odd coil

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Philip
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odd coil

Post by Philip » Mon Mar 16, 2020 2:38 pm

i have a coil that acts strange it will fire and the car doesent really skip but dont run good either.
we checked it out on the ecct had odd readings put on new points and it checked out. i have not
tried it in the car yet but it will not fire in my hcct i have 6 good ones so im good any ideas. philip


Ron Patterson
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Re: odd coil

Post by Ron Patterson » Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:58 pm

Pictures??

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MKossor
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Re: odd coil

Post by MKossor » Mon Mar 16, 2020 5:25 pm

What do you mean by Odd readings? A screen shot of the capacitor test, coil dwell test and multi-spark test results would indeed be helpful. Did the capacitor test results indicate proper value (0.47uF)? A coil with a bad capacitor (low value for example) can be adjusted for near normal firing time on the single spark test but not fire spark consistently during the multi-spark test as observed in at the spark gap. A properly adjusted coil with good capacitor will fire spark consistently without missing any during the multi-spark test.
I-Timer + ECCT Adjusted Coils = Best Model T Engine Performance Possible!
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J1MGOLDEN
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Re: odd coil

Post by J1MGOLDEN » Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:17 pm

You cannot compare ECCT and HCCT reading and expect them to be the same.

That is like comparing apples and oranges, as they work totally different.


Topic author
Philip
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Re: odd coil

Post by Philip » Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:33 pm

Mike Don Ellis did the coils for me. By odd I mean on the ecct it was all over the scale
Without doing anything. Cap test is fine we put in New ones. We put new points on and it
Tested good. I tried it again today in my hcct it will spark if I turn it real fast. I'm sure it will run
But seems different than the other five I have I think the coil has an internal issue. By the
Way we love the ecct it has improved a lot of cars in our chapter. More speed for sure


Topic author
Philip
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Re: odd coil

Post by Philip » Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:41 pm

Jim yea I'm not comparing the two my hand crank don't even have working meters I just
Use it to see if they work it shows me the one has an issue and may not be reliable. Philip

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MKossor
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Re: odd coil

Post by MKossor » Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:38 pm

Thanks for the additional information Philip. Not the capacitor since it is new. Are there missing sparks during the multi-Spark test? If so, then the coil may be sparking internally which is typically a non-repairable fault. That can happen if the coil was ever operated without a suitable spark gap (1/4" gap maximum).
I-Timer + ECCT Adjusted Coils = Best Model T Engine Performance Possible!
www.modeltitimer.com www.modeltecct.com


Dan Hatch
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Re: odd coil

Post by Dan Hatch » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:48 am

What make is it? I got some from my Dad years ago take looked just like the kw reproduce made in the 60’s. In fact they were made by kw.
They would not fire on 6 volts and made only a small spark on 12. He got them from a company that made targets for Army to shoot Redeye missiles at.
All we could figure was they were 24 volt. Which is what the Firebee drone was that towed them.
There was no voltage mark on them.
Maybe you got one of them.
Thanks Dan


Ron Patterson
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Re: odd coil

Post by Ron Patterson » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:54 am

I posted this information on this forum in the past.
As Dan Hatch pointed out during the 1950's to late 1970's several companies needing an ignition source made ignition coils that were the same size and shape as the Model T coil, but the internal circuit design was different. As I recall there are about 20 different versions used in different systems. Some of these work in the Model T on Battery and Magneto especially the ones made by KW in the 1940's to Mid 1960's . Some others work on battery but not on the Model T magneto.
I long ago quit trying to identify the exact reasons these would not work on the Model T because it was simply too time consuming.
Ron Patterson


Topic author
Philip
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Re: odd coil

Post by Philip » Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:55 am

all ford coils i have already been through the kw repop deal. we finally got it to act right on the ecct and it may run fine.
i put it back in my hcct and it will spark if you spin it as fast as possible. philip


Luke
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Re: odd coil

Post by Luke » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:07 pm

I have noticed, with my electronic tester, that a few coils set for the 'optimum' ~2ms time-to-fire or ttf at 12V (which I believe is what Mike's machine utilises?) will not fire well in a vehicle, nor in a HCCT. Adjusting the electronic tester voltage down tends to support the observed issue (ie. most don't fire at all well on the lower voltage).

FWIW some of these coils have had new points and capacitors.

I've not as yet spent much time on the why's of this (I have some theories!), but practically I find that if these coils are set for a longer ttf then they will operate reasonably in the vehicle (and are 'better' on the HCCT).

I don't wish to [re]ignite any debate on electronic testing vs 'old-school' methods, that's been covered ad nauseum, rather I mention this simply to add to the general body of knowledge.

If you had a mind to experiment it may be that you could set the ttf to say 2.2ms or more and see how the coil operated elsewhere. If it turned out that 'fixed' it then obviously you'd need to adjust the other coils in the set to be the same ttf, but it would mean you could continue to use it going forward.

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