MTFCA Forum

What is the preference for crankshaft front seals?

Lang’s lists three options: original felt, rope, and neoprene.

Bill , I use the rope style from Lang's # 3012 R
and I glue a seal on the outside like in the picture Toon

I have tore many engines down, the rope seal does a wonderful job but have seen cranks with grooves in them from them, I do not know if it is soft cranks dirt and grime that has cause this. I prefer the modern neoprene that you RTV in place or the original felt if the crank has wear to it. Just my thoughts. Hope this helps.

It's good to hear the rope style is back on the market. Since they are probably not using asbestos any more, has anyone heard how they are holding up?
There are two different widths used on T's.

I believe the white rope seal with the little black core is stocked as an A model part. As such it is too long for a T. This is good because it allows each piece to be trimmed leaving the ends a little long to provide extra crush. They will not work on the earlier Ts with the narrow seal groove.

When installing each piece, I oil them first, and use an appropriate sized socket wrench to seat them in the grooves.

Allan from down under.

I've used felt in two engines without any problems.

Another option to consider is to install a “SpeediSleeve” where the packing runs.
I’ve built up the worn area with “plastic metal”
and turned it down to size. Then drive on the Speedi sleeve (Timken # 99118). Now you have a surface that is BETTER than new and totally invisible outside!

The neoprene seal which fits in the groove works, however, you cannot get the timing cover off without pulling the engine.
Norm

Thanks for posting this.I am at a point that this is important info.I was looking at the seals and thought of geting the neopreme.But Thanks Norm for reminding me that I would have to take the engine loose to get it out.
There are some pits in the crankshaft on mine ,tiny but there.I was thinking of using Liquid steel or similar to give a smooth surface for whatever seal to ride on .I don't know if I can still get that brand.I used it on a new hydrolic cylinder that got gouged and it worked great to fill a groove.

Mack

if it is pitted and want a permanent, functional repair, you want this: https://www.modeltford.com/item/3012SL.aspx

Hello Bill,

Speedi-Sleeve is the way to go, and that is what Scott's link to Lang's appears to be. I have used them for this and several other applications and there is no substitute. I do not have one handy otherwise I would give you the part number. Measure the size of the crank seal surface and look up Speedi-Sleeve and determine what part number you need. Then search for that part number on the internet, nothing against Lang's but you may be able to find it for half of what Lang's (or any parts house) is asking (I usually do).

If the surface is badly worn, I build the surface up with JB Weld then use a file to dress it down to correct size before installing the sleeve using unworn adjacent surfaces as a guide.

Terry

So, to use the speedi sleeve does the crank need to be turned down so the OD of the shaft is correct once applied?

Sleeve if the crank is worn. I used a little loctite to hold it in place. Sorry, I don't recall the specific loctite I used... it wasn't thread lock, it was for holding items that were supposed to be a press tight fit but weren't. Take a look at their website, you'll find a few options, many are available on Amazon. Once the sleeve is in place you run it as-is, you don't turn it down.

Rope seals are great... like Norm said, you can't get the front cover off without damaging the modern seal; then you've got to split the block from the pan.

You don't have to pull the pan with a neoprene seal to get the timing cover off unless you are going to replace the seal. I have had a number of timing covers off and just clean out the old sealer and put new in the groove when putting it back together.

Thanks Les for that part number,
https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/na ... 18/2552594
I can stop in and get the store to order me 1.I like talking to the gal in there anyhow.

For this price,I would rather go ahead and use the speedy sleeve.I used 1 of a different size on the right rear axle of my 66F100 that would just not stop dripping rear end oil on the brakes.Fixed the problem!

Just ordered a 99118 speedi-sleeve from Rockauto with tax and shipped to my door for $22,69 (with discount code 129534791118895320). Thanks for the info!

The Loktite product used for building up worn tolerances between parts is called ' quickmetal '. I have used it extensively on agricultural machinery when fitting bearing/gears/ hubs etc on worn shafts. The components go together while the product is fluid, and it cures in place. Removal requires just enough heat without burning paint off!

Allan from down under.

Like Allan, I used the white rope seal with the little black core is stocked as an A model part. Just cut the lenght you want with a knife and always fit perfectly. Cheap and efficent option.

Use a 30 X 50 X 05 AO - VBR modern seal on the outside glued on with Ultra Black for a leakfree crankshaft. If your engine is in the car you can not replace the stock seal. this seal is very thin and will fit between most crank pulleys and the block with no interference!

You may also install it like the pictures Toon posted. I like to cut all the web and flatten it like a daisy flower to allow a fit between the alum pulley.

This is a must do anytime you have the radiator off or the pulley off if you have any evidence of an oil leak.

THANKS ALL!!!

https://www.metricsealsinc.com/30x50x5- ... 0-x-5-baof
Gene ,is the seal you speak of like this? I had a bit of trouble translating the numbers using google.

Mack, Yes The seal with a spring is designed for low pressure. You can look at Harwal Rotary Shaft Oil Seals. after the size the "ADL" designation is with a seal and a dust lip. It is a VBR which means Viton Black Rubber. On their site you can search the different sizes and the 30 50 05 works on most T's because it is one of the thinnest at 05 thick. hope this helps

The seal got here today Gene,thanks! I will get payment in the mail this week.Tuesday probably.

Gene,I forgot the post office stop this morning,I promise to make that stop in the morning,my 85 year old dad has gotten to the point he has some "to do liist" items and it was all I could do to remember all that this morning!
I did make it by Orielys and ordered the sleeve!. I am still going to fill the small pits on the shaft and smooth it up so this modern seal will have a smooth surface to ride on. The pits are not large but when oil is involved it seeks out the tinyest of places to escape.

I don't know what year Ford went to the wide seal, but the earlier T's use a narrow seal. I'm fortunate to have a supply of both. I don't understand two of the pictures above. They don't look like any T I've ever seen.

Well I ordered my speedy sleeve yesterday and got it this morning.Gene,your envolope should be there monday.It is in the turtles bag and headed your way.

Question. The lip on the speedy sleeve,considering the crank seal is not all the way back against the gear on the crankshaft,the lip of the speedy sleeve would need to be removed once it was on the crank shaft because the seal runs a 1/4 inch or a tad more ahead of the gear right?

Lynn Cook's method of installing a crankshaft seal. The good thing about his method is the fact that if the new seal ever goes bad it can be replaced without separating the pan and the block, or removing the engine. Anyone who knew him will agree that back in Lynn's day, he could always find a better way.
https://tennesseets.weebly.com/uploads/ ... r_seal.pdf

I thought I would bump this because of the question about the lip of the speedy sleeve.
The seal is out from the gear a bit and I don't understand what to do about the lip on it.

Bumpty again OK I was sent a Email from a nice fellow that explained the lip gets broken off after install. So that clears up the muddy water for me.Thanks folks the help I do get here.Without help from folks and affordable parts when needed,I couldn't enjoy this hobby.

Sealhttps://mtfca.com/phpBB3/download/file.php?mode=view&id=45984&sid=dd62cb3ad2a6b33d10608ec74363b3f6