looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

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DickC
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looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by DickC » Sat Jan 09, 2021 5:02 am

I have a 1925 T coupe. The location of the battery makes it almost impossible to install any of the classical switches on the battery. I have also looked at the other switches that attach remotely and haven't found a convenient place to install. Any suggestions?

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Humblej
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Humblej » Sat Jan 09, 2021 7:34 am

I suggest a 1/2" open end wrench in your tool box and forget about a switch. We dont have battery cut off switches on modern cars but they do have fuses, thats what I would recommend to anyone wanting to improve electrical safety to thier model T, add a fuse, ditch the cut off switch.
Last edited by Humblej on Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Chris Barker » Sat Jan 09, 2021 9:44 am

On the floor next to the starter switch?
In the upstand at the front of the seat (if it has one).

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Mark Gregush
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Mark Gregush » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:00 am

What Chris suggest sounds good or if room on the firewall. Not everyone wants to take everything out of the trunk/boot every time to disconnect the battery and reach over and down into the abyss to do so. :D
I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas! :shock:

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by bnchief » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:16 am

Humblej wrote:
Sat Jan 09, 2021 7:34 am
I suggest a 1/2" open end wrench in your tool box and forget about a switch. We dont have battery cut off switches on modern cars but they do have fuses, thats what I would recommend to anyone wanting to improve electrical safety to thier model T, add a fuse, ditch the cut off switch.
Do you keep your fuse in the toolbox also? A cut-off switch is a good safety item as are fuses the man was asking a reasonable question maybe i took your answer wrong. In a coupe it can be placed where others stated as well as doing the negative side of the battery.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Oldav8tor » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:22 am

I chose to install a solenoid in the cable from the battery to the starter rather than a foot switch. You could still keep the foot switch only use it to activate the solenoid rather than directly connect to the starter. For the feed to the terminal strip that provides current to all other circuits I installed a 30 Amp automatic circuit breaker.
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by 2nighthawks » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:35 am

To add to what bnchief said, we all know that when doing any work that involves electrical wiring or anything electrical, it's always a good safety measure to "disconnect the battery", and a master safety switch is much quicker and more convenient than disconnecting a battery cable.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by jawa » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:36 am

My father was having a hard time using the starter button so I removed it and put a selenoid in with a small button on the dash for him to use. What I did was remove the starter button from the frame bracket. Bend the bracket down 90 degrees and mount the selenoid there. Now that leaves a perfect hole in the floor where the starter button was to put the cutoff switch. Being the wires were already there from the battery, I just had to make a short lead from the cutoff to the selenoid and I could use the other 2 existing wires. Now before he gets in, he reaches over turns on the cutoff, gets in and just needs to push the liitle button on the dash.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Rich Eagle » Sat Jan 09, 2021 12:07 pm

I settled for a small switch on the dash for the hot wire to the terminal block. It's just on one car and I haven't seen the need for it. My reason for it was after many cutout failures in a Model A in the '70s. With better cutouts and diodes and careful attention to routing the wiring I'm not sure it is necessary.
I'm sure others have had different experiences.
Rich
When did I do that?

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by RajoRacer » Sat Jan 09, 2021 12:47 pm

Good suggestion & remedy Adam - I did the same on my Grandpa's TT.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by DickC » Sat Jan 09, 2021 3:04 pm

If you have never had the need to eliminate current, you may not appreciate a cutoff switch. We were on tour and my son was driving one of my T"s, I think a 24 that I had at the time. We were all stopped for some reason and he noticed a smell but thought it was from something in the air. Then he noticed smoke from under the dash. He pushed his wife out of the car, literally, and opened the rear door to get to the battery. He and his wife had loaded the rear seat and floor area with chairs and a cooler and other things. They quickly got unloaded on the street and he was able to get to the starter and realized the cables were tight,(like they should be) and found something to pry the cable loose. Since then, we always have a quick disconnect on the battery. I recently bought this 25 and will have a disconnect!!! The suggestion to put it on the floor was my first thought. Then I realized that the removable floor board went all the way to the seat riser instead of having a portion of the floor fixed like my 12. I then looked at the seat riser and found that there was not enough room because of the gas tank. I may be able to use a knife type cutoff and run a flexible cable from the seat riser under the gas tank to the cutoff. I'll keep looking. Thanks for all the suggestions. Dick C.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by bnchief » Sat Jan 09, 2021 4:49 pm

