Speedster intake manifold
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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- First Name: Kevin
- Last Name: Pharis
- Location: Sacramento CA
Speedster intake manifold
It’s time for me to consider the intake manifold for my Akron-Hed project... I’ve considered almost every currently available manifold as a donor to be cut up and modified, and nothing seems to align with the look that I want.
I am going to run 2 of my new Winfield S-B downdrafts... and want to run a plenum style intake manifold. I really like the shape and look of the Winfield manifolds for the Model A’s... but would be a ton of work to narrow to fit the Akron-Hed, change the mounting flanges, cap the single carb flange, and add 2 B inlet flanges. So I began to design what I want. I considered machining it in pieces and welding together, but have had issues with broken welds on aluminum manifolds before. Time to consider casting. I found a relatively local foundry that will 3D print sand instead of building a pattern for a one off part.
I know there are only a few of these Akron-Hed’s out there... but if you are interested in one of these intake manifolds... now is your chance. These may fit other make overheads, but I make no claim as to fitment. Manifold will have 1.500” diameter runners, 9.438” centerline between ports, 2.750” bolt spacing on port flanges, and Winfield S-B carb flanges 5.000” apart. Minor changes to the design could also be made to accommodate other head configurations...
I am going to run 2 of my new Winfield S-B downdrafts... and want to run a plenum style intake manifold. I really like the shape and look of the Winfield manifolds for the Model A’s... but would be a ton of work to narrow to fit the Akron-Hed, change the mounting flanges, cap the single carb flange, and add 2 B inlet flanges. So I began to design what I want. I considered machining it in pieces and welding together, but have had issues with broken welds on aluminum manifolds before. Time to consider casting. I found a relatively local foundry that will 3D print sand instead of building a pattern for a one off part.
I know there are only a few of these Akron-Hed’s out there... but if you are interested in one of these intake manifolds... now is your chance. These may fit other make overheads, but I make no claim as to fitment. Manifold will have 1.500” diameter runners, 9.438” centerline between ports, 2.750” bolt spacing on port flanges, and Winfield S-B carb flanges 5.000” apart. Minor changes to the design could also be made to accommodate other head configurations...
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
A little sand... a bit of strategically placed glue... and taaaa daaaaa! An intake manifold! Some machine work required...
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Well, how cool is that?
Scott Conger
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
Tyranny under the guise of law is still Tyranny
NH Full Flow Float Valves
Obsolete carburetor parts manufactured
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
VERY IMPRESSIVE!
I’ve done some casting where I 3d print the object in PLA and then “investment cast” using the traditional materials and then burn out and fuse the ceramic and then pour the metal and then break the ceramic. Both ways work.
All the best!
I’ve done some casting where I 3d print the object in PLA and then “investment cast” using the traditional materials and then burn out and fuse the ceramic and then pour the metal and then break the ceramic. Both ways work.
All the best!
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Just thinking that we need to get the 2 up 2 down crank and cam to you!
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Just what the heck can't you make, Kevin ?????
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
with just a quick measurement , looks like it would fit a BB Rajo .
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
The port spacing is the same as the flat head, and I hear most overheads are the same too. I will have an extra manifold laying around... that is unless I botch the machine work
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
I know where there is a Rajo to experiment on. Can it be turned upside down?
Andy
Andy
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
So lets remove the guessing:
4 valve Rajo- port centers are 9.437. Flange Bolts are 2.687 port diameter is 1.25"
B Rajo- port centers are 9.375. Flange Bolts are 2.937 (original head- not Chaffins)
4 valve Rajo- port centers are 9.437. Flange Bolts are 2.687 port diameter is 1.25"
B Rajo- port centers are 9.375. Flange Bolts are 2.937 (original head- not Chaffins)
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Quick measurements of a Chaffin Rajo. Intake ports 9.470 center to center. Flange bolt width 2.75 and 1.250 ports.
Those would be in inches.
Andy
Those would be in inches.
Andy
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
YEAH BABY!!!
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Beauty! A symphony of polished castings!!
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
I don’t intend to mislead anybody... but the only castings in this pic is the iron cylinder head and the intake manifold. None of which are polished... yet!. All the rest is machined from solid bar. Details here for those who haven’t seen my carburetor or Akron-Hed posts;
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=14905&p=177960&hilit=Playin#p177960
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11172&p=84063&hilit=Akron#p84063
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Isn’t the float bowl supposed to be forward, or is that just a legend and they don’t care.
Andy
Andy
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
I dug into the bowl design while pondering the manifold, and found that the fuel would need to slosh at almost 45 degrees to flood out either of the spray bar circuits. That means a 1G change of direction. Arguably the greatest forces applied to a vehicle’s direction are during braking, turning being the second greatest force potential, and acceleration the least. With the bowl facing forward, the fuel would slosh into the bowl during braking, and cause the needle to seal tightly, and have virtually no chance of flooding out the motor. So yes, typically the Winfield’s are mounted with the bowls facing forward.
