26-7 cowl gas-tank flap springs

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2018: 26-7 cowl gas-tank flap springs
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, March 29, 2018 - 09:46 am:

A friend needs one and has been unable to find one. We are getting one laser cut from suitable spring steel. If you need one, now is the chance


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Thursday, March 29, 2018 - 01:17 pm:

Les, Can you send a pic of the spring?
I might need one and don't know it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, March 29, 2018 - 03:04 pm:

Steve
It is about 2” wide and 4” long and bent into some contorted shapes at one end with a couple of rivet holes at the other end where it attaches to the flap door. It keeps the flap shut while driving and open while gassing up. Made from about.030” spring steel


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alan Long Western Australia on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 08:00 am:

That would be a most unusual item to be missing or broken.
Hopefully someone has the information you need
Alan


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 09:27 am:

My cowl was missing the flap; so I purchased a cover but don't know if it even has the spring. Have to check this morning.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 09:57 am:

Mine doesn't have a spring either. I've only opened the flap 3 times so I'm no expert on what's missing.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 11:01 am:

Unfortunately I don’t have the option of posting a picture at this time.
I also don’t have a cost as the more made the cheaper each will be. On Monday I will tell the laser shop to cut out what has been committed to. I expect the cut out pieces to cost about $5.00 each BUT this is not a quotation.
A year or so ago I had the same shop cut out copper shim head Gaskets for F head and big valve T engines. Everyone seems to have been satisfied with the deal!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 11:03 am:

And perhaps only Canadian cars had the spring. Stranger things exist!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 08:04 pm:

That spring is riveted smack-dab in the center of the flap with 2 rivets about an inch apart, yes?
I have a derelict 27 something or other and the only things remaining of the spring assembly are the tubular rivets, proud in their place!
The wire that holds the round gasket is in place but the spring is long gone.
I forgot about the derelict Tudor! Lo and behold, here it is.



Minnesota cars here but yes, strange things have happened up here this close to Canada.
Les, would you put me down for 5 springs?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 08:58 pm:

Duet
Thank you for the picture. Yes that is the item!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Friday, March 30, 2018 - 09:14 pm:

Les: Please include my order for two (2) springs for the 26-27 gas tank cowl door. Thanks, jb
jab35<at>cornell<dot>edu


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James E Bowery on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 06:40 am:

Les
I also need 1 spring for the 26-27 gas tank door.
Jim Bowery
Wellsburg WV


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dave Frost on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 07:17 am:

I'd be interested in 2 springs for the 26-27 set up. Thanks for all you do in this hobby Les.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By BRENT MIZE on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 07:43 am:

Les, I’ll take a couple.
Thanks
Brent Mize


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 09:39 am:

So far 13 pieces. All good


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 11:48 am:

Les, make that 14, I could us one for my '26 too.
David Dewey
Oroville, CA


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 12:58 pm:

Les,
I don't even have one, so will commit to one also, #15.
Thanks,
Vern
cowl cover


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Harold Schwendeman - Sumner,WA on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 01:54 pm:

Just slightly "OT", but this thread reminds me of the terrible screeching noise that my cowl tank gas door(s) on both my '26 and the '27 makes when opening and/or closing. Never occurred to me to use any type of lubrication to make the door work smoother, however, perhaps a bi of grease or drop of oil would be a good idea. Or,.....maybe not??? Anybody have any thoughts on this,....whether to lubricate or not??? Thanks,....harold


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 02:42 pm:

I just examined the hinge earlier and noticed that it will get grease after working out any rust at the 1/8" pin.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Don Kirtley on Saturday, March 31, 2018 - 05:29 pm:

Use paraffin wax. It won’t run or collect dust.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Crosby Webster, NY on Sunday, April 01, 2018 - 12:40 am:

Les, I would like to buy 2 please. Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Crosby Webster, NY on Sunday, April 01, 2018 - 12:44 am:

Could someone share a side view of the spring so I can see how to bend It to the proper shape? Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Sunday, April 01, 2018 - 04:43 am:

