Hi, I recently purchased a set of the current reproduction 23-25 one-man touring top sockets and bows to go with my 1925 touring body.
I did a trial fit of them onto my 1925 touring body today, and I noticed something that didn't seem right with the sockets in the folded position, has anyone seen this before?
Here is a picture of the 3rd and 4th (rearmost) bows with their bumpers set against each other. The fit isn't perfect, but close enough for now.
This next picture shows that the hole in the scissors linkage arm won't go down far enough to engage the peg at the bottom of the 2nd bow. If I push the link down, the hole gets closer but still won't reach the peg, and the rear of the bows lift up such that the bumpers shown in the first picture separate away from each other. Has anyone else had this problem?
I notice that the scissor link has a downward bend in it just forward of its pivot rivet, it looks like if I increased the existing bend that the hole would move down so that it would engage the peg at the bottom of the 2nd bow. Has anyone else had to do this to get the top bows to nest properly when folded?
I have no immediate plans to use this 1925 touring body, so I have plenty of time to fiddle with and study this.
Wow, this thread got buried fast, so I'm bumping it back up to the top.
Can someone with a touring car with a one-man top comment on how their bows fit together when folded?
My first thoughts would be are the bows bent, warped, or distorted from the original factory alignment?
Thanks George. I'll check again, but at first look the sockets themselves seem to be straight, no obvious twists or bends.
There will be a bit of variation on the assembly.
What you will find in actual use, the top covering and padding will provide a lot of distance to keep the parts placed away some.
Then when you fold down, the compression spring of the cloth materials help.
Then you will find those top saddles and straps do the work!
Forgot to post my method of strapping the folded top to the saddle.
Thanks Dan! I think what you're telling me is that I shouldn't worry about it, the top will be plenty stable when folded even if those two parts don't line up.
In your picture, the hole in the scissor link does appear to be low enough to fit onto the peg. I'll try putting temporary spacers between the backs of the sockets to simulate the thickness of the top material and padding and see if that brings things into alignment.
It's certainly more important for everything to be aligned properly when the top is up, so if I still can't figure it out I think I'll leave it alone for now.
Looking closely at one of the period Ford photos of the folding process for the one-man top, it appears that the scissor link is above the peg and has no hole for it.
Not owning a touring, I hope I'm incorrect on this. The roadsters for '23-5 have embossments on the front bows for common sense fasteners, which are held on with 5-40 screws. If tourings have this, then I wouldn't consider using them, and I'll bet they do. Should you need a photo of this area of the socket, I suppose I could be talked into taking a photo.
Sure Larry, I would appreciate a photo when you get time. I don't see any embossments on these new reproduction sockets/bows.
I finished fitting the wood bows into the sockets this morning. They fit well with only minor work with a wood rasp on the high spots.
The wood bow lengths matched the original Ford dimensions that Jack Daron posted a few years ago in this thread:
Other than the peg thing, everything seems to fit just fine, so I think I'll just leave it be, especially considering the period Ford photo above that shows the scissor link passing above the peg.
Here is a picture of the assembled sockets & bows on my 1925 Touring body:
Oops! Taking a closer look at the closeup I posted earlier, it appears that the scissor link in the Ford photo does indeed intersect the peg, see circled area.
Keep after me! I'm sure the front top socket on a touring is similar to the roadster, because they have the same hooks on the windshield. The embossments, of which there are two on each side have the same shape as a common sense fastener, and are threaded for 5-40 oval head nickel plated slotted screws. This one of the reasons I dislike reproduction parts, because they cut corners, or don't bother to do the research to make the part correctly!
Sorry to take so long on this. I've attached two photos. One still has the original common sense fasteners attached to the embossment on the socket which you can see if you look hard enough. The second shows the two front ones, which use a #5 oval head slotted wood screw, probably about 1/2" long. Should you have any more questions, email me.
Mark, I think you'll find that after the top is installed, the bows will angle slightly different and things will probably line up better. The top takes up at least 2-3" between the bows when folded. My 24 touring, the bow with the two pins on each side, does line up with the holes on each side, but not without a little manipulation usually. You can tweet it afterwards if you need, just be careful.
The point here is, if you are going to make a reproduction, why not make it correctly in the first place? Whoever made those top sockets went to a lot of work. I think they could have made the dies to stamp that common sense location if they wanted to. I'm sure mark could get the locations of the holes for the fasteners from someone with a 22-25 touring, but he shouldn't have to do that.
Here's what I have from elsewhere on the forum regarding side curtain fasteners and their locations.
My top sockets, which are originals that have been repaired, have the common sense fasteners on the inside surfaces of the sockets. They do not interfere with the folding of the sockets.
But then again, I've only ever taken the top down twice on my car in 22 years.