MTFCA Forum

namdc3

Thanks, all. I think I have a lead from a buddy on a shop that was about $40/piece for AS1. That aligns a whole lot better with your experiences.

namdc3

No doubt. My comment wasn't intended to cover the other manufacturers (which show many grip styles in photos and literature), but rather was specific to the 18z245. It's also possible that it is indeed modeled as a straight-sided grip and that the perspective is making it look tapered. The informati...

namdc3

Bob, Fantastic work, as usual. The only thing I saw on the 18z245 was that I think the original handle grips were all a constant diameter as opposed to tapering larger. With the perspective in the drawing, I can't tell for sure, but based on how the main shaft looks and that they are on the same pla...

namdc3

David, how did that work with the lamination line? I assume it is pretty visible now? Any trouble with the water weeping in? Did you seal the edge? Both of my plate glass edges have the bevels but are more frosty than polished.

namdc3

Don and Steve, for AS1? If so, either glass went up or I need to locate a different shop, because what I'm hearing from local is very similar to Mac's price-wise.

namdc3

I'd like to hear people's experiences with windshield glass from Mac's. I have a '25 runabout with plate glass that I'd like to replace with AS1 laminated and maintain the use of the original nickel-plated brass strips/channels. Mac's is the only vendor that lists it to my knowledge. I have inquired...

namdc3

Thanks to you both. I didn't mean to highjack the thread, so apologies to the OP. I believe that 1/4" is as thin as AS1 comes, but I think some people use AS2, which does come thinner, either because it is cheaper or fits tight strips/channels better. I intend to use AS1. Thanks again! If I run into...

namdc3

Thanks, Dan. I think part of my problem was/is the terminology. You referred to the larger, painted steel piece as the channel and the thinner brass, nickeled piece as the strip. What piece part is the "glass clips?" Is there any tape or buffer between the strip and glass? Is there any tape or buffe...

namdc3

I also have a '25 runabout with plate glass, and need to get around to putting AS1 laminated glass in it. I haven't been able to find any good pictures of what people are doing at the channels. I gather 1) the old plate glass is close to 7/32" and the new AS1 laminated glass is 1/4" and 2) the corre...

namdc3

There is not glass in it right now, but it measures to be a standard 2-1/4” glass, which are available. That will give me time to paint the hour hand and clean/lube the movement. It is still losing a little bit of time, but I’m hoping a good cleaning and adjustment of the speed lever will fix that.

namdc3

This is just dry fit with no glass and the pieces not bonded. There are more than six pieces now because some of the pieces broke in half from their own weight when picking them up. Given that they are so soft, I was worried that the bezel would not withstand the torque of winding the clock. However...

namdc3

Thanks, Jim. I saved the pieces and may try that, but the material is pretty soft and may continue to be a problem. It might hold once it’s fully assembled again, though. I’m still thinking on it and have some ideas but need to take some measurements.

namdc3

The clock itself is in great shape and running well. Here are photos of the bezel shape. It unscrewed fully before falling apart. When captured (sandwiched) between the inner glass retaining ring and the outer brass cylinder, it acted as one piece. Once no longer contained by the outer cylinder, it ...

namdc3

Well, I successfully unscrewed the bezel from the clock. However, once no longer captured by the brass cylinder the bezel fell apart into about six pieces. No audible crack was heard, and when I lifted up a piece I was able to break it in half about like breaking a wet cracker. I don’t know if the m...

namdc3

Jim, I should have taken a better picture. The outer can, or housing, with the studs comes off with three small screws at the back. That leaves an inner sleeve, in this arrangement we could call it the case I guess, that has the movement inside. The bezel needs to come off to take the movement out t...

namdc3

Well, last night I placed the clock face down in a dish of shallow Kroil (high enough to cover the bezel threads but low enough to not touch the hands) and put it in the freezer thinking maybe the CTE of potmetal would be greater than that of brass. This morning I took it out and am letting it come ...

namdc3

Is there any many information on the photo I snipped this out of? I believe these appear to be '25 model year runabouts with 8850B/8851B rear fenders. I can't recall whether the short hinge appeared in August of '24 with the '25 models or earlier, and it's a little hard to tell if these are definiti...

namdc3

Remarkably, this clock sat in a cabinet with no glass for decades and had parts floating around in the back of the case (a clip had come off, allowing a couple gears to come loose. I put it back together but was unable to clean and lubricate it because of not getting the bezel off. I wound it, rocke...

