So I am new to the Model T world. I just purchased mine this past Saturday (2/3/2018). The owner has been after me to buy it for about 3 yrs.
He gave me the history of the truck: It was purchased new in Oklahoma. When the Dust Bowl hit, they packed up the truck and moved to California (not Beverly Hills). They used it until the mid-'50's and then parked it behind the barn.
In 1995 they put it up for sale in Hemmings, where owner #2 saw it. It was shipped back to Oklahoma where he picked it up and brought it to Galena, IL where he drove it until 2003/04 when the Bendix broke. It was parked in a pseudo-carport until I bought it (owner #3).
The truck is all original except for one repaint of the cab. Very little surface rust. T
There was a bed (of sorts) on the truck, but I left it there. It is now happily living in my milk barn until spring, when I hope to get it on the road.
Welcome! Please post some pictures.
Be aware that there is a picture file size limit of 250K per picture on this forum.
Exciting find - keep us posted on your progress!
Nice Ton Truck!
The Ford made bodies, such as your enclosed cab were offered in the 1924 model year.
Yours seems to have the 'boot scraper' running boards from 1926. Maybe your cab is later '26 too. One check is to note the shape of the instrument switch cluster, if oval, then it's the later TT.
Great looking truck!
Grant, you have a nice solid tt there. I am biased to the steel cabs. Not sure it is a 1919 from the steel cab history dates. Most likely 25,26 or 27 if all original. I will let others correct me. Keep it rolling. Very nice find!
Very beautiful Model T Truck.
I believe the Dust Bowl period was from 1930 to 1936 also know as the "Dirty Thirties" so I would guess that the truck would be more of a 24-27. I'm not trying to be critical just trying to help you get the proper date of the truck.
Again a beautiful truck.
Welcome to the hobby
I'm just going by what is on the title
Can the year be determined by the VIN?
Grant, no real vin. If 26 or 27 the frame will be stamped. Before that there is not much you can do to verify other than original sale paperwork and the engine serial number being reasonable for the assumed year. A vin would have been assigned way after it was manufactured. Don't let it bother you much if you can help it. Welcome to the disease of trying to make, or keep a t original. They just did not do things in such a way to have true matching numbers to verify the history.
First, "Welcome!" to the 'TT' affliction!! It will be an ongoing, often unique, learning process.
Your picture shows the taller radiator and crank apron and probably identified as a '26 or '27 model.
Frame-stamped production numbers to match engine serial numbers began around 12/12/25. I found the production-stamped number on ours: passenger side, top of the frame, just ahead of the seat/tank location. The steel enclosed cabs were introduced in 1924. If I am correct, the 'TT' chassis was first introduced in 1917, with various completion styles by owner.... If no stamp is able to be found, assume a pre-12/12/25 production date.
Our truck's production number correlates to April 26, 1926. It has the rectangular dash pod used previous to the '26-27 oval pod. When a vehicle gets to over 90-100 years old, we're often unaware of just how much our "Bitsa" may have used up an existing parts supply, or then evolved. (Maybe, even survived!)
Take Care; Behave; Stay Warm (and)
If the engine is original to the chassis then the date can be determined with the engine number. If it is a later TT then the passenger side frame rail will have the number stamped as well
Congratulations, it looks like a really nice truck.
The ser # is on the drivers side of the motor above the water inlet on the block . The ser # will tell you the year of the motor , but motors got changed a lot . But could be the ordinal to the truck . Ser # start for 1919 28314227 1924 at 9008372 1925 10999901 1926 12990077 1927 14619255 . The easy to spot 26-27 is the steel cab ,the pedals on the transmission has two pedals on the out sides that look different the middle pedal . The rear end housing were the axel housing gos in to the pumpkin does not have a ring around the housing at this point ,like the early ones . Good luck with your new Truck .
I think it is pretty much a given that the square cabs like yours were made for the 1926 & 27 model years. The C-Cabs were made for the 1924 & 25 model years. Before that, all cabs were custom or home made - usually out of wood.
