MTFCA Forum

MKossor

Capacitor leakage does not degrade coil performance significantly unless it's very bad. I would not replace capacitors if the VALUE measures 0.47uF +/- 20% ( or 0.33uf to 0.56uF). Capacitors with lower value should be replaced in my experience.

MKossor

Interesting 3D video model of the Model T engine and plenty of details to take issue with including improper cranking, rated HP, etc, etc. Perhaps some constructive feedback can help refine the video to improve its educational value.

https://youtu.be/vnaocIwRPjo

MKossor

I tried it as Model T engine oil additive (a few oz) because I read of potential benefiits, BIG mistake! Developed Immediate brake band chatter, especially during the last few feet coming to each and every stop. Had to change the oil several times before the band chatter improved but never completel...

MKossor

Diddo on that Dan, great hosts, great food, great time and great event. Glad we were able to attend this year and looking forward to next year.

Thank you Racket'T'ers and all who stopped by to say hello!

MKossor

So sorry to learn of her passing. Sincere condolances to the Lang family and all of their friends.

MKossor

Good finding Tony. Thanks for sharing.

MKossor

Relying on tried and true methods taught by seasoned experts is usually good guidance for those who prefer to DIY, but not always.... Here's a good example: Sundial Instructions.JPG Sometimes new methods that produce great results with less effort come along but seasoned experts shun to learn or pro...

MKossor

Clever and informative illustration Rich
The picture is worth 10,000 steps to the nearest gas station

MKossor

Fantastic job John documentung the PC board fabrication process, building the pcb version of your design and installation in a cutout housing. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience.

MKossor

Yes, will be bringing I-Timer, E-Timer, ECCT for 1913-27 KW/Ford coils and the new ECCT Heinze coil Edition. Looking forward to seeing you and others there.

MKossor

Zero Maintenance Ideal Timer (I-Timer) is back in stock! Wire for Wire, drop in replacement for mechanical timer provides reliable coil activation, precisely synchronized with piston position, never needs maintenance and never wears out. That's an Ideal Timer! Enjoy maintenance free day to day perf...

MKossor

ECCT Coil Tester is back in stock!

More information here: www.modeltecct.com

MKossor

E-Timer, I-Timer and ECCT coil testers. Will introduce the new Heinze coil Edition of the ECCT. Specifically designed for the earlier Heinze coils. Stop by and say hello.

MKossor

Who knows? Maybe their great product was getting relentlessly trashed without merit by the coil "Experts" of the day to protect their grip on the "accepted" tools and methods they peddled. That could have certainly driven them to extremes trying desperately to entice folks to just try their great ne...

MKossor

Pat, did you check the capacitor in that coil that went through 2 sets of points? Excessive contact wear will occur If the capacitor value is low. Should be 0.47uF replace if lower than 0.33uF. New Day timers are great mechanical timers but do need periodic maintence to keep clean and occasional res...

MKossor

Like

Nice work indeed.

MKossor

Everything is fine when the coil produces a nice, equal sound :? Adjusting coils for equal sound (by ear) or equal average coil current (by Buzz box, HCCT, etc.) are indirect approximations for coil firing Time . Internal combustion engine performance depends on accurate and consistent ignition Tim...

MKossor

Anyone happen to have one they don't need?

MKossor

Wanted to buy: 1927 Touring Rear Interior Door Panel or panels. Would consider full or partial set with the right rear interior panel. Thanks.
email: mictel@comcast.net

MKossor

Great, thank you for the information.

MKossor

Thanks again for sharing other options for motor couplings. I will be putting full load on the generator (up to 10A) and full running speed (3000 RPM generator / 2000 RPM Engine for short intervals) so the modified gear option seems to be the most robust method. Still hopeful to buy one already done...

MKossor

Good suggestions, thank you!

MKossor

Anyone have one of these or be willing to make one in your Lathe from an old generator gear? Generator Gear Coupling.jpg I am making a generator test set and need a coupling between the drive motor and the generator gear. Open to other solutions if you have one for sale. Please contact me for detail...

MKossor

HB Roy!

