave, interestingly the repro lock has the key grooves reversed from the original lock key that the Y-11 will replace. There is probably a Y-10 or Y-12 key that will work in the repro lock. I'll have to check that number on my next trip to a hardware store.

Here is a not-so-good photo of the repro cylinder assembly B-7121984 for 1928/48 Passenger and Pickup Door Lock Cylinder and Keys made by Vintique Inc.

Keys

The Vintique key is next to the assembly. The early Cole National Y-11 key is next, then the Ace Hardware Y-11 key (that is made in Taiwan) and a round head # 55 Ford Ignition key which must be for an after-market switch.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Chaffin on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 08:19 pm:

We are looking into making the 26-27 door locks. Have one sample but no latch. Are all of the manufacturers interchangeable? Also need a sample 23-25 closed car lock and latch. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 11:16 pm:

Jack, did you get my email yet? Our IP was down for a while yesterday. Just checking. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jack daron-Indy. on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 11:22 pm:

Nope.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Friday, November 06, 2009 - 12:31 am:

Jack, once more. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dennis Fleming on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 10:09 pm:

Dave S., Here is some pics of 24 drivers latch.
Dennis F.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Saturday, November 14, 2009 - 03:25 am:

Dave Sosnoski, I just tightened up the screws in the door latches and striker plates on our '25 coupe this evening and noticed that they are nickel plated, at least most of them are. Just thought I'd share that. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Wolf on Thursday, November 26, 2009 - 12:01 am:

I bought a 3 lb coffee can full of old automotive keys at an auction about a month ago and have found this tread very helpful in I.D.ing most of the old Ford keys. The prize in the can... At least for me was the ring of 65, GM "Try-Out Keys" or sometimes called "Lock-Out Keys". With this set of keys I can open almost every 40's, 50's and 60's GM car. The other keys are a bonus :>) Thank you for all the GREAT information!!!

Roger


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Richard G Goelz on Thursday, November 26, 2009 - 09:47 am:

Seeing these latches reminds me that i still need one each lock escutcheon and one window crank escutcheon to finish off my 24 Fordor any condition is OK. Thanks
Rick


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Wolf on Thursday, November 26, 2009 - 09:33 pm:

[IMG]http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii291/TheRockTumbler/MVC-006F-6.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii291/TheRockTumbler/MVC-007F-4.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii291/TheRockTumbler/MVC-006F-4.jpg[/IMG]


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Roger Wolf on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 12:45 am:

Dave S.

I tried to send you a message but it came back... You are welcome to use the photos of the old Ford key.

Roger Wolf


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Sosnoski on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 02:00 am:

Thanks Roger,

Dave S.


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