namdc3

Thanks for the good picture. I think on mine the pot metal would have an OD thread to engage with the brass cylinder and an ID thread to engage with the silver colored ring that holds the glass in. I’m also thinking the OD thread would have to be a right hand thread or it would unscrew when you pres...

namdc3

Does anyone know how to get the movement out of this case? My guess is that the pot metal knurled ring unscrews from the plated brass cylinder. I took this inner cylinder (and movement) out of the outer can by removing the three small screws at the rear of the clock, but I had no luck removing the p...

namdc3

Steve, You will probably get a lot of input on this, but I’ll provide a few first thoughts. This sounds like a switch problem. It’s possible that two connectors are shorting to each other, as it is very close quarters on the backside of the switch. I would look at this very carefully and turn or ben...

namdc3

My 2c since there are a couple things I didn't see covered. Besides the original color coding mentioned, some springs are also stamped with their number (41, 42, etc.). I think part of the problem with various reports is that people don't realize there were different springs, and many cars have the ...

namdc3

Same here. Very nicely done.

namdc3

Thanks! ...and thanks again for character count

namdc3

Just a few more ads. It sounds like it came with its own heavy duty hubcap.

: Bayne 1.JPG (61.44 KiB) Viewed 441 times

: Bayne 2.JPG (99.53 KiB) Viewed 441 times

: Bayne 3.JPG (71.33 KiB) Viewed 441 times

namdc3

hub plate from a wooden spoke t wheel Good idea, Andrew. Be sure to post some pics. Like I mentioned above, I don't think using it will do a differential any favors, as the spider gears are having to constantly spin, but I do wonder if a light load for a short run would be fine. I'd be interested i...

namdc3

Interesting photos of other pulleys. http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/179374/209649.html Hopefully someone will post photos (and dimensions ;) ) of an original adaptor. I have a pulley but no adaptor and, probably like you, would love to have one. I would think the hubcap wouldn't work that well...

namdc3

How does it attach to the hub? I'm assuming we are missing a piece. This does a pretty good job of describing the adaptor flange. I've seen a couple of the pulleys but never the adaptor flange. Patent https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/a5/d6/c6/8847087f97e8dc/US1262003.pdf bayne.JPG

namdc3

Thanks for the confirmation!

namdc3

What is the meter number in the Ford style, 19867? I am just curious, as I have a small database of meter numbers on Ford style units.

namdc3

The hook style is Victor, Dan.

namdc3

Definitely Brown or E&J and not any of the others. Ken, how do you tell between Brown and E&J?

namdc3

Darin, If you want to be as original as possible, I suggest reviewing Larry's information on materials, routing etc. Below is just my 2c on a functional, safe system. Generator (if you go that route rather than a tank): POR-15 works will to coat the inside of the sludge reservoir (base); calcium hyd...

namdc3

Andy, it is an Service Station Equipment Company (SSECO) unit, as well - just a later version than shown in the HCCT handbook SSECO section. It appears your spark ring might be grounded to the frame via the two mounting bolts. That needs to be isolated electrically, preferably by standoffs that don'...

namdc3

ScottPrindle wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:55 pm
Yeah my mistake, the "bill" in the front is on 1915 fenders. But interestingly the last of the 1914's and early 15's (which this car is) had the bill as well. There is a photo on page 180.

Yes, but I think the late '14 billed fenders still had 4 heads instead of 1915's 3.

namdc3

The presence of loose/intermittent wire/terminal/connection is always a possibility too that might not be easily detected via voltage measurements. For sure. It's not going to run well on mag if there's a problem in the mag-to-coil box wiring or switch. Sometimes it's the simple thing that will cau...

namdc3

fbergksi, I'm kind of surprised no one else has mentioned it, but those voltages don't look that bad imho if they are that good once you apply a load (like an 1156 bulb). I don't think I saw any loaded voltage results above, but I could have missed it. If you get similar voltages once you test with ...

namdc3

George's photo shows the version of control rod that is dropped down along the head. The higher version has that rod up even with the head bolt heads (no drop). I'm not familiar with the radiator bolt leak problem, but I know what you mean. Perhaps some silicone smeared on the bolt threads?

