Please bare with me-TT speedster questions

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2009: Please bare with me-TT speedster questions
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 02:45 pm:

Questions in setting up a TT frame speedster. I have found a warford tranny off a TT. SO,
1st. The TT warford will bolt to my car tranny.
2nd. In order to gain the drive line lenght Im after, will the orginal full lenght driveshaft and torque tube bolt up to the warford? This will lenghten my drive line perhaps a foot +/-?
Thank you for putting up with this brain storming. Before I go out and spend a lot of money then find out it would work, I though I would ask for facts or opinions. After this I will leave you alone.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Seth Harbuck - Shreveport, LA on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 03:14 pm:

Ty,

You need TWO extra feet, don't you? The wheelbase on the car is 100", the wheelbase on the TT is 124" and the engines are in exactly the same place on both.

I understand that you are going for the "Stutz Bearcat" look, but have you considered what all that extra wheelbase is going to look like with only a 56" wide track (or 60" if you find rare southern wide track components)?

Seth


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 03:56 pm:

Good point Seth. The extra two feet and the narrow track will look like I did 32 years ago. Long and skinny.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR. on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 07:26 pm:

Here is the car I built last year for the folks with the wedding chapel. It has a 124" wheelbase, same as the TT, and it is lowered 4". I added 12" in the driveline by adding a KC Warford, and the other 12" is in front of the engine to get the long hood look. Maybe this will be of some help to you, Tyrone.

MC


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 08:00 pm:

Nice, Mike.

Moving the engine back would give better balance for cornering, too.

I wouldn't worry about the car looking too skinny for its length; all cars of the era had 56 or 60" track, including this Olds Unlimited.

olds

What is it about the TT that interests you, Ty?

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Edward J. Baudoux on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 10:26 pm:

That Olds just may be the best looking car I have ever seen.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 10:46 pm:

Just for you, Edward. This one is at the Nethercutt Collection in Sylmar, Calif.

olds1

olds3


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 10:57 pm:

That is excellent Mike. Restores my faith in that it can be done. What is the interest in a TT as a speedster Rick? I guess its because I have two hairs i did not pull out when I was building my racer. I don't know Rick, just want to see if I can do it. I like T speedsters but because of my height the T is just a bit to short looking.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jeff Humble on Monday, November 30, 2009 - 11:10 pm:

Isn't a TT Warford an under drive?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ricks - Surf City on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 12:56 am:

I can appreciate feeling outsized for a T racer, Ty.

I have a Langbein overdrive for a TT that's 1.5:1, which would still be hi revving with 7:1 TT gears, but not so bad with 5:1 or whatever it is.

rdr


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 01:22 am:

Tyrone, still haven't recieved your email.
Jeff, they had an over and under drive, three speeds in sll. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 01:31 am:

Dave, I will shoot you an email in the morning.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Walker, NW AR. on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:33 am:

Tyrone -- You might not need 24" of extra length, 12" may be plenty. On the car pictured above, I put 12" of the extra length between the front and rear seats. Without a back seat, your car will have a l-o-o-o-o-n-g body. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Clary on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:48 am:

You can pick up some distance with an auxilliary transmission. I would consider moving the engine back and possibly converting to a 3 spring chassis utilizing the extra frame length in front of the radiator. Or better yet consider and eight cylinder speedster. There is one in the midwest with 2 T engines back to back. I would not even consider using the TT rear end.

Andy


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thunder on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 10:10 pm:

Tyrone... Bolt a regular "T" axle, with high speed gears, where it belongs. Install your auxiliary trans, then your engine/trans assembly, with a relocated/extra front crossmember. Lengthen the starter crank, then you are set. By doing it this way, you dont need to lengthen the drive shaft, and you improve the weight distribution, by moving the engine back a bit. Set your sear, according to the pedal location, and put the fuel tank behind the seat, this will further improve the WD. Then all you need, is a longer steering shaft. Maybe one from a Torpedo will work, maybe you need to make a longer one. Shim/wedge, the steering gear accordingly...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:07 pm:

Thunder - Sounds like a "plan", except perhaps for one small detail that might be worth considering:

Not being critical, but even with "moving the engine back a bit", putting the fuel tank behind the seat will probably increase the distance from the tank to the carburetor, which will make the car more sensitive to fuel starvation with less than a full tank when going uphill. Might be that a "4-gallon hill" would then be a "6-gallon hill" or even a "full tank hill",....ha,ha,......just something to consider.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:08 pm:

Thank you all. I feel I have enough info to go forward with this car.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By tyrone thomas on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:19 pm:

Harold, would the starvation also be effected by the height I mount my gas tank? On my racer I used the normal T intake with an NH with a gas tank mounted some 4.5 feet away, with the tank outlet just below the frames top rail. Granted if I have less then 1.5 gallons I will run out of gas. On this car I want to build the carb will be a little higher mounted but the gas tank will sit 4-6 inches above the frame.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:27 pm:

Well, yeah.....the higher the tank, the better. I suppose you could always go to an electric fuel pump though if need be, right?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thunder on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:31 pm:

Harold. In theory, you're right. But in application, the distance from the engine, and the angle of the hill, would probably be minimal. Besides, a fuel tank, under the seat, would raise the center of gravity, because the driver would be higher up there. The fuel tank BEHIND the seat, allows the seat to be lower. Which would lower the CG. On level ground, there would be absolutly, no difference.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:47 pm:

Whew! You're start'n to loose me Thunder; I can't quite see what center of gravity has to do with fuel flow, but I was just saying that the relationship between the height of the fuel tank/fuel level to the height of the carburetor as compared to the distance the tank is from the carburetor is something to consider, and you obviously have considered that.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thunder on Tuesday, December 01, 2009 - 11:54 pm:

CG has nothing to do with fuel flow. Safety and handling, have a relationship with CG.

As far as the fuel tank height, moving it to the rear, does not affect flow ON LEVEL GROUND. On a hill, there will be SOME affect. And actually... I never thought of that. I'm hoping that your you're not right on this one. LOL. I guess that I'll find out when I head to the mountains...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 12:02 am:

Yeah, and then if all else fails, ya' can always back up, right?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thunder on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 12:51 am:

I havent even learned how to drive it forward yet....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andy Clary on Wednesday, December 02, 2009 - 11:32 am:

Most speedsters of the era had hand pumps to pressurize the tank. It doesn't take much pressure and you can build a pump from a swap meet radiator pressure tester.

Andy


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