As for the VIN number stamped on the top of the right frame rail under the wooden floor boards, I have a '26 with no number and a '27 that has the number. I also have several TT frames with no VIN number.
Frame stamp of engine serial number, on T's and TT's after Dec 1925.
Engine serial number over the water inlet casting
Dash of a 1927 TT showing the later oval switch plate.
My '27 has the oval gauge and the '26 had the large square one.
Fred, respectfully responding, it isn’t a given that the C Cabs were ‘24 & ‘25 and the “square” Cabs we’re built in ‘26 and ‘27. The C Cabs we’re introduced in ‘24 and continued throughout Model T production. I’ve seen C Cabs with the oval ignition/ammeter plate. And the enclosed TT Cab was introduced in ‘25 and similarly continued throughout TT production. In mid ‘27 model year Ford introduced the “new and improved” oval switch plate on both Cab styles and widened the script ‘Ford Truck’ stake bed.
Super nice truck Grant !! Depending on your ring/cast iron worm ratio, your top end will be either 20 or 30 MPH at rod slinging RPM. But they’re really FUN !!
So I just got in from slogging thru the snow and bitter cold with new pictures. I have the dash, pedals, and engine. As you can see, I have a very early engine as it has a water pump. No numbers on the engine block. Please let me know what you think I have.
Looks like your block numbers are there just above the water pump mounting bolts. That will determine year, but not being able to read them off the picture and solely based on the brake pedal and the fan mounting it is a 1926-27. Engine s/n will confirm.
No numbers on the block.
The numbers were stamped by hand with individual number punches and a hammer, so they are not very deep and are not always evenly spaced or lined up. A little sandpaper will cut thru that red primer and reveal the numbers.
Welcome! The water pump was a popular add-on aftermarket item. The vintage of your engine has no connection with the presence of the pump.
I agree with Jeff's thoughts about things looking like a 26/27 engine & transmission. Still, there could have been an engine swap in its history, so that still doesn't really date the truck itself.
Anyway, it's a VERY cool truck! Wish I had the space for one and some seldom travelled country rods nearby to drive it on. Check in with us frequently!
If it was a replacement block there would have been no number stamped. The dealer would stamp the correct number. As suggested if there is no number, check the frame.
Hey Grant, you DO have an interesting and sought-after accessory. It appears that I spotted a Ruckstell linkage leading to the left differential housing. Unfortunately it’s an underdrive but great for parades.
Is that a Peerless portable steam engine in the background?
Grant, another indicator that the truck is a 26-7 model is the front wheels. That unusual tread is on INSA brand tyres, I believe made in Chile in the 1990's. They were only available in 21" sizes to suit T's and A's. Earlier TT's ran 30 x 3.5" clincher tyres on the front.
That is a super nice truck. Just get it mechanically sound and safe and enjoy it like it is.
Allan from down under.
If you have a title, or if one can be easily obtained - Run with whatever 'year' it says! If you could still obtain the bed, do it, as it looks like the framework for a stake-bed from what I can see. "Ford Truck" (if '26-'27) would have been outward-embossed on the rear bedrail.
Take Care; Behave; Stay Warm (and)
I changed ownership today at my local Secretary of State office and it is titles as a 1919 Model TT.
There was a bed on the truck when I bought it (ha-ha)
You can see in the above picture the frame only says 'Ford'.
Grant, as George indicated,the rear gear ratio 5.17:1 or 7.25:1 will be a little surprise to sort out. The 5.17:1 is the more desired gear set but either way you will have fun and there are options to go faster, mostly driven by money...sorting this out can be fun. The rusktell is nice to have all in tact!
I want to thank everyone for their input about my '1919 TT'. I have determined that my truck is most likely a 1926 for a couple of reasons. The squared ignition panel and the size of the wheels, 21" front, 20" rear.
Once it warms up here I can start working on getting it started.
And I will be posting more questions as they arise.
From what I understand, the embossed "Ford" (only) on the rear bedrail was pre-1926. Others may be more knowledgeable. You've got a solid start! Here's a nice reference for 'production numbers'...
