How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
Forum rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules
If you need help logging in, or have question about how something works, use the Support forum located here Support Forum
Complete set of Forum Rules Forum Rules
-
Topic author - Posts: 1198
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:58 am
- First Name: Mario
- Last Name: Brossard
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Touring and 1914 speedster
- Location: Quebec City Canada
- MTFCA Number: 30981
- MTFCI Number: 30981
- Board Member Since: 1999
How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
Hi,
I'm ready ton install the Brass wooden body trim, 3/4" x 1/4" x 60" arround my 1914 fire wall. Any suggestion how to do the 90 degree corner? See bellow 2 pictures I took from internet. The third pictur, is my actual project so far. I would like to avoid cutting the brass at 45 degree if it is possible.
Thank you for the help.
I'm ready ton install the Brass wooden body trim, 3/4" x 1/4" x 60" arround my 1914 fire wall. Any suggestion how to do the 90 degree corner? See bellow 2 pictures I took from internet. The third pictur, is my actual project so far. I would like to avoid cutting the brass at 45 degree if it is possible.
Thank you for the help.
Super Mario Bross
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
-
- Posts: 6796
- Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:51 am
- First Name: Richard
- Last Name: Eagle
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1909 TR 1914 TR 1915 Rd 1920 Spdstr 1922 Coupe 1925 Tudor
- Location: Idaho Falls, ID
- MTFCA Number: 1219
- Contact:
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
I just notched the two legs and bent the center section. A 90 degree notch with the point just level with the flat center portion worked fine for me.
When did I do that?
-
- Posts: 680
- Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:01 pm
- First Name: R.V.
- Last Name: Anderson
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1914, 1920, 1923, 1923
- Location: Kennedy, NY
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
Measure and mark carefully, then use a square file to cut the notch. Takes about 30 seconds if you are a slow filer.
-
- Posts: 5205
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm
- First Name: Allan
- Last Name: Bennett
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1912 van, 1917 shooting brake, 1929 roadster buckboard, 1924 tourer, 1925 barn find buckboard, 1925 D &F wide body roadster, 1927LHD Tudor sedan.
- Location: Gawler, Australia
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
To add to RVs caution to measure carefully, lay the channel across the top of the firewall and use a mitre gauge to mark the corners. Measuring the width of the firewall and transposing that to the channel surface will leave the top, two thicknesses of the channel short. Or else, lay it on the firewall and mark the underside [inside] of the channel and file to that mark. You can always plane a smidgeon off the firewall if necessary for a neat fit, which is better than having the bends too far apart.
Hope this helps,
Allan from down under.
Hope this helps,
Allan from down under.
-
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:25 pm
- First Name: Andre
- Last Name: Valkenaers
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 ; 1922 ; 1915.
- Location: Scherpenheuvel
- MTFCA Number: 23792
- MTFCI Number: 19330
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
I don't know if this will help?
Andre
Belgium
Andre
Belgium
-
- Posts: 487
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:25 pm
- First Name: Andre
- Last Name: Valkenaers
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1926 ; 1922 ; 1915.
- Location: Scherpenheuvel
- MTFCA Number: 23792
- MTFCI Number: 19330
-
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:38 pm
- First Name: John
- Last Name: Regan
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Open Runabout, 1911 Touring, 1912 Delivery Cars (2), 1915 Roadster, 1916 Roadster, 1923 Touring Car
- Location: St. Charles, IL
- MTFCA Number: 14725
- MTFCI Number: 77
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
I made the dash pces for the T-100 project so I had to make 6 of them to fit 1914 dashes which I also had to make 6 of. If you have a vertical mill that you can use and don't want to have to file the dash to fit the molding which I probably would not do since the 1914 molding wasn't as expensive to make right as was the dash. I did NOT cut the dash mold length at all to start with but concentrated on making the V notch cuts at the exact distance apart for each dash. In other words there was a molding marked #1 which fit dash #1. It is actually pretty easy if you pay attention to what I did and you can practice on a piece of the molding near one end to start with since the molding is rather long compared to the length of the 3 sides added together. Confirm that first. On a 14 the ends of the brass molding are cut at bevels along with the firewall so that the firewall will not rub on the fender top surface. Those bevels are on both front and back edge of the lower bottom of the dash since the 1914 dash was reversible and might be mounted for Right Hand or Left Hand drive. This is a detail not usually performed on a 1914 dash and the early ones didn't do it that way but cut the bottom flush.
