Questions about the 1912 engine.

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2018: Questions about the 1912 engine.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 07:10 am:

During the disassembling of the 1912 engine, last Sunday, a few questions came to me.
- What was the original color of the engine?
- As I took the valve covers of a lot of oil came out. There are no holes to make the oil going back to the oil pan. Should I drill a hole in each chamber to give the oil a way back to the pan?
Other questions will come during he cleaning I think.

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William Hoffer on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 07:41 am:

Andre, I ran into the same thing yesterday while cleaning up my 1911. Opened the cover and all this old, foul oil came pouring out. What a mess.

I asked Russ Potter about this, and he told me the early closed valve engines are made this way. He said guys will drill a hole in the center of the valve cavity right below the stud that holds the cover. That lets the oil drain back into the block. I will do this when I rebuild the engine down the road.

Cheers, Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry & Sharon Miller, Westminster, CO on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 07:58 am:

There was another thread, about this same problem, just recently. The answer was, there were no holes in the early blocks due to broached ridges in the tappet holes which were supposed to allow the oil to drain back into the pan. Evidently, the ridges wore, got plugged, or just didn't work. In any case the valve gallery would have to be filled to the top of the lifter bosses and would have no way to drain until you removed the cover.

The answer Ford used was to drill 1/4" holes, through the block, to allow the oil to drain.

You should probably search to find the thread and view the photos there. I'm sure there are members with exact locations for the holes.

Good Luck,
Terry


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Val Soupios on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 09:27 am:

Drill the holes! My '14 smoked like a chimney until I did.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith, Lomita, California on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 10:10 am:

If you want to drill the holes like Ford did in later blocks, find a later block to copy, and that way you will get the same size hole, in the correct location.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.V. Anderson on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 10:37 am:

Val, when was your '14 built? Mine was cast in April and assembled in August. It had the oil holes drilled. Of course, that's not to say they weren't done sometime between 1914 and 1976, when the previous owner acquired it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 11:19 am:

R.V. and Larry,

The 1914 runabout has the holes too and I didn't drill them, the 1912, I repair last year, had the holes that's why I was wondering?

Does anyone know what color was the engine? Now it is green as the 1926/27 are. Should it be black??

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By R.V. Anderson on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 12:26 pm:

Andre, I'm certain it should be a sort of sloppy, semi-gloss black if it's painted at all. I could well be wrong but I believe that the only DOCUMENTED evidence of painted engines begins with the 1914 models. I'm not saying the earlier ones weren't, just that there's nothing documented. I think.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William Bennett on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 12:34 pm:

I notice everybody is avoiding the question about engine color. I guess that means everybody is wiser than I!! Factory photos that have surfaced indicate the engines were not painted at all. Some folks paint the engine black, others use a paint that looks like bare cast iron. I've seen early engines painted gray, red, green, and just about every color in the rainbow. Which is correct? I don't think anybody really knows for sure. I would guess that green is not correct, but if you like green engines, I would say, it's your car, paint it to suit your desires. I think I'd better be quiet now, don't want to stir up too much controversy!! Enjoy your "T" and have fun!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Val Soupios on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 05:25 pm:

R. V. my Touring is a March car and had no drains but my Runabout is May and has them. I also have a bare block with with no holes but can't remember the month. I have a August '14 block that has the holes but always considered that to be a '15.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James J. Lyons III - West Virginia on Thursday, January 18, 2018 - 06:23 pm:

My June 1913 block has one hole in one compartment and nothing in the other!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Friday, January 19, 2018 - 05:49 am:

Drilled two 1/4" holes and set 7 V-coil to repair the threads for the head bolts, one to go for the water inlet.

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Friday, January 19, 2018 - 05:50 am:

Sorry you call it Heli-coil.

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By William Hoffer on Friday, January 19, 2018 - 06:16 am:

Andre, did you drill the holes with the crank and cam in the block? I am considering doing this now, and not wait for a complete rebuild. Cheers, Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Friday, January 19, 2018 - 08:31 am:

William,
The block is empty and ready to go to the machine shop for the cylinder job. It will leave as soon as the .040 oversize pistons arrive.

I choose this size because, after measuring the four cylinders, I found they were bore nearly to .030 oversize ( pistons in the motor say .020 over). I took an old cast iron .030 over piston and tried to push it through the cylinders. In two it went through without any problem. The two other needed a hone job and the piston fitted too.
See: "It smoke and eat oil" . http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/822076/827387.html?1516153675

Andre
Belgium


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andre Valkenaers on Friday, January 19, 2018 - 11:06 am:

Here few photos of the works.

To drill the holes for the V-coils, I mount the cylinder head on the block and used it as a guide.
Notice the difference in length of the head bolt. They have all cut marks.

Andre
Belgium


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