Howell's Sheet Metal problem

[ElGranadaT]

Greetings all.

I'm new to the group and this is my first post. I retired last March and I'm now restoring a 22 T Touring. (Loving it!) I am hoping one of you might know if Howell's Sheet metal is still in business? I order about $2500.00 worth of parts from them on January 5th 2021. They told me the parts were all in stock and that I would get them in 3-4 weeks. I charged it all on my credit card and they collected the funds through my bank. That was the last I heard from them. Its been 3 months now with no parts or contact. I've tried emailing and calling them dozens of times, but no reply. Their website is still up, but it will not process any new messages to them.

I sincerely appreciate all the hardships going on in Texas these days, with power, water and most of all Covid. I hope that they are doing well, but I would like to know... Does anyone know if they are still in business? Are you having problems getting in contact with them also?

Thanks!

Marty -

[ThreePedalTapDancer]

They are notoriously slow. Plenty of reviews on all the forums regarding them taking forever to deliver parts as promised. That being said, I have ordered parts from them in the past and was satisfied once I received them. One time they took several months. It’s a poor way of doing business, but they are the only game in town for a lot of items, and they know it.

[TonyB]

Martin, I realize it’s too late now but it’s best to buy parts from them through eBay. If they delay the eBay order then you can get eBay to put pressure on them for timely delivery.
You might contact your credit card company to see if they can exert some gentle pressure.

[John kuehn]

Try calling them around 7-8 am in the morning. When I bought parts from them that was the best time it seemed to call them. But as others have said they can be notorious to contact and sometimes deal with. In some ways it’s ironic that they make most of the T sheet metal parts and they probably know it.

[ModelTWoods]

Marty, I live in Texas, and used to live only 90 miies from them. Since moving further in the opposite direction from them, I'm now, 250 miles away, so I'm not much help. I do know the Chickasha OK. swap meet is just around the corner and they usually are there. Maybe someone from California who plans to go to Chickasha, could look them up (they usually have a big display that's hard to miss) and make an inquiry of them as to the status of your order; there's nothing like person to person; face to face contact to put pressure on a vendor. Otherwise, do as suggested and call them early in the morning. The last time that i picked up parts from them at their shop, I was at their door before they got to the shop.

[TRDxB2]

There was a discussion about them not long ago. There was an indication that they responded more quickly to eBay orders.

This is a link to there on-line web site https://www.fordor.com/
and this is the link to their eBay Store https://www.ebay.com/str/09-40-Ford-She ... 7675.l2563

[ElGranadaT]

Martin, I realize it’s too late now but it’s best to buy parts from them through eBay. If they delay the eBay order then you can get eBay to put pressure on them for timely delivery.
You might contact your credit card company to see if they can exert some gentle pressure.

THANKS - Didn't know they sold thru ebay.

[ElGranadaT]

Marty, I live in Texas, and used to live only 90 miies from them. Since moving further in the opposite direction from them, I'm now, 250 miles away, so I'm not much help. I do know the Chickasha OK. swap meet is just around the corner and they usually are there. Maybe someone from California who plans to go to Chickasha, could look them up (they usually have a big display that's hard to miss) and make an inquiry of them as to the status of your order; there's nothing like person to person; face to face contact to put pressure on a vendor. Otherwise, do as suggested and call them early in the morning. The last time that i picked up parts from them at their shop, I was at their door before they got to the shop.

Thanks for the tip ! We're heading to Arkansas to see the granddaughter in April, now that We've gotten the vaccine- We may drop over there on the way. It sounds like nothing too serious has happened to them... just business as usual.

[John kuehn]

Was Howells sheet metal at Chickasha last year or before? Maybe I misread a post but it seemed like they didn’t show up or so I read.

[MWalker]

They missed last year, but have been there most years.

[modeltspaz]

I recall reading a post here on the forum, that stated that the person that wrote the post had personally visited Howell's Sheet Metal and was given a tour of the facility.

The poster made it clear that all the while he was touring the shop, the telephone was constantly ringing. When the person that wrote the post commented to the owner that the phone had been ringing all the while he was there, the owner replied something to the effect of, oh, we never answer the phone here.

Honestly, how can someone treat their customers by not answering telephones or not replying to emails and sleep at night. I know that they're apparently the only game in town when it comes to brand new sheet metal for a T, but really?

[ElGranadaT]

Thank you to all for the great responses. It was good to hear the stories. I am looking forward to learning more through this club. Thanks especially to the person who suggested calling before 7:00 - I Finally got through- They did have pipes break and they were closed for 2 weeks. They identified it as an error in their shipping- and I was told the parts will ship today. I think they are doing their best considering the days we are living in.

Thanks again and best regards

Marty

[Mark Gregush]

Like Fordwood, they do things in batches not one item at a time. When enough orders come in they make a run to be able to cover setup and labor cost. Several of the T parts suppliers list body stampings. I don't know if they have them in stock or are drop shipped from manufacture.

[RustyFords]

I recall reading a post here on the forum, that stated that the person that wrote the post had personally visited Howell's Sheet Metal and was given a tour of the facility.

The poster made it clear that all the while he was touring the shop, the telephone was constantly ringing. When the person that wrote the post commented to the owner that the phone had been ringing all the while he was there, the owner replied something to the effect of, oh, we never answer the phone here.

Honestly, how can someone treat their customers by not answering telephones or not replying to emails and sleep at night. I know that they're apparently the only game in town when it comes to brand new sheet metal for a T, but really?

That was me. I bought the nearly perfect 26/27 turtle deck that they used as a pattern to make their replacement panels. They didn't need it anymore and put it up for sale on the old FordBarn site. This was sometime around 1997 ish if I remember right.

Old man Howell was just as nice as he could be....but he did say that about the phone.