namdc3

Also, yes, 30 weight is fine. Rear end oil needs to be yellow metal compatible due to the worm wheel. Amazon has 5 gallon buckets of Mobil 600W Super Cylinder Oil for about $140 shipped. The F will take 3-3 1/2 gallons, and you'll have a supply left over for your T or most any other old car diff. Yo...

namdc3

23Fordson, The rod hookup on a T is straight up, and the rod hookup is 90 deg off from this on an F (at 9 o'clock if standing in front of the tractor). Some aftermarket timers have the wire color labeled, which is for a T, and on an F, the timer is rotated by 90 deg. You just need to be aware of tha...

namdc3

23Fordson, Congrats on your purchase. 4 turns out on the mixture is a lot. It should start and run at about 1 1/2 turns out - choked or primed if cold. You might check your vaporizer system for air leaks. If any of the intake system isn't sealed, it's hard for the system to draw vapor since it's suc...

namdc3

I will take the seven shackles that are the same style as each other.

namdc3

. Sold

namdc3

Dan, thanks for these two photos. It clears up a question I've had for awhile. Most people are missing the clamp piece and they just align a lug to the hole on the frame and bolt through it. I've looked at factory photographs to see what was right but I hadn't seen what I was looking for.

namdc3

Great! I will submit the order that I started last night.

namdc3

Slightly OT and not Ford, but in case anyone wondered about greasing in white cuffs...

namdc3

Well, “best laid plans,” I guess. Time to order this online. I’ve been looking forward to reading it about as much as going to Chickasha, so I guess at least I’ll get to do one of the two this year.

Hmm, come to think of it, I'm not sure I can do that yet with the museum closed temporarily.

namdc3

Looks nice, Bob!

namdc3

Now cancelled. I guess you could look at that as postponed until next year.

namdc3

Postponed. http://pre-war.com/

namdc3

http://pre-war.com/

Now they've updated from Postponed to Cancelled.

namdc3

Tbird, note there are at least two base diameters on what are otherwise very similar looking clocks.

namdc3

No more wisdom out there? I read through the patents and didn’t see anything that would drive being handed, but that doesn’t mean much.

namdc3

Thanks, Ron.

namdc3

Please hold a few for those us who have planned to buy it at Chickasha like the above article says. It's probably not too late to get more made, either. Thanks.

namdc3

Thanks, Dan. I had thought of the rebound peg, but at least on the ones I have, they don’t appear to be handed either. It’s pretty common for the perch bolt holes to get really worn out and for the arms to get very bent out of shape. I have several arms with no to very little hole wear and I can see...

namdc3

What is the functional or geometric difference between a LH and RH #60 front arm on the beehive style? The brass tag and hard oiler bolt head tab are two differences, but the geometry seems to have the perch hole, shackle hole, and arm spring end all in straight alignment. Unlike pancake style arms ...

namdc3

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namdc3

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namdc3

Thanks, both.

namdc3

Agreed on the physics. The pedal hookup arm on the cross shaft does give you a leverage boost as compared to a straight pull cable like the original A-C, for example, but having the force on the self-energizing side halved at the brake probably isn’t great. I wonder how wide spread the idea of self-...

namdc3

Also, wiring diagram. Several circuits are optional. http://www.mtfca.com/discus/messages/80 ... 1256789231

namdc3

JTT3, I think that’s a Service Station Equipment Company hcct, which uses a similar but different ring. It’s possible the Ford ring would work, though. Bob will probably chime in.

namdc3

Is the mounting plate supposed to be on the top or the bottom surface of the upper rail edge on a fall of 1924 (1925 model) runabout? Shown here on bottom, which I think is correct.

namdc3

Thank you. I was fortunate enough to go the Great Dorset Steam Fair twice, and it is indeed a fairly hilly area. The steam guys are proud of their heavy haulage heritage, and they have a large heavy haulage active display, including a large hill they pull. Here in the US, we tend to focus on agricul...

namdc3

Mark, thanks. It’s Hardin with an i, but that and the patent are all I’ve found, too.

namdc3

Well, believe it or not, that did it! I’m not sure if it was luck, perseverance, or adding “Chicago” into the mix, but I found the manufacturer (not in Chicago) in a Motor Age from 1922. Patent https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/45/7c/21/00033c373d3313/US1464761.pdf B454B9FC-BCB4-4C79-8C87-...

namdc3

ThreePedalTapDancer, I think you’re right. I found an ad from them with that U symbol for a drop forged, counterbalanced crankshaft for the Ford. I didn’t find any brake ads from them, but they probably made the parts for someone else.