So adding the ones I have been contacted about that makes 19 so far.
Bending; that is the next challenge. I’ll probably get a couple of extras cut and try to figure out a good approach and communicate what I learn


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Codman on Sunday, April 01, 2018 - 10:37 am:

My US-made '27 has the spring. I would buy a spare for inventory if you are making them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Sunday, April 01, 2018 - 10:55 am:

I may look into making a die to form the springs. With at least 20 to do it is probably worthwhile.
Thank you for your interest. I only plan to do this once


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 08:21 am:

PM sent to add one spring for me too.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 08:30 am:

When the cord return spring broke on my generator, I tried to bend the spring at the end to reattach it and it broke. Annealing it first did the trick.
Also the holes on mine are 1.250 apart. I don't know if they are all this way.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 08:36 am:

I think my cowl opening has a notch where the spring fits but Duey's photo does not show it. Maybe someone trimmed my cowl.

(Message edited by mark_n on April 02, 2018)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 08:51 am:

So at 21 total new. I’ll probably order 25 pieces today


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ronald Bolser - Danville, IL on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 09:27 am:

Les
Add 3 more to your count.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Miller, Mostly in Dearborn on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 02:40 pm:

Here's a profile shot of the spring off my '26.



Two experts out of Tennessee stopped by and examined the cowl lip. The turned lip is uniform around the entire perimeter. The only slotting is at the back of the gas tank's slosh fence as Duey C shows in his photo.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Monday, April 02, 2018 - 03:56 pm:

Tom
Yes that is the profile
I like the expert helpers!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 10:38 am:

Les: I sent you a message. Thanks, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 12:16 pm:

So I may bulk ship to a dealer in California. Ultimately it should save all of you some money


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 02:04 pm:

put me down for 2. Bill


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 02:26 pm:

Thank-you Les,
Well this beats removing a loop from a 7 day mantle clock, making it a six day.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 06:59 pm:

OR maybe one of you wants to act as the US shipping agent. I trust you realize I live in Canada. So for every envelope I have to fill out a bunch of paperwork and there are costs. If I shipped 20 pieces to one address it would cost very little more than one piece. So think about it


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eck Sheppard on Tuesday, April 03, 2018 - 09:31 pm:

I would like you to add one more for my 26 Thanks

Eck


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 01:13 am:

Les, if you can find someone down here to take them in one package and then ship them to each of us, yes that would be worth it, and might be as cheap as buying individually from you, even with that person taking a cut. I wondered how you were going to deal with the Canada post thing.
David


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 07:54 am:

The Fedex hub is in Memphis, TN. So shipping from there would be central, or Louisville, KY for the UPS hub. I'm willing to do it from New Orleans but maybe someone else is closer to the midpoint of everyone on your committed list. Maybe it would be good to find out where everyone is first. Personally, I use USPS Priority flat rates when I ship eBy items.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 08:04 am:

Perhaps, whoever disperses the springs should also obtain a box of correct rivets so that two or three rivets can go with each spring to save even more cost.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 08:17 am:

The individual pieces will fit nicely in a standard business size padded envelope. From Calgary Alberta I would use Canada Post which connects nicely with USPS, if I end up shipping them individually. The main reason being that the Post Office systems have by far the cheapest easiest border crossing. When importing I use them for this very reason. Last year I shipped quite a number of head gaskets (all directly). Obviously considerably higher value. I don’t know what importation costs (if any) the recipients incurred.
I invented the floating transmission shaft and after some struggling to ship, I decided to license a US manufacturer. Again obviously a Lot higher value a bulkier to ship.
I may be worried about nothing!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Houston---WNC on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 08:49 am:

Hello Les: I would like to have you put me down for two. Thank you --davids


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 09:15 am:

So I guess 29 pieces at the moment, scary!!!
Vern good idea . I will look in the Spaenauer catalog for some rivets.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By JOHN BEVARDOS on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 10:19 am:

I will a few .4-6 of them


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 10:32 am:

So now 35 pieces!!! Sigh


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 12:11 pm:

