MTFCA Forum

As if on cue, when the "big touring" thread drifted into thoughts on Pierce-Arrow, I found this. In New York City, even. I'm sure the mama cat appreciated the protection of the law !

Six months from now I will look here for the Pierce Arrow info instead of here:
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=26716
Pierce Arrow also had the most beautiful color ads in it's hay day. If you haven't seen any you should.
https://www.pierce-arrow.org/advertising-gallery/

Pierce was the ultimate luxury auto in its day. That made it something of a target in comedies. Who can forget Harold Lloyd racing one in his pet Model T, or Buster Keaton (the blacksmith) demolishing one as he attempts to swap engines in a Model T ?

Chuck and Jan toured with us in 2011 with their 1919 Pierce Arrow. While too late for the fender lights this shows a bit of it's luxurious accommodations.

What a beautiful, impressive car. Thanks for those photos, Rich ! Looking at images of later Pierces, it seems the integral headlights were available as late as '29. The conventional headlight was always an option apparently, giving rise to the "New York law" myth.

Rich,

To add to your comment regarding how late the in-fender headlite feature of the PA cars continued, Pierce continued with that trademark design right to the end of production in 1938.

Today, the national Pierce Arrow Society employs a profile of the unique fender/headlite shape as it's club logo.

Dick

It's interesting to know that the national Pierce Arrow Society used the unique fender/headlite shape as their club logo. This shows how powerful and recognizable a well-designed logo can be in representing a brand or organization. A good logo design agency can help create a memorable and effective logo that reflects the values and identity of a business or group.

"A high, rat-colored car..." ("Wise Blood")

Pierce's trademark fender-integrated headlights were too widespaced,
in the opinion of NY lawmakers and not allowed in that state. Not sure
what years The above car is one that was built to accomodate that law,
and was outfitted with the same Hall Mfg. drums used by Packard for a
spell in the mid-20's. Pierce's were grand automobiles, but those goofy
headlights, while making them a standout on the road, destroyed the
classic aesthetic of the period. Were I to have a desire to own a Pierce,
it would have to be one of those NY cars with the Hall headlights. And
yes, Pierce kept those "frogeyes" till the very end.

I hate to tell you this B Burger, however, the Pierce Arrow Society has declared that story to be a myth or old wive's tale. They have done extensive research and found no law anywhere in New York or basically anywhere that supports the long-held belief in that. The simple fact is that most of the Pierce Arrows sold in New York, both city and state, did have the fender headlamps! The photo above was supposedly taken in New York, and it has the fender headlamps.
Where that story began is apparently not known with any certainty. One story I have heard is that one of the five boroughs of New York might have toyed with the idea of banning widespread headlamps? But that apparently is not known for sure, and was never actually enacted into law. If there is any truth to that story at all? A friend in the PAS told me that story. But I frankly wasn't sure I believed him.

Pierce Arrow began the fender headlamps in 1913,and patented the design. Several other companies did try to sneak similar headlamps onto their cars over the years, however Pierce was very protective of their trademark and usually shut down the interlopers quickly, (Metz offered them on one special model in 1914, and very quickly withdrew them!)

Pierce Arrow continued with their trademark headlamps with only minor alterations in style through the early 1930s, finally with significant style changes their final couple years of automobile production. A 1935 or 1936 Pierce Arrow tried to keep their special look, however, they really weren't the same.
Throughout the late 1910s into the early 1930s, Pierce Arrow did offer standard style headlamps as an option for customers that did not want the trademark fenders. Even then, some people did not like the different look of the headlamps.

Interesting, Wayne. I know I read that information in some book of
Old Wives Tales of the Auto Industry somewhere !!! Truth is, they
should have been outlawed for being so ugly and wrecking the looks
of an otherwise exceptional car !