MKossor

I had the same thing happen and it resulted in a "coil boil" What a mess. A lot of smoke and melted tar. My car still stinks. bobt Your coils were not likely adjusted properly for the correct, equal and consistent firing time. If they were, I doubt you would have suffered a coil Melt down based on ...

MKossor

Half wave rectifying the magneto output is good but only uses the positive magneto voltage pulse so is not as efficient as full wave rectifying the output. Full wave rectifying the output makes use of both positive and negative magneto voltage pulses. The problem is the magneto output is referenced ...

MKossor

I have tried to order an ECCT but they are not available right now. Supply chain issues have impacted the availability of lots of items these days as many are well aware, the ECCT is no exception. The good news they should be available again in March as the 2022 Touring season ramps up again here i...

MKossor

FYI, Prices increase effective 3/1/2022 to offset cost increases ranging from components to advertising. Everything is costing more to produce products as many of you are already well aware.

MKossor

Getting electronic parts has been a real problem as many folks already know.

Happy to report the E-Timer and I-Timer are both available again now.

The ECCT and ECCT Heinze Coil Edition are taking a bit longer. Hope to have them both available in March.

MKossor

Rob, thanks for information the inquiry. Unfortunately, I don't have any information or data on the Splitdorf coils so can't provide any performance data comparison.

MKossor

I was in contact with RV just before Christmas to share my findings with him. He was looking for a few good Heinze coils to put together for me to buy and test. RV used an HCCT to adjust coils via equal average current and was very interested in my preliminary findings. I had hoped to collaborate wi...

MKossor

Darren, the Heinze version does have different Pass/Fail criteria due to the Heinze coil properties being different from the KW coil parameters. I just started to accumulate feed back from a few folks who I have been working with. So far, the feedback has been excellent providing motivation to proce...

MKossor

Good to see this post inspiring thought and dialog. Here is some more to keep it going. 12.435V, is this Dc or Ac ? At 12V about every coil work well. 12.435V is the DC voltage powering the tester. The stimulus applied to the coil under test is derived from this DC power but is NOT a steady, fixed v...

MKossor

I've been studying Heinze coil operation and performance using the ECCT and have come to a very surprising conclusion. The Heinze coil is actually a superior coil design compared to the K-W coil. The Heinze coil is significantly easier to adjust and consistently out performs the K-W Coil. Coil firin...

MKossor

I noted the transformer Bob listed is out of stock and a bit expensive ($19 x 2 + 4.5 lbs Shipping ~$50). Here is another candidate 50VA isolation transformer that should work equally as well but only requires 1 transformer if you are looking for something to experiment with: Available from Mouser: ...

MKossor

A Montana 500 Guru introduced me to the EZ lap diamond hone (fine) for refurbishing dirty/worn coil point contacts. This hone is readily available, inexpensive (<$10) and think it works very well. https://www.amazon.com/EZE-LAP-LF-Fine-Diamond-Hone/dp/B0001WP20U/ref=sr_1_4?crid=1E6OWJH3NPZW3&keyword...

MKossor

So sorry to learn this tragic news. Sincere condolances to family and friends. You will be sorely missed.

MKossor

WTH, no one bought the business and tooling to carry on?
Sorry to learn that. Thank you for being a long time Model T vendor. Best wishes for a long and enjoyable retirement.

MKossor

Glad to lear. He is feeling better. Thoughts and prayers for a full recovery.

MKossor

Merry Christmas all.

Great photos! Thanks for sharing.

MKossor

Mr. Kosser Who? ;) 1. Is my analysis correct Yep 2. If the dwell was set at 5 ms, wouldn't the coil output be compromised. Yep Just in case in the off chance this affirmation is not not already intuitively obvious to most casual observers, I offer the following for your consideration. Relationship ...

MKossor

That's a sawtooth wave, not a sine. Nope . Here are the differences between the various waveforms. Which one comes closest to the actual measured magneto waveform? Waveform Differences.JPG The coil current waveform is actually a parabola (i=v^2) in response to the linear ramp of the magneto voltage...

