MTFCA Forum

There is a gap between the frame and the engine support arms. Is this acceptable or might the weight of the engine pull down the frame?

The best I can measure, the engine support frame hole is 21.5 on center.

There is a block of wood inside the frame rail. And their is a bolt through the side rail, through the wood and into the arm.

If I take the block out, the frame touches the arm, but I would have to widen the hole in the frame.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts or advice.

Bob

I don’t think the arm should actually touch the frame. All the contact should be the wood block and I believe your block accomplishes that feat. I must admit the arms should lie flatter on top of the frame, that is best fixed with the pan out of the frame.
Don’t forget the horizontal bolt. Not too tight and drop a split pin to hold the nut in position

I would be more concerned about how the sided curl up and not the gap. They should be flat across the bottom, not bowed. The bolts look fine.

No there should be no gap. Ideally, the underside of the pan support should fit flush against the top of the chassis channel. It appears that a combination of loose pan support bolts that hold the pan supports tight against the top of the chassis channel and the weight of your engine has caused this problem. I would not be surprised if the entire pan was out of alignment, which could cause your supports to crack and break. Next time you have the engine out, the pan and supports should be straightened and aligned on a pan jig. Jim Patrick

There are two bolts for each arm. The shorter one goes up through the frame and arm with the nut and cotter pin on top, as in your pictures. It should be snug, not tight. Then the block goes in, and the longer bolt goes through the frame, block, and arm with the nut and cotter pin on the inside. Again, snug, not tight. Yes the frame top and arm holes should be 21½" on center.

I recently had to turn some arms orange at the curve to make them lie flat on the frame and to make them line up with the frame holes.


I agree with Jim that the arms should made to lie flat and the pan should be checked and probably straightened on a jig. Most need it.

Is the frame cracked or is that a scratch

Is the bolt hole on this mount partially gone?

It is a scratch. Thanks!

The bolt hole is center ok. Thanks!

On my 12 it is closer to the frame than yours but does not touch the frame only the center part with the bolt touch the frame so I would say you are good Cheers Colin

One question. Has pan been on a real pan jig?
That would be where to start. Dan

It is kind of hard to put the bolt through the frame, block, and pan support. Once you get that bolt in then the nut is the hard part. This is how I do it: I use a box end wrench with some masking tape on it to hold the nut in place. put the tape over the back side of the wrench and let some of the tape go around the wrench and into the hole in the wrench. Then press in the nut so it fits tightly into the wrench. Now lower the nut down into the space between the bracket and the pan. While doing this, you turn the bolt from the outside of the frame until the threads begin to catch. and then tighten it up. leave it loose enough that it will turn with the nut pinned in. This bolt is just to keep the wood block in place but not too tight. An easy way to line up the hole with the slot in the nut would be to mark a stripe on the head of the bolt before you install it. The stripe would line up with the hole in the other of the bolt so you can find the place where the slot is up and down. You don't need to bend the cotter pin all the way back, just enough to keep it from falling out if the bolt should turn in place, but easy to remove later if you need to pull the engine. If your engine has a starter, it will be harder to install on that side especially an open car with no door on the driver's side, but it is doable.
Norm

That gap between the side of the arm and the frame is how it's supposed to be. Like has already been said, there is a hard wood block that goes in there that supports the engine. The side bolt should not be tightened at all. Spin the nut down with your fingers and maybe one more notch so the bolt won't rattle then cotter pin it. If the bolt is tightened too much, the pan arm will eventually snap off. One of the pan arms on my runabout was broken off because the side bolts were too tight

Stephen

What Dan said. That is most definitely the place to start with all pans. Get them squeaky clean first, do an initial check on a jig to see if using the pan is at all feasible, then if it is in fact usable, go on to repair any cracks, replace or properly repair any missing forgings. Then have the pan finally aligned on a jig.

Some are stating the vertical bolt is tightened and others state to leave it loose. Who is correct?
Yes, I know that the horizontal bolt is definitely loose.

The vertical bolt should be tight. The horizontal bolt snug but not tight.The idea is to let the wood block stop sideward movement, but not let the bolt cause the metal to bend which will cause metal fatigue.
Norm

Just about every pan I put on my jig the arms are way off. Most likely the problem with this pan. Get it on a real jig. Dan