Lay the molding full length top side down across the mill table which will move in direction for a perfect cross cut of the molding. Locate the length from the end of the molding to the exact middle of your cross cut for one of the corners but add an inch to allow for it to be fitted to the dash and the bottom end to be cut after the molding is installed to the dash. The key here is to use the right cutter. There is a 90 degree carbide bevel Burr Bit that is about 1/2" or 5/8" in diameter. It is short and can only bevel a hole that is less than about 1/2" deep but it is SHARP on the end and will cut you a perfect notch ACROSS the molding. Just turn on the mill and move the table across under the mill to notch both front and rear edge but DO NOT go deep enough to hit the bottom inside. Slowly lower the bit a small amount and run the mill table back across but make sure you only put a very shallow cut (scratch) into the bottom (underside) of the trim piece. You should end up with a perfect corner with a slight weakening of the place you want it to bend. There will be some burrs but you can trim them with a razor blade and fine sandpaper before you bend anything. NOW it gets a bit tricky. Place your dash in a wood vise or clamp it to something so you can work on it right side up. Remove the trim piece from the mill table but very very careful to NOT let the end piece flop around and get distorted. I put a 3/4" thick board into the groove while the piece is on the mill table and use that board to keep the cut piece from bending yet. I take the piece to the dash and slide the piece along the top of the dash while supporting the end so it won't start to bend until I have the cut notch just a very small amount past the scratch and then I carefully bend the end piece down and tap it with a rubber mallet to seat it along the side and along the top. The miter will close exactly at 45 degrees and you have one corner done. Make sure you have the molding piece flush and fully installed on that corner with clamps and then make sure the top is also pushed down onto the dash into final position. When that is done, take a razor blade or stanley knife with a new razor blade in it and lay it flush against the side top edge of the dash and make a shallow scratch across the underside of the dash trim. Now go back to the mill and reclamp the trim piece and run the same cutter bit across the other end using the scratch mark to center the carbide 90 degree angle deburring tool again. Be careful to not to let the loose end fly around and get bent or unbent. I made a corner piece that was placed into the previously fitted end and clamped the corner to 90 degrees so as to hold it in place and had a support ledger under it to prevent that corner from being ruined while I repeated the milling operations on the other end. I then made the same cuts on the other end to the same depth of the cutter tip which will then be bent to 90 degrees when placed on the dash and you should have a perfect fit from end to end. Trim the ends with the bevel on front and back edges or trim it flush as you see fit but the angle cut prevents scratches on original fenders but depending on fit up of fenders you may be able to fit it with a flat at the bottom.
I know this sounds complicated but after you make the first one and figure out how to do it. The next 5 are easier ha ha. This is NOT a fast technique but rather it is a very accurate technique and your dash trim remains in one piece with perfect corners. You have lots of length of trim that will allow you to practice how deep to make the cut and your mill marks scales will show you what depth to return to for the final depth of cut. You can make 3 or 4 trial cuts in the VERY END of the trim piece to get it to bend closed perfectly and you will really like how the corner closes if you are careful to trim away any flash thin stock before you final bend the top to side piece corner.
Hope this helps.