[Chris Haynes]

Howell's makes ill fitting, incorrectly made parts. They have NO CUSTOMER SERVICE. Once they have your money they won't respond to you.

[ModelTWoods]

What Dan Allen and Mark Gregush said about Howell's is true. I, too, was given a tour and it is true that they schedule production to match a certain number of orders for a particular item; not one or two at a time. It is also true that, at least when I was there, they didn't have a secretary, "girl Friday", or even an answering machine and since it is a small shop, usually staffed by anywhere for 3 to 4 men, they don't have time to drop what they're doing every time the phone rings. That's why the best time to catch them is first thing in the morning, before they get production, going.

[John kuehn]

As far as T sheet metal goes the pieces I bought from them worked pretty well for me. I learned years ago that all T sheet metal fenders, body panels, and etc aren’t made exactly the same. Ford used different body builders over the years and there are some small differences in them. I had to do a few tweaks here and there on the sheet metal panels but after it was done they worked well.

[ElGranadaT]

Well... I was misled... Although I was told twice (once in January and again in early March) that parts were in stock and would ship 'that day'- I never got the parts.

[Dan B]

Howell's makes ill fitting, incorrectly made parts. They have NO CUSTOMER SERVICE. Once they have your money they won't respond to you.

Say this too loud and you’ll be promptly reminded you should just be thankful someone’s making “the parts” and willing to take your money.

Good luck to the original poster. I hope you’re happy with what you receive if you eventually get it.

[Chris Haynes]

Howell's makes ill fitting, incorrectly made parts. They have NO CUSTOMER SERVICE. Once they have your money they won't respond to you.

Say this too loud and you’ll be promptly reminded you should just be thankful someone’s making “the parts” and willing to take your money.

Good luck to the original poster. I hope you’re happy with what you receive if you eventually get it.

I am not thankful for paying good money for a part that can't be used then ignored by the vendor when I complained.

[Michael Peternell]

Just a thought. The small shop could answer the phone and have a great chat with each and every customer.
That shouldn't take much time as model T guys don't really like talking about their car much. All 10 of those guys will talk about the great customer service! Or..... don't answer the phone, bust your ass, and do your best to get parts to the 40 guys waiting. Might be later than the
the 40 guys wanted but 40 customers got their parts in the same amount of time as 10. I've never had anything to do with the company but
unless someone is going to show them how to do this right I would ease up. Or... you could call the other place making these parts and get back to us on how long it took for them to answer the phone. Just a thought.

[Retro54]

Howell's makes ill fitting, incorrectly made parts. They have NO CUSTOMER SERVICE. Once they have your money they won't respond to you.

Say this too loud and you’ll be promptly reminded you should just be thankful someone’s making “the parts” and willing to take your money.

Good luck to the original poster. I hope you’re happy with what you receive if you eventually get it.

I am not thankful for paying good money for a part that can't be used then ignored by the vendor when I complained.

Pretty sure that was Dan's point. There is room in the market for new vendors... that is for sure.

[Allan]

There is a parallel here. For so long tyre dealers have provided junk beaded edge tyres. Now Blockley's have taken up the challenge and have produced quality tyres and really nice thick metal stemmed tubes to boot. We no longer have to be thankful that somebody is at least providing tyres, even if they are crap.

Allan from down under.

[John kuehn]

This has been kicked around more than a few times before. Maybe there will be somebody that take on the challenge of making sheet metal parts. It would be nice if there were other vendors to pick from but I don’t see it happening anytime soon. Until then? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[George Mills]

I’m amazed that this Howell thing gets leg’s every time it happens. There are naysayers, there are ‘oh well’, and there are the ‘they need to up their game’. Nothing wrong with expressing thoughts and opinion…but…pssst...wanna know a secret that really isn't a secret at all?

Howells doesn’t care…simple as that and THAT IS a part of their own deliberate business model! They simply do the best that they can do at banging out sheet metal, to their own timeline, and at the same time providing what to me has always been very high-quality work that at times can even be used 'as received'!

Does some of it need further subsequent hammer and dolly work? Absolutely...the same problem existed at Ford and Ford body suppliers. Will their left match your right? Not necessarily but it will match their right…so you can dolly it in, or have a body shop dolly it in, or, hey…buy a pair in the first place!

My own experience over now decades is…allow 6 months…you’ll eventually get it within that time frame. If you need it sooner have a bff that has a shear, English wheel, and a beading machine along with knowing how to use it. (Even in my early years, I’d spend nights at the late Dick Petty of Elgin shop using his gear to roll and pound out stuff that was close enough, and if I wanted better quality a box of donuts and bring over a bag of fresh ground coffee and Dick would actually show me his Stynoski skills in action! The man could make doors out of nothing and you couldn't tell the difference to a factory product. But he showed me how he left a secret mark to show it was 'repro' )

I am convinced that the normal Howells way is as follows. Someone orders a panel…none in stock. Howells waits for someone else to want one and then will make 3. Buyer #3 hits a home run and it arrives within a week after his order! Buyer #4 when he surfaces is now in the queue waiting for buyer #5 to come along, and so forth. Is that anyway to run a company? Howells thinks it is and, well, I don’t believe it is arrogance it is ‘their way’ and quite frankly the only game in town (Unless you have a best friend forever who has the gear and are willing to try)

I chuckle as I once was doing a job for someone and they decided they wanted sheet metal chunks replaced, and not bondo or lead infill. I explained to them how Howells works and it could take 6 months before I’d have the body work done. They gulped hard and said ‘OK’. I ordered the tin the next day…less than 10 days later the UPS guy was lugging boxes up the driveway to the shop. 100% complete order fulfillment! I just took it that like in my made up example…I was lucky customer #3!