I need a person to do a inspection on a 1915 Roadster. This sale depends on a "once over" inspection by a knowledgeable brass "T" guy. I have no reason not to trust the seller BUT would feel more comfortable knowing that it was inspected by a knowledgeable "T" person. I would gladly compensate the inspector for their time. This car is located in Clovis, CA near Fresno, CA. Please contact me for further instructions, 920-757-five five too 9 OR liveryone@gmail.com MUCH APPRECIATED GUY'S

I've seen very few REAL '15 cars here in California. Most have been converted from later years.

A seller can be perfectly honest but still misinformed about what he's selling. It's a very good idea to have somebody look it over.

Wish I lived closer, I'd been happy to look it over. My '16 was made in Dec '15, so it qualifies as a "genuine" HCCA car, but it's definitely a '16 year model. The previous owner (stopped working on it in the 1960s) was going to "doll it up" to be a '15, but didn't get around to it (he bought the brass pieces to do the job). There are so few '16s around that I'm keeping it as a '16!
There's T folks around Clovis, I'm certain you'll find someone to look it over for you.

Contact Larry Reed. At ReedRust@Aol.com. He lives in Turlock. He is very knowledgeable in respect to Ts

First and formost, thank you Larry, Steve and David for responding with the exact reason why I am asking a fellow "T" person for this huge favor. Which if the shoe was on the other foot, I would be more than happy to do this favor for another. I hope you guys will understand that I have a really nice 14' Roadster, which I have tentively sold to help finance this 15' Roadster. If this 15' out in CA is a "bitza parts car" and I sold my 14', well can you imagine how disasterous this sale could be !!! I know I could never replace the 14' once gone !!! I am working with the son of the father (owner). Seems to be a decent straight up guy BUT not real knowledgeable about the Model "T"s or the back ground of this particular vehicle. They have owned this 15' a very short time and only driven it in a few parades and a few car shows. Supposedly still has a shipping label on the floor boards from another parts supplier. Mr. Henry (Frugal) Ford ordered his parts with a specific sized wood container box that would fit exactly in the floor board space when these cars were built. Stop an think about it, it's got to be in immaculate condition or I am "just damn lucky" to find this "one-of-a-kind" gold mine. Not too sure about that latter part of the last sentence !!! If it's really true, maybe I should go buy a bunch of lottery tickets !!!

I hope that you guys understand why I posted this ad, I am not a rich man, just a "blue collar deplorable" that has worked hard for everything I have BUT it would be money well spent to compensate the inspector person for their time to have that person check out this car. So far NO LUCK, BTW: really appreciate you guys response.

Hey Don, you must have posted while I was responding to a post, how often does that ever happen ??? I just emailed Larry as you suggested and look forward to his answer (fingers crossed). Thanks Don for your input, much appreciated.

Larry is a really nice and friendly guy. I have done business with him on eBay and at Swapmeets and believe him to be a very honest person. Don

John,

I'm sure there will be someone available to help you that lives in California.

Note, Ford Motor Company USA did NOT "order his parts with a specific sized wood container box that would fit exactly in the floor board space when these cars were built." That is another "Ford Legend" similar to "... you can have any color you want as long as its black, etc." Ref: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/50893/79903.html?1233059301 see: By John F. Regan on Sunday, January 25, 2009 - 02:09 am: where John states:
“Trent put this tale to bed as an old wives tale many years ago. Ford did use up scrap wood in a few places and it is entirely possible that a piece of wood from some box got used because there was a machine called a Linderman (sp?) that was able to join supposedly random width boards together to make usable stock. Floor boards during the peak production years were indeed made from "Linderman stock". I can't tell you what size boards were joined or if all boards used to make this stock were first ripped to a standard width or what. Trent knows about it and researched it. The record of changes for the floorboards mentions in Feb of '24 that the floorboards changed from 9/16 to 5/8 thickness and that "Linderman stock is now permissible - no open joints..." This Linderman machine and its output may be the source of the "crates for floorboards" legend.”

I believe that the original floorboards for 1915 car would have been supplied by the body company that built the body and supplied it to Ford for assembly onto a chassis. The floorboards were included in the contract price of the bodies. At the posting: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/118802/130556.html?1268928642 By David Sosnoski on Wednesday, March 17, 2010 - 05:24 pm: he stated, “Some of the Record of Changes indicate that the floor boards were supplied by the body manufacturer.” Those record of Changes are the cards that Ford Motor Company used to keep up with how things are to be made.

Most of the bodies in 1915 were supplied by outside body makers to Ford specifications. Ref: http://www.mtfca.com/encyclo/doc15.htm that states:
JUN 26, 1915 Factory Letter
"Hereafter when ordering body panels for 1915 cars, please give both the car and body numbers. The body number will be found on the right sill just inside the front door. This number will be preceded by a letter which indicates by whom the body was made.
"The above information is necessary as panels for bodies made by our various suppliers vary somewhat."

