Last night I went to see "Public Enemies". Not bad, but obviously made by young folks who got a few things wrong. In one scene Johnny Depp as Dillinger turns on the radio, and immediately there's music without waiting for the tubes to warm up. A piece of music heard on the radio more than once in 1933 is Benny Goodman playing the classic Fletcher Henderson arrangement of "King Porter Stomp", which was released in 1935, two years after Dillinger was shot dead. Quite a bit of hand-held camera to let you know you are in the presence of Art, but still not bad.

Movie people are notorious for getting things wrong, because they are going for the "feel" and the average movie-goer won't know the difference or even care.

This is especially apparent in several period movies like: "Ragtime", "The Sting", "Oh, Brother" and "Leatherheads". Clothing inaccurate, cars not of the correct year or type, music incorrect (not the soundtrack but incidental set music), and locations used.

I've had the pleasure to work in 9 motion pictures and TV dramas and none of them are correct. Speaking up gets you nowhere. Sometimes, however, the prop people would listen to you. Especially if you were the one they contacted about set pieces, as in my case.

"...two years after Dillinger was shot dead".
Two schools of thought about that subject. Many crime buffs believe it was NOT John Dillinger who was shot that night near the Biograph theater, rather it was a small time John Dillinger look-a-like thief, who had been set up to play Dillinger. During the examination of the body at the morgue, the dead man's eyes were a different color than Dillinger's, signs of past wounds were missing that should still be present, no evidence of scarlet or rheumatic fever was seen that Dillinger once had and a few other inconsistencies. The FBI realized they had the wrong man, but covered it up. The deal with Anna Sage (the "Woman in Red") to save her from deportation if she set up Dillinger for the FBI fell through because she had given them the wrong man. She was sent back to Rumania, despite her assistance.
So what happened to the real John Dillinger? He must have settled down and lived an honest life below the radar screen afterwards because nothing ever surfaced about him again.
Marshall
P.S. I haven't seen the movie yet. Was this subject touched upon?

According to the FBI Website, Dillinger was killed July 22, 1934.....end of story for them.

Always remember: Hollywood's job is to entertain; not educate.

The problem with the movie folks getting so much stuff wrong is when I watch it,I loose the plot trying to fiqure out all the inaccuracys.

In the "Changling" it's supposed to be 1928, a bright, shiny 1915 with all the brass highly polished passes before the camera, doubt if that would have been the case. Usually the ad's in the paper read something like "Need cars from approximatly 1935 or earlier". They just want to fill up the streets & curbs with old cars. I learned my lesson, I used to bring up the anachronisms about cars in movies, My wife would punch me on the arm "Shut up, I'm trying to watch the movie".

Best Anacrhonism, Shakspeare, "Julius Ceaser" "the Clock doth now strike Midnight" fact is the Romans didn't have clocks or anything close, it was a new invention during the Bard's lifetime. If we can ignore that line, we can ignore little errors in Movies, after all you had to find a co-signer to buy the tickets.

Alex

Mack, me too. They need to update some of their sound effects. Dave

I've seen a lot of modern wire-tie hay bales in cowboy movies.
We have watched a movie a few times where Glen Ford drives his T-Bird from the Monterey airport to his ranch while the car (shifting lever) was in Park.

The Bridges of Madison County was filmed in my home town and I couldn't help but notice the modern tractors and big round hay bales, that were invented ten years later, in the background.

When I learned to drive, I thought I had to continually turn the steering wheel back and forth, because that's how they did it in the movies. I never did figure out why they always got in and out on the passenger side.

How about Henry Fonda wearing a wristwatch in "Drums along the Mohawk" or Fred McMurray wearing a wedding ring (he plays a bachelor)in "Double Indemnity" or the ever popular tire tracks in a western or power lines in the distance, once in a while you'll see a jet stream in the sky. "That's Entertainment".

When I was in school, we'd go to enjoy the movie. Then go see it again to find the mistakes.
Alex

I did see the Henry Fonda wrist watch, only after it was pointed out on TCM or some blooper show. In the early 70's movies, in the chase scenes The old Mopars always crashed and burned. Too bad they cancelled Mystery Science Theater 3000.