Lay the molding full length top side down across the mill table which will move in direction for a perfect cross cut of the molding. Locate the length from the end of the molding to the exact middle of your cross cut for one of the corners but add an inch to allow for it to be fitted to the dash and the bottom end to be cut after the molding is installed to the dash. The key here is to use the right cutter. There is a 90 degree carbide bevel Burr Bit that is about 1/2" or 5/8" in diameter. It is short and can only bevel a hole that is less than about 1/2" deep but it is SHARP on the end and will cut you a perfect notch ACROSS the molding. Just turn on the mill and move the table across under the mill to notch both front and rear edge but DO NOT go deep enough to hit the bottom inside. Slowly lower the bit a small amount and run the mill table back across but make sure you only put a very shallow cut (scratch) into the bottom (underside) of the trim piece. You should end up with a perfect corner with a slight weakening of the place you want it to bend. There will be some burrs but you can trim them with a razor blade and fine sandpaper before you bend anything. NOW it gets a bit tricky. Place your dash in a wood vise or clamp it to something so you can work on it right side up. Remove the trim piece from the mill table but very very careful to NOT let the end piece flop around and get distorted. I put a 3/4" thick board into the groove while the piece is on the mill table and use that board to keep the cut piece from bending yet. I take the piece to the dash and slide the piece along the top of the dash while supporting the end so it won't start to bend until I have the cut notch just a very small amount past the scratch and then I carefully bend the end piece down and tap it with a rubber mallet to seat it along the side and along the top. The miter will close exactly at 45 degrees and you have one corner done. Make sure you have the molding piece flush and fully installed on that corner with clamps and then make sure the top is also pushed down onto the dash into final position. When that is done, take a razor blade or stanley knife with a new razor blade in it and lay it flush against the side top edge of the dash and make a shallow scratch across the underside of the dash trim. Now go back to the mill and reclamp the trim piece and run the same cutter bit across the other end using the scratch mark to center the carbide 90 degree angle deburring tool again. Be careful to not to let the loose end fly around and get bent or unbent. I made a corner piece that was placed into the previously fitted end and clamped the corner to 90 degrees so as to hold it in place and had a support ledger under it to prevent that corner from being ruined while I repeated the milling operations on the other end. I then made the same cuts on the other end to the same depth of the cutter tip which will then be bent to 90 degrees when placed on the dash and you should have a perfect fit from end to end. Trim the ends with the bevel on front and back edges or trim it flush as you see fit but the angle cut prevents scratches on original fenders but depending on fit up of fenders you may be able to fit it with a flat at the bottom.
I know this sounds complicated but after you make the first one and figure out how to do it. The next 5 are easier ha ha. This is NOT a fast technique but rather it is a very accurate technique and your dash trim remains in one piece with perfect corners. You have lots of length of trim that will allow you to practice how deep to make the cut and your mill marks scales will show you what depth to return to for the final depth of cut. You can make 3 or 4 trial cuts in the VERY END of the trim piece to get it to bend closed perfectly and you will really like how the corner closes if you are careful to trim away any flash thin stock before you final bend the top to side piece corner.
Hope this helps.
-
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:38 pm
- First Name: John
- Last Name: Regan
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Open Runabout, 1911 Touring, 1912 Delivery Cars (2), 1915 Roadster, 1916 Roadster, 1923 Touring Car
- Location: St. Charles, IL
- MTFCA Number: 14725
- MTFCI Number: 77
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
I thought I should post a picture of the tool bit I used. Just make sure it is hard carbide with lots of cutting edges and it is a 90 degree tapered countersink shape like this picture if it posts OK[image]
[/image]-
- Posts: 1411
- Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:57 am
- First Name: Adam
- Last Name: Doleshal
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: ‘13 Touring, ‘24 Touring, ‘25 TT dump truck, ‘26 Tudor, ‘20 Theiman harvester T powerplant, ‘20 T Staude tractor
- Location: Wisconsin
- MTFCA Number: 23809
- MTFCI Number: 1
- Board Member Since: 2000
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
If you’re going to the trouble of doing this on a milling machine and don’t already own a 90 degree countersink; just set the milling head at 45 degrees and use any regular end-mill.. Lock the quill and use the knee to obtain your depth adjustment.
-
Topic author - Posts: 1198
- Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:58 am
- First Name: Mario
- Last Name: Brossard
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1911 Touring and 1914 speedster
- Location: Quebec City Canada
- MTFCA Number: 30981
- MTFCI Number: 30981
- Board Member Since: 1999
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
Thank you all for advices. I will take my time for sure and make several measurements in case.
Super Mario Bross
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
1911 Touring
1914 Speedster
-
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:30 am
- First Name: Ray
- Last Name: Syverson
- * REQUIRED* Type and Year of Model Ts owned: 1913 Depot Hack
- Location: Lake Zurich IL
- Board Member Since: 2010
Re: How to install brass wooden on 1914 firewal
I notched a lot of Brass moldings when I was selling them way back when. I used a metal miter tool like this.