23 runabout rewooding: Here it all begins

[Stephen_heatherly]

I bought a low cowl wood firewall 23 runabout in July of last year. I realized early on that the body wood was going to need some help but I've been putting off rewooding the body because it's a major undertaking. Throughout this last week I fully disassembled the body. There is literally not one piece of original wood that can be reused. It all must be replaced. I have most of a wood kit for the car and reached out to another forum member who offered to send me an article detailing the rewooding process of a 23 runabout. My main concern is how I should go about determining exactly where the vertical woods posts should be mounted. I have the original body stills and the sheet metal to use as a guide, but any advice or knowledge that you can offer would be appreciated.

Thank you,
Stephen

[Hap_Tucker]

Stephen,

I received your e-mail through the forum. But I cannot figure out how to attach the article and send it back to you. Please e-mail me your e-mail address and I will gladly send you R.V. Anderson's article he did on re-wooding his low cowl 1923 Roadster. Or if any of you know how to attach something to an e-mail sent through the forum -- please let me know.

If anyone else would like to receive a free copy of R.V. Anderson's article on Rewooding his low cowl 1923 Roadster -- just send me an e-mail with your e-mail address and something like "send 1923 Roadster Rewooding article" or "Model T" in the subject line -- it gets read quicker that way.

Note this is sort-of a continuation of Stephen's question back in Dec 2019 -- see: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9195&p=68707#p67798 1923 Roadster needs wood replaced.

Stephen -- would you please post and/or send me some photos of your car. Specifically does your body have the narrow or wide arm rests?

1917-1920 touring and later Roadster

Arm rest wide 1917-1920 tourings (also 1914-l1916 but without the end cap. - Copy.jpg (15.72 KiB) Viewed 5460 times

starting 1921 touring roadster a little than the touring

Photos from "The Vintage Ford" used by permission (also the same ones are in Bruce McCalley's CD and his book "The Model T Ford" -- he was the first editor of "The Vintage Ford."

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off

[Stephen_heatherly]

Huh, well I just learned something new there. I wasn't aware that there are two different arm rests. Mine are the narrow ones. I'll post pictures shortly.

Stephen

[Scott_Conger]

if you run into problems, I have done the exact car. Contact me through email if you'd like.

[Stephen_heatherly]

Scott, that is beautiful! More than likely at some point I will take you up on your offer.

Thank you

[Stephen_heatherly]

Here a few pictures of the car.

Stephen

[Scott_Conger]

You are in really good shape, template-wise.

This is what I started with, and that was about it for the wood:

[Scott_Conger]

Once you get into it, it will look like this when you're done, and you will have installed/removed the skin dozens of times:

[Hap_Tucker]

Stephen,

Thank you for posting the photos. I had looked but not seen any photos of your car showing those kinds of details. I wanted to make sure that you had a 1923 body and not an earlier one. The slant windshield posts will easily bolt onto the 1915-1922 open bodies and many Ts had their bodies as well as other parts swapped out over the years. My great uncles swapped their Model T bodies back in the early 1930s. They each wanted the other style body but the thought their own chassis was better. And in the 1960s I swapped three 1928-29 Model A bodies. It is relatively easy to do. From those photos it appears you have the 1923 low cowl body. You should also have the larger rear turtle deck with the bead on the back of the front seat to match it. That was introduced with the 1923 roadsters. I did not see a picture of the rear deck attached to the body in the photos you posted. You did post the inside of the front seat and looking at the bead on the back of front seat in that photo we can say that panel also is 1923-25. But a rear shot of the body before it was taken apart would show the turtle next to the bead and make it obvious that it was all 1923 and not any of the earlier parts.

Looking at your photos as well as the ones that Scott posted -- they both are very similar and possibly identical to the body in R.V. Anderson's article. They all use the metal floor board riser and the metal piece at the very front of the body sill. Below is that metal piece at the front of the body sill from R. V. Anderson's article:

Right Hand Body Bracker - R V Anderson Article - Vintage Ford.JPG (37.25 KiB) Viewed 5257 times

You should have received the R.V. Anderson article by now, if not please let me know and I can resend it. And good luck with your project!

Scott -- thank you so much for sharing the photos and your experience rewooding your car! You did a fantastic job!

Respectfully submitted,

Hap l9l5 cut off

[Scott_Conger]

Thank you Hap. Kind words indeed from someone who knows their stuff.

And you are correct. It is the exact body that RV did and so well documented in his article from years ago. Having found that magazine in a local used book dealer's shop, I corresponded with RV several times during the course of the restoration of my car. He was very cordial and helpful as my car was missing about 90% of it's wood. Fortunately I had very short pieces of most unique parts and by using the "shadows" on the interior of the sheet metal, and the pictures from RV's argicle, I was able to deduce width, etc of the pieces.

As a very small detail note, this is one of the few instances where the sheet metal "hip strap" which keeps the interior/seat padding from caving in at either side, is mounted diagonally. All of the ones I've ever seen on any other year car was always mounted in a horizontal fashion.

I started by purchasing a door "kit". I was so disturbed by the flimsy construction and lack of authenticity, I became buddies with a local old-time mill owner and had him mill ash to the odd-ball thicknesses necessary for the project. He was as excited by the progress as I was and always made sure to be the one who made the delivery to me when I showed up. His equipment dated to the same era as the car and he was in the process of resurecting the family business from having been closed for 40 years. My lumber was VERY well dried!

[Stephen_heatherly]

Some more pictures of the sills where the vertical pieces attach and the turtle deck.
Stephen

[Scott_Conger]

Stephen

keep those angle irons on the rear of the seat assy. Those are original to the car.

also notice the rabbeted grooves along the upper and lower portion of the main rail. Kits will not have those and the upper and lower reinforcement boards will be glued in place . Those rabbets and the splines on the back of the reinforcement boards allow you to move them fore/aft slightly for best fit and if made snuggly, they do not require permantnt fastening during fitting. Once you're happy, you secure them as originally with (I recall) #12 wood screws (you'll see them)

[Stephen_heatherly]

Scott, I was wondering what the grooves in the sills were for. Your explanation makes perfect sense.

Hap, I got your email with the articles. I printed them out and have been studying them. This is going to be a real learning experience for sure.

Thank you,
Stephen

[Jim Sims]

I will doing the same thing in a few weeks. I am saving all these photos to use for reference when I do start. Thank you all for the postings.