In "Bullet" during the big chase scene, until they leave the hills of San Fransico, there's a little VW Bug behind Steve McQueen keeping perfect pace with his Mustang, up & down the hills, bad piece of back projection. Did it detract from the movie, no, it's only after the 10th time you see the movie do you notice it.

Alex

I've worked on quite a few movies and the one thing we always had to point out to the designer was that in, say, 1935, a 1935 car would be the exception - most cars on the street would be up to 10yrs old, maybe 20yrs and there would be plenty of horses still working as well.

A lot of Hollywood stuff, especially TV where the budget is smaller, makes the mistake of just getting the local car club in, so the street is full of restored cars (usually racks of Model As) whose owners obviously howl if the props people dare to approach with a bucket of Fuller's Earth to 'dirty-down' their treasure.

Usually it doesn't matter, as has been said above, it's the story-telling that does matter. But I remember one case where an anachronism/error ruined a film for me. The spy was telling his story in flash-back and we, the audience, were trying to see if he was lying. A German interrogator in 1942 offered him a beer in a can! He WAS lying - he'd never been in Germany, Germans still haven't embraced the beer-can and all German beer back then was definitely in bottles.

Except he wasn't lying, the props people were ignorant.

A lot of historical details are incorrectly presented in the movies. "Hollywoodland," which portrayed a single private detective investigating the suicide death of George Reeves, might be a good example. This private detective was an amalgam of a number of individuals presented by the movie as a single person. Other gaffes in other movies, like the tube radio that plays immediately instead of warming up, are a little less serious--you can't get absolutely everything right when you're shooting on schedule and budget.

The movie, "Saving Private Ryan," was an historical movie very loosely based on the true story of the Niland Brothers, wherein, during the final scenes, P-51 Mustangs were used incorrectly in place of P-47 Thunderbolts--not a detail vital to the story, but still wrong. The producer, of course, can always shrug his shoulders and say, "Hey, it's just fictional entertainment." That's true, but the audience tends to assume that the background surrounding the fictional characters in an historical movie will be correct. A simple disclaimer reminding the audience that this is a work of fiction would be helpful.

Historical movies can be done right, though. "Das Boot," the story of a fictional U-boat crew, got the background historical details and technical stuff spot-on correct.

Surprisingly, the biggest offender seems to be the History Channel, which regularly makes significant, glaring mistakes (though I'll hereby limit my criticism of them to the category of historical aviation, a subject with which I'm intimately familiar). Now, the History Channel is not portraying anything fictitious and so it becomes incumbent upon them to make sure there are no mistakes in the spoken narrative. A documentary is a documentary.

Bob

"The Model T Ford was designed to run on alcohol."

We once had a club chairman who definitely ran his T on alcohol, he usually had at least 3 large ones at lunch stops.

"The Model T Ford was designed to run on alcohol" is a popular lie among the pseudo environmentalists these days. It is utter hogwash, but has been repeated in so many newspaper articles and political speeches that it has taken on a life of its own.

Royce -

Look at this video - it will make you cringe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qDYoEupI28

About 20 years ago, Mr. Blume wrote a book called "Alcohol Can Be a Gas." It has recently received a lot of attention. If you read the editorial review of this book on Amazon.com, you will see some totally absurd comments related to John D. Rockefeller and Henry Ford.

If you watch other David Blume videos on YouTube such as the one below, you will see an incredibly misinformed individual.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-Y08RSDP6s

Erik Johnson

What a clueless idiot Blume is.

Alex,

In that same chase scene in Bullitt, they pass the same green VW no less than three times.

My whole problem with the movie "Ragtime" was the fact that they took the book and made a movie out of it as though all of the events were happening at the same time, and not as in the book as a period of years.