Dick i had the exact same issue over forty years ago i was outside mowing my little boy came and said daddy your car is smoking, i have a cut off on all the older vehicles i have just for the very reason you described.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Allan » Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:46 pm

Neither I, or my trained auto elec. son, are in favour of adding another point of possible failure into the T electrical system, paricularly something like that exposed blade type cut out. That said, I had a nasty surprise with smoke escaping from my 24 tourer electrical system. In the haste to get at the battery terminals I had to get the rear floorboards out and then I came across the restored original battery box cover I had fitted. A different wrench was grabbed, the two hold down clips removed , the cover extracted and a battery treminal finally removed. It seemed to take a lifetime!. The result is a keyed isolating switch next to the foot starter switch. When the key is removed, nothing is seen. The key has to be inserted and the switch activated to be able to drive off.
The battery box cover, complete with its separate lift off access plate to get at the cells, now hangs on the workshop wall, which is where I think most ended up in the early days.

AllAn from down under.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by critterpainter » Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:58 pm

Another reason I like my 14.
14 Touring

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by thom » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:20 pm

Try to find a place where it is hidden. They look terrible on the dash or firewall.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by thom » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:22 pm

Try to find a place where it is hidden. They look terrible on the dash or firewall. It's a shame to go drilling holes in an almost 100 year old car for one.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by bnchief » Sun Jan 10, 2021 8:38 am

Alan that is a good idea

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by TWrenn » Sun Jan 10, 2021 9:14 am

critterpainter wrote:
Sat Jan 09, 2021 10:58 pm
Another reason I like my 14.
:lol: I agree! Same with me and my '13.
With my A.D.D. I didn't read all the posts, some of which seemed lengthy. I did see a few that talk about the cutoff switch "way up" by the foot switch, the firewall, etc. That's all well and good, but to be honest, a good share of the possibility of electrical issues rests right near where the cable exits the battery, rests on one or even two "supports", a few of which I have seen have worn through the cable insulation! So if your switch is downstream, where's your protection? Not where it's really needed. If you really want the protection you need, you really only have two choices....put the cutoff right at the battery terminal, or like Jeff Humble says, "1/2" open end wrench". On my Fordor, if it's gonna be kept idle for a while, I do just that. I unhook the battery cable. I know, an electrical fire could start just as easily overnight as it could over a week long period or more. Just makes me feel better.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Mark Wing - NM » Sun Jan 10, 2021 9:40 am

Hello Dick,

I too have a 1925 model year (Nov. 1924 casting date) coupe and I cut off power by running the ground cable from the battery to a switch located in the storage compartment under the driver's side seat. The return cable from the switch is grounding to the frame in the original location. I've found it very easy to lift the driver's side seat cushion and turn the switch on and off as needed. In addition to being very convenient to reach, it's also not visible to a casual observer.

Good luck with your project,
Mark Wing
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by DanTreace » Sun Jan 10, 2021 10:06 am

Appreciate those who want to improve safety of electric system on a T.

One thing about a battery cut-off switch is that safety is lost once the switch is ON.

For me, the better way, instead of adding a switch on heavy battery current, is to add a FUSE to the wiring system, locate the fuse close to the footswitch on the Battery Yellow wire going to the terminal block. The fuse will protect against smoking wires that cause fires, and will be there when your T is parked in the garage, or as you drive along.

When working on my T's, rather easy to use a screwdriver and just remove that Battery Yellow wire from its terminal. That blocks all current to the wiring.


Fuse on Yellow wire at switch.jpg
IMG_3795 (700x525) copy.jpg

Had one experience of smoke rising from behind the dash panel driving down the road, that is a scary smell and sight! :shock:

No fuse then, fuses on all my T's now ;)
Last edited by DanTreace on Mon Jan 11, 2021 9:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by jiminbartow » Sun Jan 10, 2021 11:54 am

You kinda want it to be hidden in a place, such as the trunk, that only you can access with a key, or it defeats the purpose. Anyone, with bad intentions, that is familiar with a T, can find the cut off, whether under the hood, the floorboards or the seat, if it is located in the usual places, so don’t make it too easy for him. Jim Patrick