For an excellent overview of how to tell a 1915 from a later body please see the posting "Smoking Gun" 15' and 16' or is it....? at:
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/13259.html

Note, remember that all Model Ts were assembled and put together somewhere. And many of them were shipped from the factory without the body attached. So from the freight car a chassis might have the same body or a different body placed on that chassis. (If they assembled them as they took them out of the box car – they probably would get the same body back onto the same frame. But if they pulled the stuff out and then put them together – any open body would fit on any open car frame. Below is a photo from one of the Ford magazines showing them loading the 1915 bodies and chassis into the box cars.



And most cars even if they came from the factory and are a one owner car had parts upgraded over the years. So, I believe the more important question is are all the parts correct for a 1915 and is the car a good running and looking car. It can be all correct parts, look good, and not be road worthy.

For additional information please see the Forum posting “Home for the Holidays” at: http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/29/40322.html where they discuss bodies and body numbers.

I would suggest that you have the person that looks at the car have a copy of the Model T Ford Club International Judging Guidelines vol 7. It has 9 pages of items described for the 1915 cars. It doesn’t cover everything, but it will help the person not to inadvertently overlook something. Available from the vendors see: https://www.modeltford.com/item/JG1.aspx

Also, some upgrades, while not original may still be something you might desire. Ford began offering the demountable wheels in 1919 and as I get older – I would much rather have those on a car I am driving than the originally correct non-demountable wheels. Note there were also aftermarket demountables offered in 1915 that would be period correct. Turn signals, safety glass etc. are items that make good sense for a car that is driven.

Again, best of luck to you. And I believe you are wise to have someone look at the car. No matter how many photos are sent to you, they will not show you as much as actually looking at the car.

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off

Hey Don, just got off the phone w/Larry, super nice guy. He was unable to do the inspection due to major medical issues, so back to square one. All wasn't lost though, I made a really nice friend, and that my friend means a lot.

John,
I may be able to help. I will PM you.

Matthew

FYI, I posted this earlier in your classified string. I'm 225 miles from Fresno so it's not easy to help. I could do it, I've been around '15s my entire life, but it would be a long, full day.... If Matt can help you that's good, this is just another option. If all else fails let me know, I think Saturday would work.




Hi john. I tried to give you a call but had a ring / no answer.

There are a number of Model T guys near Coarsegold and Oakhurst, which is not too far up 41 from Clovis. I was up there for an HCCA tour a few weeks ago and met a couple of the guys, but I don't have their information with me now.

If you look at the 'Chapters' section of this website you'll see a listing for a chapter in Bakersfield with a name and phone number; that would be a good person to call.

First, foremost and most important, THANK YOU all for responding to my thread. I have learned a lot (Hap), helpful guys responded with exceptionally good ideas (Gary, Matt, Don, David Steve, and Larry). It was a interesting post and I think it raised some good advise as to having a vehicle physically, visually inspected. The times have changed my friends, and I am not insinuating that all sellers are scam artists & crooks !!! I personally think a high percentage of sellers are un-aware, non-knowledgeable people. This Forum has been a "god send" to all MTFCA members, with the knowledge, advise and sometimes straight forward opinions amongst good people who love their passion of the Model "T"s.

Arrangements are made w/Matt and the seller to go check the vehicle out this Saturday, THANKS MATT for stepping up and I look forward to your report. Fingers crossed that everything goes well with the inspection. My 1914 Roadster is SOLD to a ecstatic buyer. And shipping is lined up w/Bill Squires, (great guy and does a exceptional, quality transport). Again, THANK YOU ALL for your input and advise, it means a lot and sincerely appreciated.

bump

Is it possible that parts vendors realized they might get a leg up on their competition if they told Ford that their crates could be disassembled and used for floorboards? In other words, "Henry, if you buy your stuff from me, you get free floorboards in the deal!". Not ordered by Ford, but provided by vendors to get Ford's business. Sharp marketing.

Cheers, Bill

ttt

Up into the 1950's, there were a couple of older Gentlemen in Georgetown, Texas with a small garage that they used to service all the T's in the area. At that time, they (and mine) were used for transportation, not show. I had a Barn Find 1926 that I paid $50.00 for, had been parked for over 20 years and we pulled it about a hundred yards, and it started right up. Point of the story, they had been the Ford Dealer way back, and he said they had shipped the cars in knocked down, they unloaded them and put them together in their shop, part of the selling price was teaching the new owners how to drive one. He told me that he could put inserts in my 1926,no need for babbitt, but he wanted $50.00, which was what I had paid for the car, so passed. I still wonder how he was going to do that.