Les, at this rate, you will develop a million$ business and be no longer able to retire nor enjoy your Model T. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 01:14 pm:

Vern, don't scare Les away. We need guys like him to keep the rest of us on the road.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Noel D. Chicoine, MD, Pierre, SD on Wednesday, April 04, 2018 - 11:04 pm:

I honestly don't remember if my 26 has the spring or not. It's in storage so I need to go out there and see before Les has all the numbers in and I need one. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 02:18 am:

So I’ve kicked off making the bending dies. A visit to a old friend with 50 years of tool and die experience!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 02:08 pm:

Les, I've designed a handfull of dies for prototyping and short run parts using layers of laser-cut steel. (I manage an R&D lab.) The dies are meant to fit into brake presses. I attached a photo that shows some simple examples. The two large parts are male and female dies. I included the small one to show how these can be used with pilots and shear edges. Bolting together layers of laser-cut steel has been much faster and cheaper for us compared to getting tool designers involved.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 02:50 pm:

Mark
That is a really great concept. I will show your picture to my friend and discuss it with him.
Thank you for your help


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie Spokane, WA on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 03:12 pm:

Not to muddy the water too much, but are these one-click or two-click springs?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 03:28 pm:

Tom
They are identical to the one pictured. I have have no idea about the number of kilometers they are!! (Canadian joke)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 03:31 pm:

If Tom wants to make a different version I can still cancel this project and step aside. Easy to do yet


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Tom Carnegie Spokane, WA on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 04:01 pm:

What makes you think I have any interest in making these springs? I just asked a simple and logical question that I wanted to know the answer to. How can I learn without asking?

I still didn't get an answer. Identical to which picture, the one-click one posted by Duey, or the two-click one posted by Tom Miller.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 04:48 pm:

The one posted by Tom Miller


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 06:59 pm:

I'll be dipped. I didn't know about the differences. I like!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 09:03 pm:

Duet
I didn’t either!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Thursday, April 05, 2018 - 09:16 pm:

Mark Nunn mentioned a notch. Perhaps those with a notch in the cowl get the two hump camel and those without the notch get the one hump camel? Maybe we need a photo of the cowl notch.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn on Friday, April 06, 2018 - 08:18 am:

Vern, I was mistaken. The notch I remembered was in the gas tank lip as seen in Duey's photo. I apologize for spreading my confusion to the forum members. I've now opened my flap 4 times so far. I'm new here and still learning.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Dan Treace, North FL on Friday, April 06, 2018 - 10:04 am:

Here are two types may be others too!





Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By john pawlowski - NE Pennsylvania on Friday, April 06, 2018 - 02:54 pm:

With so many people either not having this spring or not even realizing that there was such a thing. How is it that you all were able to get by without it? Now it's quite necessary, unable to be without. How did the fuel door stay closed all this time?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Friday, April 06, 2018 - 08:28 pm:

Gravity?
I don't need a single one right now but if a fella might need one down the road, I'll have a few to give away thanks to Les.
:-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Codman on Saturday, April 07, 2018 - 09:19 am:

Not a necessity, but obviously Henry was concerned enough to put the spring in place. I think it's more to hold the fuel door open then to hold it closed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By John Warren on Saturday, April 07, 2018 - 09:35 am:

Hi Les, you can put me down for 2 also, thanks for the support.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 - 11:59 pm:

Bump :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eugene Story on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 - 06:20 am:

Try heating the spring cherry red then let it cool heat it up again to cherry red and drop it in water or oil I f it breaks you heated it to much if it is to soft you didn't heat enough You have to play with it to get it right because you don't know how much carbon is in the spring. Once you get it right you are good to make several


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eugene Story on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 - 06:23 am:

Forgot to say bend it to shape between the first and second heat.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Monday, April 16, 2018 - 05:33 pm:

I finally finished figuring out the method I plan to use;
1. I have sourced .030” thick 1095 spring steel in annealed condition.
2. Figured out the heat treating and discussed the process with a local heat treatment shop
3. Finalized the cutting dimensions
4. I will now finalize the bend sequence and get the dies EDM Wire cut to shape. It will likely be a 2 step bending job. Could even be 3 steps. I want easy repeatable bends. Still a bit of figuring out for this part of the project.