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by TRDxB2 » Sun Jan 10, 2021 1:29 pm

Dick C., A cut-off switch is a solution to a problem, so I need to ask: - why do you want to install a battery cut-off switch? If you want to deter theft there are simpler solutions (as Rich Eagle pointed out) that are more hidden and readily accessible. If you want to disconnect the battery entirely from the electrical system then there could be several reasons: unknown battery drain or frequent work on the electrical system or some other reason.
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Fordwright » Sun Jan 10, 2021 1:33 pm

I'd put it near the driver's seat in an obscure location because I'd be sure to forget to turn it on most of the time.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by DickC » Mon Jan 11, 2021 8:11 am

To TYRDXB2--Frank, Your assumption that I know something is wrong with the electrical system and I want to avoid fixing it is off base. Apparently you don't subscribe to the old adage, "S---t HAPPENS". I am trying to avoid a potential problem. I think anyone who installs an electrical cutoff switch or a fuel cutoff switch has that in mind.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by TRDxB2 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:41 am

DickC wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 8:11 am
To TYRDXB2--Frank, Your assumption that I know something is wrong with the electrical system and I want to avoid fixing it is off base. Apparently you don't subscribe to the old adage, "S---t HAPPENS". I am trying to avoid a potential problem. I think anyone who installs an electrical cutoff switch or a fuel cutoff switch has that in mind.
Sorry if you misunderstood my intention of asking. As I explained there are several reasons why someone would want to install one. I was just trying to understand what your reason is. I should have added another reason - "S---t HAPPENS".
The past is a great place and I don't want to erase it or to regret it, but I don't want to be its prisoner either.
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by jsaylor » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:54 am

In answer to Dick's original question. On the frame rail near the battery. Connected to the ground terminal.
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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by jiminbartow » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:14 pm

Since you have a coupe, the best place would be in the locking trunk, but since I too, have a coupe, I can understand how difficult it is to clear things out of the way and reach way in to the front of the trunk to access the battery mounted cutoff. Would it, therefore, be feasible to lengthen the positive (+) battery cable several feet and route it through the trunk so that it runs across the trunk close to the trunk opening with the cutoff switch mounted on the cable, just inside the trunk opening so that when you open the trunk, you don’t have to clear out the trunk or reach way in to the front of the trunk to access the cutoff? That way you have all of the security, with none of the inconvenience. Jim Patrick


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Bill Coyle » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:31 pm

Hi, mine is mounted so I can reach it from the driver seat. It is hidden under the floor mat, so not obvious to the casual observer.
20210111_142307.jpg
I used an old starter switch plate and it shares a mounting bolt with the working starter switch. Bill
20210111_141229.jpg
20210111_142921.jpg


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by DickC » Mon Jan 11, 2021 7:57 pm

Bill Coyle--I have the same idea. I am looking at a cutoff switch that has a higher rise to the switch. I think I can then make a smaller hole in the floor board and have it look like another starter switch. I have a switch like you have pictured but the other switch would rise to the level of the floor. The only reservation is whether the switch is durable enough. The one you show is certainly heavy enough. I'm looking to buy the other to see if it will work. Thanks everyone for your interest, Dick C.


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by Bill Coyle » Mon Jan 11, 2021 8:24 pm

Dick,
I've been using mine for 3 years now. I shut it off in the garage, or whenever I stop for a while like where there's litte kids, at a store or camping. The two smaller posts will interrupt the wire between the switch and the coil box so if it gets shut off while running on the mag it will stop the engine and not harm the generator. Also with the switch off it won't start on mag either... again.. curious litte kids 🙂
Bill Coyle


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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by bnchief » Tue Jan 12, 2021 9:03 am

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/uis- ... MI6uDI0syR
One person here suggested a keyed cut off there are several options.

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Re: looking for suggestions on location of battery cut off switch

Post by TWrenn » Tue Jan 12, 2021 9:59 am

jsaylor wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:54 am
In answer to Dick's original question. On the frame rail near the battery. Connected to the ground terminal.
John Saylor's post and pic explains just what I said in my earlier post. THIS is where the protection really starts...right at the source.
Maybe I'm being too picky, but after seeing two cars with batt. cables rubbed almost to the bare wire between the Positive terminal and the switch made me cringe.

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