MKossor

mike Kossner's Descriptions are important in understanding & mastering the ignition system. Who? ;) How would the magneto output look in an oscilloscope trace? Like a sine wave? i.e. AC? Nope, the magneto output waveform taken on my 1927 Touring looks like this: Coil Firing on Magneto Voltage and C...

MKossor

There continues to be considerable misunderstanding of the Model T trembler coil operation and its adjustment. There are resources available to learn and understand the basics and details associated with Model T coil operation, testing and tuning. Here is a link to one I prepared for MTFCA Webinar N...

MKossor

Another GWS wish to RV for speedy and full recovery.

MKossor

You also don't need any dang fancy modern technology gadgets to measure timed events either. You can still use anyone of these simple and efficient, environmentally friendly and 100% solar powered time pieces. Sundial Wrist Watches.JPG My point is: It all depends upon what you consider adequate perf...

MKossor

The OP proposes a very logical and straight forward approach to adjusting coils in car for optimal overall engine performance. All variables contributing to ignition timing variation are present (spark plug gap, timer housing to CAM misalignment, timer contact to timer contact variation, and of cour...

MKossor

Ah great minds think alike. The lack of parts either through obsolecsence or supply chain issues have decreased availability and increased the demand for the Model T voltage regulator so it seems its time for alternate designs to be considered. I too have begun working on another version. The consce...

MKossor

Sorry to learn the news and wish you all the best Bob. Thank you for doing all you have done for the hobby. Keep the faith, hope knows no bounds.

MKossor

Nice to see the Ideal Timer is living up to its name and its claim. Thanks for sharing your experiences using it.

MKossor

So sorry to learn the sad news. Condolences to Andy's family and friends.

MKossor

Btt, still looking.

MKossor

Happy Birthday Glen
Glad to learn your Model T projects are finally advancing and you are enjoying them.

MKossor

Interested in buying a set of 1927 Touring Side Curtains and associated hardware. Thank You.
Mictel@comcast.net

MKossor

Happy Birthday Dean

MKossor

I don't believe the magneto will be damaged by excessive current draw. My 1927 Touring developed a short to ground that didn't adversely effect the magneto field strength after fixing the short. Magneto magnets can, however, be discharged by inadvertently connecting battery power to the magneto so d...

MKossor

Hey Andy, great news! How about meeting me half way?

MKossor

Anyone within 100 miles of NJ with a functioning generator test stand I could buy or borrow? I have the VR circuit modeled and simulated but need to build a few and bench test Before making a production run. These would be just the circuit board and components only that would fit into the standard c...

MKossor

"I had my coils adjusted by his eminance, the coil Guru, and haven't had the top off my coil box in 20 years and my car still runs great" Yeah, YoKay...... heard it before. Glad to know folks are enjoying driving their Model T: no matter what.

MKossor

Scott, Very nice generator test stand. I wish I had one like that, then I could work on developing a voltage regulator replacement for the one that is no longer available. Have the circuit and simulation done but no substitute for bench testing.

MKossor

regarding your caps registering as bad...you did separate the points and block them with card-stock before you measured them, right? I find it hard to believe that those new caps measured "bad". I concur with Scott, coils can develop leakage paths through the coil core and wire insulation that can ...

MKossor

Mark, if the coil tester is for a collection of vintage test equipment, good luck in your pursuit. If the goal is to adjust Model T coils for optimal engine performance, you may wish to consider the ECCT coil tester. More information here: www.modeltecct.com

MKossor

Robert, my initial engine rebuilder broke down my engine as I watched too which was a welcome surprise after driving it 4 hours to their shop. Little did I know that was standard procedure. The nasty surprise came later after the engine was completely disassembled and 4 hours away. A written estimat...

MKossor

There is an issue with the electronic type of coil tester and the Model T trembler coil capacitors. I believe this is the thread you are referring to: https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22624&p=173985&hilit=capacitor+test+poor#p173985 The issue discussed therein pertained to capacitor lea...