I figure that the carbs are resilient enough to handle a T speedster in almost any orientation... as long as the bowls are not facing the rear as this would be the most likely to flood during braking. These carbs were raced on high bank circle tracks and dirt roads for a generation, I have a feelin they’ll perform just fine turned sideways
And if they don’t... I guess I’ll have to cut up my new manifold and spread the carbs out a bit further
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
1938 Riley over head V-8, 4 Winfield carbs all facing the “wrong” way. This photo is from Speedy Bill’s museum, so it probably never ran this way. But Kevin’s flooding theory sounds about right.
Are the manifolds available from Non-Pharis Metals, a subsidiary of Pharis Metals?
Andy
Are the manifolds available from Non-Pharis Metals, a subsidiary of Pharis Metals?
Andy
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Forgot the picture.
Andy
Andy
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Hmmmmm... Non Pharis Metals... Has a ring to it, but I can barely account for myself as it is...
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Look y’all... no clamps!
Gonna look real nice all polished up!
Gonna look real nice all polished up!
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Came across this backwards Winfield pic from Speedy Bills Museum today and thought bout you Andy...
Turns out the new manifold does look nice all polished up...
Turns out the new manifold does look nice all polished up...
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
So...…. regarding float bowl orientation, I thought I would browse thru my Winfield Carburetor manual for any bowl orientation information. The manual covers installing carbs on pretty much every automobile made from 1925-1931. I found two instances where the float bowl was to be installed to the rear- 1) Model T Fords and 2) '24-'27 Oldsmobile. All others clearly stated the float bowl was to be installed to the front. So, draw your own conclusions from that.
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
They probably looked at two things with the T application. One-they needed to clear the generator. Two-they probably drove a Model T and figured it wouldn’t brake hard enough to slosh any fuel.
Andy
Andy
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Truly awesome as usual. You make the best stuff.
"The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it." -George Orwell
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
You clearly read better than I do Dan, I looked thru my catalog for some time a while back and couldn’t find anything regarding bowl orientation. One would think that if the bowl HAD to be facing front, there would be a warning on every page...?! Thanks for the info Dan, I’m dedicated now anyway... but it’s reassuring
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Manifold and carbs look great. Eastwood makes a chrome powder coating for the head.
Andy
Andy
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
After all the time, money, and effort... seems like money green would be the right color to paint the head
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Just noticed that the model A water pump is installed upside down too...Kevin Pharis wrote: ↑Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:27 pmCame across this backwards Winfield pic from Speedy Bills Museum today and thought bout you Andy...
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Pretty sure you can't turn em over- must be a special pump or? The studs are closer together at the top on a stock head so...……..
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Maybe I’m just trying to convince myself that sideways carbs are goin to be OK...
And this one just posted by Hank Lee in the classifieds. Maybe he can give us some insight as to how the carbs ran on this shiny chebby. These carbs are certainly far enough apart to mount with the bowls facing forward
And this one just posted by Hank Lee in the classifieds. Maybe he can give us some insight as to how the carbs ran on this shiny chebby. These carbs are certainly far enough apart to mount with the bowls facing forward
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Probably depends on how fast your engine stand will go!
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Adding to my collection of “wrong” mounted Winfields...
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Kevin I have 2-3 thousand miles on this set up my only issue is that the int. jets have to run a good bit richer than normal otherwise I get a lean pop back on take off and or accelerating around a very sharp turn both left and right when it involves a heavy load ie steep pull. These are pretty small carbs though (AA). Great looking manifold by the way hope to see you on a run soon Scott Hills
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
Thanks for the feed back Scott! Lovin that Roof 16 Model C! My SR-C has a lean cough as well when the motors hot. I could adjust the accelerator pump, but found the pump housing barely hanging by the last screw last summer. Apparently I’m falling behind on maintenance these days...
It might be worth checking that your air bleeds are the correct size. Also check that the intermediate compensator is correct for the AA size (A and AA are interchangeable). There are a few variations of compensators, I would check that both intermediate compensators and air bleed sizes match (regardless of size). Float level also decides the volume in the accelerator well, might wanna check that too...
It might be worth checking that your air bleeds are the correct size. Also check that the intermediate compensator is correct for the AA size (A and AA are interchangeable). There are a few variations of compensators, I would check that both intermediate compensators and air bleed sizes match (regardless of size). Float level also decides the volume in the accelerator well, might wanna check that too...
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
With all the excitement of firing off my new carb for the first time... I completely glazed over the fact that my dad had mounted his carb “backwards” when he put the Fronty in a while ago
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Topic author - Posts: 1361
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Re: Speedster intake manifold
It’s been a while but found another sideways Winfield installation over on the HAMB