So hopefully in 2-3 weeks it will be done!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ted Dumas on Monday, April 16, 2018 - 06:56 pm:

Les,

Good of you to do this. You are going to help out a lot of folks.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eck Sheppard on Monday, April 16, 2018 - 07:08 pm:

I also want to add a thank you !!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Monday, April 16, 2018 - 07:31 pm:

You are one of this forum's wonders Les! Thank you.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Monday, April 16, 2018 - 09:14 pm:

Thanks, and no rush.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Shannon Helm on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 01:25 pm:

Les, is there still time to add my request for cowl vent springs to the list? Somehow I missed seeing this post earlier and this will be a great help for my rusted and weak springs. If so, I will send you a message with my information. Thanks!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 03:08 pm:

Shanon
Yes there is still opportunity to get in.
I will probably make 50 pieces (the old cheaper by the dozen)!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Friday, April 20, 2018 - 02:59 pm:

Les,
Well, if that's true, you need to make 60 pieces (5 x 12 )
:-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Friday, April 20, 2018 - 03:01 pm:

Uh, unless it's a baker's dozen, then you need to make 65.. . . .


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Thursday, May 24, 2018 - 11:06 am:

Les: How are the springs coming along? Just checking, I requested 2. Thanks, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, May 24, 2018 - 11:55 am:

I finally have the die and will be doing a trial press today. If it all works out I will likely buy a arbor press today on sale at Busy Bee and then it will be “squeezing time “!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Thursday, May 24, 2018 - 01:08 pm:

Thanks, Les. I do appreciate your efforts and your updates. Best, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, May 24, 2018 - 08:20 pm:

With a bit of luck I just might get them all bent tomorrow!!
After that only final heat treatment. Then ready to sell


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 - 02:11 pm:

Btt


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Wednesday, June 13, 2018 - 02:30 pm:

Please mail a check for $21.00 US to
Les Schubert
100-182028-174 Ave W
Foothills AB
T1S-2B8
Canada


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Thursday, June 14, 2018 - 12:20 am:

Moneys heading your way in the next day or so!
Thank you Les!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Monday, June 25, 2018 - 08:59 pm:

Les: Received the springs today in the post at upstate NY USA. Thanks for everything, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vern (Vieux Carre) on Thursday, July 05, 2018 - 09:31 pm:

Thanks for the spring, quality steel, holes line up perfectly, received today.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Thursday, July 05, 2018 - 10:14 pm:

Thank you for the kind words!! I try.
I hope some more people buy as I have shipped about 1/2 of the run and have not nearly recovered my out of pocket costs


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Dewey, N. California on Thursday, July 05, 2018 - 10:27 pm:

Got mine a while ago but wasn’t here to post a thank you. They look GREAT.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Terry Woods, Richmond, Texas on Thursday, July 05, 2018 - 11:46 pm:

I'll have to agree with Alan Long of Australia. That spring might break, but to be missing; either the rivets pulled out; the cowl was turned upside down in dirt or water and rusted out; or some previous owner purposely removed the lid for God knows what reason. The cowl lid and spring needed no repair on my Grandfather's 27 coupe, and I'll guarantee that car had a rough life. It definitely wasn't garaged or handled with Kidd gloves. All fenders were rusted out beyond repair. The rear inner fender panels were rusted out. The doors had rust out at the bottoms. The deck lid was cut off 12 inches or less from the top; and all supports and sheet metal under the deck lid were removed. It was missing one headlight and the tail light. The best parts of the car were the cowl and the gas tank door!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Duey_C west central, MN on Monday, July 23, 2018 - 09:11 pm:

Received my springs today in the mail.
They look great! Thanks Les!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Les Schubert on Monday, July 23, 2018 - 10:24 pm:

Thank you all.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James E Bowery on Tuesday, July 24, 2018 - 06:16 am:

Received my spring last week. Really look great. Thank you.


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