Take Care; Behave; Stay Warm (and)
Another thing about trucks. You gotta take some of the cut-off dates for certain features with a grain of salt. Some of the changes didn't take place on the trucks as early as the cars. I've even heard that Ford would use up old versions of parts on the trucks after they had gone to the new ones on the cars. Now, we ain't talking years here, but certainly weeks and maybe months on some.
The Ford only script on the bed is the later AA style bed. Ford Truck script beds were the earlier TT version. I've got the same one on my 26 TT. - Matt
It is NOT a 1919, regardless of what the title says. Governmental incompetence goes back almost as far as civilization itself. IF the truck is late enough to have an original frame serial number? That is the only way to date it with any real accuracy. Beyond that, there are literally several dozen mostly minor and a few major detail changes that can narrow down the truck's approximate year and month of manufacture. THAT (very likely 1926) is the year and/or model year of the truck. Most such trucks also went through many changes during their working life. Engines wore out or were blown up, beds changed for usage reasons, wheels changed for tire availability reasons. All those things also can confuse the issues. All things considered, forget what the title says. Call it what it is. You and the truck will be happier that way.
No disagreement here, just more evidence we might have many "Bitsa's"????
And Grant, enjoy YOUR truck as you see it. Just understand what cards you've been dealt and to 'roll' with those punches! If you're not planning on some Concourse Judging or a museum piece; to take it for a drive due to the fruits of your labor, think like NIKE says: "Just Do It!" 'Who?' is unwilling to make reasonable improvements?? I plan to chrome both halves of our TT's windshield frame, but after all, it is my truck to enjoy as I envision it. If you've got a Title that says "1919", and you're happy with it..... Enjoy YOUR truck!
(Or perhaps) "ABE-EE! If the man wants a green suit, turn on the green light!" I can even recall having a green herringbone suit..
Since I live in Illinois and the title was from Illinois, I am unable to change the year. I was able to add the model as 'TT".
Frankly, I would not worry about what the state calls it, as long as they consider it to be a genuine historic vehicle and exempt from modern technology rules. A simple snide remark about the "infinite stupidity of the state believing it is a 1919" will be accepted and understood by most people. It will be especially understood by anyone that has ever tried to "correct" a state error. Thirty five years ago, after the state misspelled my name on the pink-slip for my modern car, I "swore" I would change my name to match the mistake rather than ever try to "correct" a title again (it took four years to correct what was clearly ABSOLUTELY their mistake). In most conversation, no mention of the error needs to be made. Just call it what it is, a 1926.
The one place when it WILL become a potential problem? Is when you go to sell it. Then you will have to explain the situation, and HOPE the potential buyer is willing to understand. It could cost you a few dollars at sale time, and may chase away a few potential buyers. So maybe you just need to be a committed lifetime TT owner and driver?
Regardless. NICE TRUCK! I like it.
A bit more history to consider. Many states did not issue titles that early. And even if Illinois did? The truck may have spent many years in another state. Regardless, the title was probably issued retroactively at some point in time. People and their memories are not generally the best source of accurate information. Some clerk who knew nothing about model Ts probably asked what year it was, and some guy that didn't know much more said something like "I don't know, I was told 1919 I think?"
And there you go.
Congrads on a nice TT. And getting title is important regardless. Chances are your engine block is a 1919 and the i.d. # on the title matches the block number. There should be a serial number on the pad over the water inlet.
By the way, your block is early, as it has "Made in USA" on the water inlet side, down low on the center of the block. That Made in USA was deleted after approx. April, 1923. So your block is a replacement, as your transmission cover with the wide pedals is for the '26-'26 Improved Car.
Chances are your engine if it still has the later 4 dip pan, and since the fan bracket is the '26-'27 style, could be all the rest of the engine is '26-'27 except for the block.
Might indeed your block is 1919, esp. if on the valve side there are two separate valve covers.
Matt W. is correct on the Ford script on those beds. Ford also built the same type of beds clear up into the '60's/'70's with different dimensions, maybe even later. Not sure about the script. If you look at one you can clearly see the similarities in the design. Dave