MKossor

A few lessons learned from my recent engine and transmission rebuilding experience. Lesson learned #1 ; verbal estimates are worthless , regardless of 30 years of experience! Ask to see actual invoices for similar work done BEFORE you transport your engine and they tear it down or you may wind up pa...

MKossor

You could also try Digikey for the same items.

I usually try Mouser first because they typically have a lower price on the same item and offer reasonable USPS shipping.

MKossor

Here you go: https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Cornell-Dubilier-CDE/715P47454MD3?qs=SfuicISz1S%252BfNBhRXN5QAg%3D%3D 0.47uf +/- 5%, 400VDC, dv/dt=740V/us 21 in stock can ship immediately. Only $4.50 each + Shipping Or slightly smaller size with higher dv/dt rating: https://www.mouser.com/ProductD...

MKossor

That is a very good possibility Pat since the hole was near the top surface of the float.

MKossor

Repaired a tiny hole in my vaporizer carburetor float. Interesting thing was the hole was sufficiently large to let gas enter and fill up enough to sink it in the fuel bowl but no fuel would come out when removed, dried and shook; even after heating. Granted, it did take a couple of months to fill u...

MKossor

Nice work. Thanks for sharing your experience with this project.

MKossor

So Steve, do you now understand the original schematic diagram function? Perhaps I should have avoided the long winded explanation and stuck to providing direct, succinct answers to your questions; you did, afterall, ask for "lot of splainin" to do. 1 As this is a signal setup for a Model T and is m...

MKossor

Model T engine performance depends upon many variables that must all be functioning properly for optimal performance to occur. Weak link in the chain.JPG Like all Spark Ignition (SI) engines, the Model T engine performance depends heavily upon proper spark ignition timing. The primary variables resp...

MKossor

It also depends upon what type of ignition you are running. The E-Timer electronic timer operates much more efficiently than a stock timer, only firing the first spark with the full energy to ensure complete combustion. All subsequent sparks fired while the timer is "on contact" are strictly cosmeti...

MKossor

Steve, The original schematic diagram you posted is fundamental correct. The horizontal line passing through switches A, C and D associated with the Hazard function should be a dashed line for better clarity showing those 3 switches are "ganged" to all switch in unison, NOT an electrical connection ...

MKossor

Stuned and sad to learn this terriable news. Tony was a wonderful person, friend, mentor and selfless volunteer. He will be missed tremendously by many. Sincere condolances to the family and friends. So sad.

MKossor

Chocolate Field C2A 61

Electronically Cranked Coil Tester - ECCT Coil testing and Point Adjustment Demonstrations
Maintenance free Ideal Timer - I-Timer
Maintenance free Electronic Timer Ignition - E-Timer

Stop by and say hello!
Chocolate Field C2A 61

MKossor

Do you know what RMS is and what the RMS output value is of correctly working model T Alternating Current magneto? Yes, the RMS value of alternating current is also know as the effective value: equivalent to the same DC current that dissipates the same value of power in a resistive load. The RMS ou...

MKossor

Were the coils adjusted for equal current draw or equal firing Time?

MKossor

Given that a stock T tuned by ear will go just as well as stock T tuned with a microchip. In Reality, there is a Huge difference between a Model T engine that "Runs" and a Model T engine that runs well. Properly tuned coils for equal and consistent firing Time is very often the only difference. Its...

MKossor

Pat, I'm not sure if the coil secondary voltage actually ever reaches 39.6kV, the primary voltage spike only lasts for a few nanoseconds as spark initiates. I believe the longer duration secondary voltage could reach a peak voltage of 200V x 80 = 16kV that lasts for 10s of microseconds during the be...

MKossor

you can hold the coil points open and will not receive a shock. Scott, there is sufficient electrical potential developed across operating coil points to pose a shock hazard. Weather you experience a shock or not depends upon several variables including one's skin moisture/resistance. Good electric...

MKossor

Recent data I took on a Model T coil with properly maintained and adjusted points when studying ignition spark generation. Though this data might be of interest to the more technically minded Model T enthusiasts. Basic view Voltage measured across firing points.JPG Detailed description of events num...