namdc3

namdc3

I posted these in 2017 or so, but no one had seen them before, so I thought I'd try again. I've searched Google patents, internet images, the forum, Kenealy's accessory books, old catalogs, etc. and haven't been able to identify the manufacturer of these brakes. Any ideas? 738148.jpg 738153.jpg 7381...

namdc3

John, I re-read your magneto thread ( https://www.mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8241&p=61541#p61541 ) from last fall. While it's quite possible that the rear main wasn't fitted properly and has worn to the extent that you have excessive crankshaft end play in a relatively short period of time...

namdc3

Jtt3, can you post a photo of your tester? It will help determine your spark ring style. Bob Scherzer has the above style.

namdc3

BTT in case of an original or two out there for sale.

namdc3

FYI, I believe those are Moore brakes.

namdc3

Back up for sale. Push pull is wrong for what I need. I’m sorry about that.

namdc3

Email sent

namdc3

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namdc3

Thank you, Bob. I've sent him an email; I read awhile back that his health wasn't good and hope that he's well. I hope to find originals but realize that's a long shot. His rings look very nice.

namdc3

I'm proud to have recently bought these two beauties and would like to get two spark rings to help get them back to their former glory. I'd really like to find original rings with the 18-Z-245-B part number in the backside. Below is a photo if my HCCTs and two photos of the ring previously posted by...

namdc3

Thank you, Ron and Bob. I will definitely be by to buy at Chickasha.

namdc3

It’s interesting that the manual doesn’t mention the pulley. I wonder if this manual is slightly later after discontinuation of the pulley, or if the pulley was actually used by Ford to qualify the HCCT itself prior to its use. I have no idea other than guesses. http://www.cimorelli.com/mtdl/unknown...

namdc3

I understand now that those are two pieces with individual set screws. Handle can be removed when operating with pulley. Makes sense.

namdc3

Bob, thank you for this information. If you could tolerate one more question, what is the story on some units having the pointer/electrode straight opposite the crank handle and others having it at 90 degrees to the crank handle? I stole one photo from above (on a 18Z245N180 stamped unit) and the ot...

namdc3

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namdc3

Ok, so no "SNxxxx". How about the pulley on the back - I gather all Ford ones had it, but some early outsourced ones did, too? (and, yes, I will be buying a book). To be even more specific in your statement, do you mean ONLY Ford units had the number stamped in the base? I.e., all outsourced units (...

namdc3

Am I to gather from the above that the part number and N180 in the side of the base and a pulley on the back does not indicate an original Ford unit since N180 isn’t evidently a SN? Ron used to post that Ford units had “SNxxxx” hand stamped in the base. I assume it’s in this location, as well? In ot...

namdc3

I used stainless steel line, painted black. I filed down a stainless tee fitting so that it looked like an old cast fitting once painted. If I recall correctly, hose clamps weren't originally used; I used a brake flaring tool to create a little bump just in from the tubing ends, which creates a nice...

namdc3

Sold. Thank you.

namdc3

namdc3

namdc3

More photos. Moss included at no extra charge.

namdc3

1926 1927 pickup bed. Very straight for its age with rust out in the rear crossmember. Local pick up or free delivery to Chickasha. $600. 1/2 down now if Chickasha pick up. Thanks.

namdc3

More pics

namdc3

1925 pickup bed. Rough. No tail gate. Local pick up or free delivery to Chickasha. $125. Thanks.

namdc3

Matt, I found your document interesting. A couple things I've wondered are 1) what the acceptable range of secondary C-D resistances is (I've seen some %s listed, but I've seen contradicting information) and 2) whether or not it would be better to have a tight grouping of this resistance across a se...

namdc3

+1 for plexiglass

namdc3

What kind of box? A steel pickup bed?

namdc3

If I’m reading that correctly as one plate, that $400 aligns with the $800 for the pair I was told a few years ago.

namdc3

Scott, Chris's plate just shows another way to assemble the same kit (not the same but similar to the one attached). Nebraska required two plates I assume. If someone comes up with a third 39487, that would be cause for concern.

namdc3

Scott, I'm not with the car right now and don't have any great photos at hand. The numbers are the same font (mine only shares the 4 and 8 numerals with the OP's), as is the NEB. Like mine, the OP's plate frame appears to be a somewhat flat metal rather than round rod based on the outline showing th...

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