MTFCA Forum

One of my new spokes has a crack in it pictured. When is a spoke too crack too cracked to use? I've ordered a new one. $12 per spoke x 12 = $144 per wheel, wow.

Are you worth more than $12 to your family? The general price range for a wooden caskets is $1,000 to $3,550.
I have sold many used spokes on eBay to people who turn t hem down and make pens out of them $3 -$5 each + shipping. They usually want a box full and shipped cheaply

Shouldn't have passed quality control when it was made.

Whoever is selling that spoke is not checking their work or doesn't care about the kind of product they sell! Is that Oak?
Contact Dave Seiler here @ 714-501-7080 or at wheelguy221@yahoo.com

Doesn't look like that one would even make a good Pen.. Where did you buy it from Please

Since nobody has actually said it directly, I will, do not use that cracked spoke. That being said, I agree with the previous responses.

At the risk of too much redundancy, I agree with Jeff. Get RID of it. And BITCH like heck to the supplier. Shame on them.
That didn't just happen during transit.

The split alone is grounds for the bin.
From the end grain, it does look like oak.
Oak is not a good material for spokes.
As an Englishman, I have to say that the properties of American shagbark hickory make it way better for spokes than anything that grows over here.

Ignacio,

I'd suggest giving the vendor a call after emailing the photo you posted so they can see the issue. Any good supplier should send you a replacement free of charge to make it right. If the vendor should balk I would indicated to them that your next post will include their company name on this forum. When you show respect to them, they have the opportunity to show you the same respect. If they don't show respect they don't deserve the same.

Just one ole man's opinion!!!
Dom

The spoke is bad, Period
I agree with Dom.
Give the vender a chance, but like I say to sellers. "Treat me right and I will sing your praises. Treat me wrong and I will hire a march band and drum you into the ground.

I don’t want to be a boo bird, but I would be real skeptical of ALL the spokes purchased at the same time! I’d ask the supplier to replace them all and also give you a moisture reading using a pin type moisture meter (I.e.— turned at 7-9% moisture)

The quick answer is the spoke you show was probably machined either ‘green’ or wet. Now that it has dried to your area moisture it shrinks, forms a stress line off center and cracks. The as made environment on the one is the same as the others made at the same time.

Be weary...be safe!

As others have pointed out, would be nice to know what wood species was used.

Don't throw it away. That spoke is good for the fireplace! I would not use it on my car and I agree Shag bark Hickory is the best for spokes. It is what baseball bats are made from.
Norm

So, exactly how long does it take wood to crack? After building a clock in 1975, and having moved to Wyoming in 2014, one of the wood panels in the clock split last year, 45 years after building it. I can tell you how long it took to crack: about 1/10 of a second.

I am not saying it did, or didn't, but it is absolutely possible that it split in transit. It could have split in the mailbox. It could have split in the post office, or it could have been sent that way. Who knows? Replace them ALL? With WHAT? Twelve more out of the same bin? And those will somehow be more reliable than the other 11 already in hand? How many auto parts suppliers have a moisture meter, know what % moisture should be in the wood, and then conduct training classes for the packers to use said equipment prior to shipment?

It's wood. It split. Get a free replacement. Move on.

FWIW, with the exception of the crack, the grain looks like every hickory spoke I've ever bought.

Comparing the split spoke with this known hickory tenon, I suspect you may have oak or something else other than hickory, but for me it's not a slam dunk. I would ask the supplier what wood your spokes are. If they are not hickory I would return them all for a refund. If they are hickory I would get a replacement for the split spoke and move on. If you do need to return them, the upside is that hickory spokes from Lang's cost 50¢ less.

Very few hickory, more maple and ash bats today. Although when the ash borer gets done who knows. From the Louisville slugger page:
https://www.sluggermuseum.com/about-us/ ... s%20growth.
What type of wood is used to make Louisville Slugger baseball bats?
Approximately half of pro bats are made from northern white ash and the other half from maple. The best timber comes from parts of Pennsylvania, New York and other northeastern states where the terrain and climate are most favorable to its growth.

In the past, hickory was also a popular wood for bats, but it is too heavy to meet the demands of today's players.