MKossor

Arnie, The current and time scales in the oscilloscope screen capture refer to the large white boxes on the display. Each large white box is further divided in to 5 sub sections. For example, time on the X axis is 0.001 seconds (1ms) per large division and 1ms/5 = 200us per sub section within that l...

MKossor

Arnie, that is correct; a Model T coil should never be operated without a suitable spark gap. The coil spark gap should not exceed 1/4" at ambient atmospheric pressure. The concern with wider spark gaps is the coil will spark internally to the coil winding causing a breakdown of insulation and possi...

MKossor

FYI, testing if a cylinder is firing by shorting the spark plug to ground with a screwdriver is one of the most stressful things you can do to a Model T coil. The primary coil current increases markedly to very high values and is NOT advisable for that reason. Holding the points open with an insulat...

MKossor

Another alternative to Distributor is the E-Timer Electronic ignition that performs equal to or better than the distributor without sacrificing original appearance. It's a drop in replacement for the stock Timer that also runs on battery (6V to 12V) but retains the use of stock Model T coils, the or...

MKossor

Capacitor testing with the ECCT sometime produces a confusing result: The correct capacitor Value is displayed BUT the Poor LED is illuminated? So is the capacitor good or does it need to be replaced? Cap Test Poor Leakage.JPG The capacitor is Good and does Not need to be replaced. Here's why. Good ...

MKossor

WTB Champion Spark Plug Tester in good working condition. email: mictel at comcast dot net with the details. Thank you

MKossor

So sorry to learn of Bob's passing, condolences to the immediate and Model T families. Touching and fitting funeral procession in honor of his contributions and support of the hobby.

MKossor

Scott, Thanks for the background information on the Champion X spark plugs. Seems I have some reading to do. I know spark plugs are in the chain of variables responsible for overall engine performance but really did not think they were a major contributor. If they produce spark, they are good to go!...

MKossor

Pat, I've heard the same precautions. The plugs I used directly from the box and found them to be gaped at the recommended 0.025" but now you have me thinking. I know the HCCT fails to operate properly (missing, intermittent/inconsistent sparks) if the spark ring or pointer becomes oxidized and is e...

MKossor

My recent experience with the brand new (modern) version of the Champion X spark plugs left me totally bewildered. I decided to add new Champion X spark plugs as the last parts to complete (and I do mean complete) '27 engine and transmission rebuild. Could not wait to fire it up and... it ran like C...

MKossor

Thanks to all who have replied and for the information provided. Keith, nice Heinze coil adaptor. Having solved the ability to accurately measure Heinze coil firing time and consistency, the next task as you point out is; how to adjust the point element spring tensions and point gap to achieve equal...

MKossor

Does anyone use Heinze, Kingston or J&B coils in their Model T?

MKossor

The E-Timer was designed to operate on 6V, 8V, 10V or 12V battery. The computer monitors the operating voltage and adjusts coil timing for optimal performance automatically.

MKossor

Ford/K-W ignition coils used 1913-1927 are the most prevalent Model T coils in use today. What is the second most prevalent type of pre-1913 Model T coil in use today and how common they are? Is it Heinze, Kingston, J&B or other coil? The early coils are significantly more challenging to adjust for ...

MKossor

Clarification; coils typically draw a peak current of about 6 Amperes when spark fires. The average current is much lower because the coil points get pulled open periodically by the resulting magnetic field, interrupting the flow of current, which causes the spark to fire, lowering the average coil ...

MKossor

Scott, wonderful example of fine workmanship. Thank you for making these available and for letting everyone know. A welcome item for the hobby you can be proud of for sure.

MKossor

Been there, done that, band nut on my '27 touring.
Removed the bendix and caught it on a flywheel magnet after fishing for 4 hours with no luck. Now I stuff the ENTIRE transmission with rags when changing bands.

Congratulations on your catch.

MKossor

Just inspected the first samples of the Vane Actuators from a new run. The workmanship, quality and machining tolerances are all excellent with window edge to window edge machining tolerances well within the specified +/- 1 degree tolerance. This is very important because it determines the cylinder ...

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