Case in point: Harry Thaw shot and killed Stanford White in 1906, and was tried twice: once in 1907 and again in 1908. Main protagonist in the story is Coalhouse Walker, Jr an accomplished pianist and proud owner of a brand new Model T. However, the Model T he owns is from 1915 or 16 and was backdated to look like it was about 1909 or 1910. Car was black, three door, Klaxon brand horn, but had a Brass windshield, and brass windshield stantions. It also had three pieces of glass in the rear curtain. Can't remember if it had gas lights or electric. The car would eventually be vandalized (not sure where that set was located, but it looks like a small rural town in NY.) The same car appeared at the end of the movie (in front of the JP Morgan Library (NYC set at studio in London).

Now I am sure there would have been other options available to them to use.

Ragtime was the first movie I worked on, the UK work was all done on an enormous backlot set at Shepperton Studios, just by London Heathrow Airport, so we had to shoot in between planes taking off! It was also middle of winter with a howling wind coming across the reservoir - standard wear was longjohns, then pyjamas, then your costume. My 09 was in the scene with Jimmy Cagney riding in a '14 Studebaker.

The cars were rented in from various sources, trucks were fakes. The Model T was the only vehicle actually bought in by the studio.

Thank you for the information. I actually missed relating that the Model T is shown to be only in 5 places: Mother and Father's house (New Rochelle, NY but actually in Mt. Kisko, NY), the Emerald Isle Firehouse (unknown to me set location), briefing scene with Commissioner Waldo and Police Department (London), JP Morgan Library (London), and Brother driving it away on a deserted street (I assume, London). Here's more on that....there are a lot of historical inaccuracies in this movie.....

Jimmy Cagney was in his 80's but the man he portrayed was police commissioner from 1911 to 1913 and was only 34 when he became police commisssioner. He started the NYPD Motor Cycle Squad which later became the NYC Highway Patrol.

Therefore, Waldo would not have met Thaw as police commissioner at White's party in 1906 or any other time. The whole damn story was crowbarred together to make a coherent movie. Thaw's lawyer is portrayed with the correct name, but that assumes there was only one trial; he was not present at the second trial.

The Essex and Sussex Hotel (portrayed to be in Atlantic City) is actually in Spring Lake, NJ; nowhere near AC. After being abandonded for 17 years, it is currently a senior living condo for ages 62 and up. Maybe I'll get a room there, someday......

dang it Alex,now I gota watch Bullit agin!

William,
When "Ragtime" came out the critics had the same problem, little continuity. Also I didn't like the way they deviated from the book, I would have like to have seen the fire chief rebuild the car instead of just rolling up a new one, the meeting with J.P, Morgan & Henry Ford. I think the book covers maybe five years. The movie takes place within months it was like the old joke "Why did God creat Time?" "To keep everything from happening at one time"

Alex

In the movie "K-Nine" with Jim Belushi, which was filmed here in San Diego, he takes a leap from the roof of the Sanford Hotel onto the roof of the Carnation Dairy building, he should have tried out for the Olympics, there at least 20 blocks apart.

Bob Coiro is right on target with this

"Surprisingly, the biggest offender seems to be the History Channel, which regularly makes significant, glaring mistakes (though I'll hereby limit my criticism of them to the category of historical aviation, a subject with which I'm intimately familiar)."

Be it due to erroneous information, or due to lack of research, I have seen a few misleading comments/situations, on the History Channel. One of my favorite channels BTW. But in answer to the movie, "Public Enemies" sometimes accuracy is waived, in order to make an entertaining film. A perfect example would be "Broken Arrow". A great action film, but also, with a few, inaccuracies.

Back to the movie in question, certain other inaccuacies, have been noted elsewhere.
http://www.oldgas.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=144615#Post144615

So, you wanna pick nits in movies, eh? Well, here's the website that will make your day:
http://www.nitpickers.com/tv/nitpick.cgi?np=1375.
It's hoot for movie buffs, who like to catch inconsistencies and anachronisms.

Marshall

I've always wondered about the myth of Dillenger's alledged over large "personality" (to be delicate). I would assume the lack of such would also show, along with eye color, they shot the wrong man.

Marshall thanks for the link.

Alex