How many Louisville Slugger bats are made each year?
Approximately 1.8 million, of all sizes. About 3,000 full sized bats are made per day at the factory in Louisville. During our peak production time around Spring Training, the factory makes about 5,000 bats per day.

We see this all the time with spoked wheels. We’ve seen guys want to turn spokes themselves from some heirloom tree. We see guys buy spokes, make a press, assemble a wheel and then try to figure out why it doesn’t revolve true.
For the cost of those spokes, and ONLY a couple bucks more, you can get a wheel done by a pro who does it every single day, so just can’t get my head wrapped around this.
With an old car, there isn’t any part much more important than good wheels.

That spoke would most likely never give you any trouble. That being said, it looks terrible and I wouldn't want it in my car. Yes, get it replaced. While you should ask about what species of wood is being supplied to you, I can't see anything in your photos that tells me your spoke isn't hickory. It's just not a good enough photo to determine that, (which I understand, you weren't asking about anyway).

If you want to be super fussy, for the strongest spoke, I would prefer that the grain pattern be rotated 90 degrees from its current condition. I believe that Stutzman does them that way as well.

Steve the only thing I think anyone could discern from your photo is that it was cut from old-growth wood with super small growth rings. Old hickory is much different than new hickory. I'll bet that if you counted growth rings on your spoke, you'd be over 40 years in that one small piece and it may well have come from a tree that was 250 years old. Hickory reaches financial maturity around 60 years and the wood it produces for commercial use now, is vastly different than that which was yielded in 1920.

I am guessing that the new spokes are from much younger trees, grown in an entirely different soil and moisture content (aiding rapid growth, thus wide growth rings) and are harvested around 60-70 years. Every new spoke I've seen from Lang's (quite a few) look exactly like the OP's (minus the crack, of course), and I trust Lang's to sell the real McCoy.

There was quite a bit of science involved in the selection of this wood for wheels years ago. I wonder if the modern counterpart would hold up to the exact same scrutiny. I'd bet it's yield strength is way down from "the good old days".

Noah Stutzman told me a while back he was no longer selling loose spokes. Way too many times people would buy the wrong spokes, half ass assemble a wheel, wondered why they didn’t fit well or didn’t run true. After that, Stutzmans would have to wear the Straw Hat for the problem. Just wasn’t worth it. Just way too many variables out there. I sound like a broken record when I say “penny wise and pound foolish”. I also like to say, someone’s already invented the wheel.

The story is that I didn't get to the project until recently. The spokes were bought new 2 years ago then stored. This is only 1 out of 24 that was cracked. All the others are fine. Vendor is replacing it no problem. Apparently they should not be stored that long without a coating of some kind.

"...and that", as Paul Harvey used to say "is the rest of the story"

Here is 11, sanded and stained, ready to clear coat. The twelfth is in the mail.

...I trust Lang's to sell the real McCoy.

Yes. Since Stutzman spokes were no longer available I bought my last ones from Langs. They were the genuine article.

I don't know about the tree that was used to make the spoke in my photos, but the spoke is one that was broken in a wreck and is about ten years old.

It actually is not “cracked”, it is “checked” (from drying as pointed out). This will not measurably affect the strength, but I completely agree, it should not have been sent out.

$11.50/spoke x 12 per wheel = $138/wheel x 4 = $552 per car. They look great and will last a long time but that's a spicy meatball on spokes. I tell my non-model T diseased friends and acquaintances on how it is very easy to spend $400+ on a model T wheel.

If any one has cut as much wood as I have you can see in the picture that some of them are hickory from the color and grain, The crack can come from any piece of wood that is not sealed at an end. Years ago I took a hickory down just for the making of spokes, I did not paint the end while it was drying out and all the wood cracked so they all went into my outside wood burner!

Ned

they were 2 years old. I doubt that it was sent that way.

ivaldes1 wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:11 pm

Here is 11, sanded and stained, ready to clear coat. The twelfth is in the mail.

Looking great Ignacio!

You probably already know this, but when you press in the hubs, be sure to align the 6 bolt holes in the hubs with the seams between the spokes. In other words, when you drill the bolt holes, half of the hole should be in one spoke, while the other half is in the adjoining spoke. Also, don't drill the holes any larger than they have to be. Ideally, you should have to lightly pound the bolts in.