Steering pitman arm

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Model T Ford Forum: Forum 2018: Steering pitman arm
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 07:40 pm:

I have chasing down some steering slop.
Added shims on one end seems to show some movement at the pitman arm.
Do I need to shim the key way or the steering shaft?
Being in Texas, I will cut up a Dr. Pepper can.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark A Strange on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 07:59 pm:

The end of the steering shaft and the inside of the pitman arm hole are tapered - remove the cotter pin and tighten the nut down to the next castellation (or two, if it's really loose), then install a new cotter pin. :-)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 08:00 pm:

Here’s the picture.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 08:05 pm:

The pitman arm is all the way up. If I tighten more, then the arm will run into the timer rod.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark A Strange on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 08:23 pm:

Sounds like the shaft and/or pitman arm surfaces are worn.

You could try a shim, but IMO a better approach would be to get a new pitman arm and see if it will sit up higher on the taper.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Conger - Wyoming on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 09:00 pm:

Grind a bit off the back of the pitman arm or the end of the timer rod and honk down on the nut. Do not shim anything on this assembly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 09:44 pm:

The pitman arm is new.
The steering rod was one in the family surplus.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Conger - Wyoming on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 09:51 pm:

There appears to be generous material at the back of the pitman arm. I stand by my advice. You'll be fine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Monday, December 10, 2018 - 10:19 pm:

I will try to shave some off.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Allan Bennett - Australia on Tuesday, December 11, 2018 - 03:41 am:

Steve, if that is an original T castle nut you are using, it appears to have an excess of thread showing, which in turn indicates the taper on the shaft is worn. Can you try the pitman arm on another shaft to compare? If nothing, that should rule out whether the shaft or the new pitman arm is the culprit. Scott's fix may well be the way to go.

Hope this helps. Allan from down under.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Larry Smith, Lomita, California on Tuesday, December 11, 2018 - 10:38 am:

The problem is you have a reproduction pitman arm. Find a good original with a good ball, and your problems will likely be over.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Willie Rathbone on Tuesday, December 11, 2018 - 01:18 pm:

I don't think it will move any closer than .090 towards the arm. Just tighten it up tight. It will be fine.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Neil Kaminar on Tuesday, December 11, 2018 - 06:28 pm:

Steve,

You need to properly torque down the nut. In my car I added a little Loctite on the taper. That helps but does not take the place of the proper torque. If you are getting interference, grind a little off as suggested. You may also need a washer under the nut.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 07:43 am:

I was able to shave just a little off the pit man arm. This was able to let the pit man arm to snug up to the shaft with out any interference.
Now the next part that is really loose is at the top of the steering column. The gear box and the steering tube seem to have a lot of play.
Is there a way to tighten up the rivets with out removing the whole column?
Here are the pictures of the top and bottom of the column.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Harper - Keene, NH on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 08:45 am:

Hi Steve,

It appears to me that your steering column tube is cracked. No amount of rivet tightening will cure that issue. (Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.)

Time to repair or replace the tube. Good luck with your project, Bill.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 10:40 am:

Steve: Mark Osterman recently (3 weeks ago +/-)posted his repair of a steering column, with excellent pics and excellent results achieved, suggest you take a look at that. I don't see cracks, but it does appear the rivets have been 'tightened' at some point. Good luck with your project, jb


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bill Harper - Keene, NH on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 11:26 am:

Hi Steve and James,

I lack the computer skills necessary to "draw" an arrow on a picture to point out something.

In Steve's first picture of his steering column and quadrant, there is a crack showing on the column in the center of the "glare" from the camera's flash. Well, it looks like a crack to me and I have seen similar cracks in more than a few columns. My two cents worth, perhaps overvalued, Bill.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark Nunn, Bennington NE on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 01:18 pm:

Recent steering column threads.
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/822076/915599.html?1542632288
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/822076/917646.html?1543292265
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/822076/918075.html?1543426131
http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/822076/918336.html?1543508578


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By James A Bartsch on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 01:58 pm:

Bill: Good catch, good eyes!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 05:29 pm:

There's a reason why a picture is worth a 1000 words.
I would not have caught that for the life of me.
The hunt will start.
I guess it's only fitting. I started with the steering wheel. Now I have all the joints tight. I finish with the steering wheel.
and the wheels on the bus go round and round.

Thank you gentlemen.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 06:12 pm:

One more question.
What should I pay for a good column?
I don’t have a clue.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mark A Strange on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 06:32 pm:

What year is your car? There are a couple of steering columns on Ebay right now (I have no connections to the sellers or the listings).

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=%22model+t+for d%22+steering+column+-fits+-fit%27s&_sacat=10073&LH_TitleDesc=0&_saslop=2&_sop=1 0&_osacat=10073&_odkw=%22model+t+ford%22+steering+-fits+-fit%27s&_sasl=macs-auto -parts%2C+%2C+johnnylawmotors%2C+ecklersautomotive%2C+whiteracingproductsllc_nos &LH_TitleDesc=0


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Conger - Wyoming on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 06:37 pm:

Steve

there is no reasonable expectation that anything you buy sight unseen is going to be any better than what you have. There is a reason these parts get sold. Fix yours and be done with it and know it will outlast you unless you drive it every day for 25 years.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Michael Thomas - Centerville, Iowa on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 06:52 pm:

I had the same problem last year. Called Lang's, and they sent me one for just over $90.00, including freight and new rivets. Cured all of my steering problems.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 08:55 pm:

The T is my wife’s ‘26.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David Stroud on Thursday, December 20, 2018 - 09:42 pm:

Steve, PM sent. Dave


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Wayne Sheldon, Grass Valley, CA on Friday, December 21, 2018 - 01:50 am:

Steve B et al, I just looked back here, and something in your original post caught my attention. I suspect you were joking, but for the benefit for all, I feel the need to make a comment.
NEVER use aluminum can material for shims, basically for anything. Aluminum is a soft metal given to "cold flowing" and will become loose and likely dangerous.
There are a few conditions where the cold flowing can be used to advantage. But it is tricky to do.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Steve Bourgeois on Friday, December 21, 2018 - 08:14 am:

Wayne,
I just took a little off the top of the pitman arm where it would interfere with the timing rod.
It is good and tight now with no play.
I did look at the top of the steering column and looked for the crack. I just didn't see it or feel it. I am going to get with some of the clubs more experienced members. With luck they will help me repair and have a good and solid steering column.

The really crazy part was that I drove the car for two years with out a key way in the pitman arm. I found this little issue when I was trying to leave from lunch and I was turning the wheel and the front didn't move. Looking back I guess this was the angle saying "Hey bonehead take a looks that the steering!".

This looks like it is going to be an January project.

Thank you MTFCA for all the help.
The guys here are a great community.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Scott Conger - Wyoming on Friday, December 21, 2018 - 10:13 am:

You are a very very lucky fellow


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Darvin E. Jahnke on Saturday, December 22, 2018 - 01:54 pm:

I suspect what you were missing was the key as the keyways are permanent in the shaft and the arm.


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