MTFCA Forum

Hey All!

LONG time Model T owner here. I grew up with Model T's as my dad bought his first one 4 days after my parents adopted me at 4 months of age (45 now). Long story short, I've had T's for years, but about four years ago I lost my job in Arizona and had to relocate. The relocation meant I had to sell my last Model T (same one my dad bought) and we let it go to a friend of the family who's taking very good care of it!

Fast forward, I have an excelent job, and a house now and a garage. So, this last weekend I bought 'Teddy.'

Teddy was advertized on FaceBook, and is a complete, early low radiator touring (1917). The original engine was changed out sometime in the past, and he acquired a 1918 engine and may have a few other non 1917 parts added through the years (like demountable rims). Teddy has had a bit of a rough time. He was restored probably in the 60's or 70's and was a driver, but, was parked quite a while ago. How long? Long enough for what was left in the tank and sediment bowl to turn to absolute sludge (rust and goo). However, I will saw he's got great potential. No big slop in the front end, newer wood wheels, and upholstery is in pretty good shape. Oh - and good compression!

So I picked up a Penske truck and trailer and made a 700 mile trip to pick him up and give him a good home. I've already had tons of fun pulling the tank and doing a quick test fire of the engine (one coil is bad, one is questionable). Really looking forward to getting back in the saddle! Enjoy the pics! More to come I'm sure!

Cheers!
Ryan
Baltimore MD

(yes I know the Windshield hinges are on backwards - will fix that)

Looking good!

Beautiful!

My windshield hinges are setup the same way. Keeps the upper windshield in front so the drips stay out of the car. Top works fine as well. I am not changing mine.

Dave:

When the windshield hinges are installed correctly, the upper windshield pane will be forward of the lower windshield pane to keep the drips out as you say. So, if you install the hinges correctly, it should be no problem.

Ryan:

Are you sure your car isn't a 1918 and has its original motor? It's hard to tell but it looks like the top has square sockets - that would be 1918.

Look for for a body number and date on the front passenger side floor riser. Depending on the body manufacturer, it is stamped directly in the wood or is stamped on a metal plate nailed to the wood.

If you post more photos, I can make a better determination.

Interesting and rare spare tire carrier. Beautiful touring. I agree with your selection of demountable wheels on that year T. After last week’s Texas T party, I’ll be doing the same on my ‘14

I like the way you have the motometer turned for less wind resistance!

I have a 17 depot hack with the same tire carrier . Its in pretty bad shape .If someone has one and would like to sale it let me know . Great looking car , let the good times roll . wpgoble@hotmail.com

Dave - Pretty sure its a 17. Will double check the body number. I glanced at it and thought it said 17. Engines get changed out pretty often. Casting date on that is 1918. Its definitely pre 1919 - no steel dash, key on coil box, non brass radiator.

The spare tire carrier - I've never seen before. I think its missing a top part that would secure the top of the wheel. As it is, its really wobbly without a support up there.

So, took a few minutes this morning and found out why he wouldn't run for very long, nor run on all four. First problem was a VERY dirty carburetor. That took all of 10 minutes with some acetone to clean out and replace. Second problem was VERY corroded terminals inside the coil box, and on the terminals of the coils. Also cleaned up the coil points as well. After that? Well, the video says it all. Still have some work to do. Sounds like some cross fire / bad gaskets on the manifolds. I already have plug wires to replace the 40/50 year old ones and new non-paper gaskets coming in from Lang's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa0ytz9Y5bE

IF you should decide to replace your tire carrier , I would be interested in buying it . Between yours and mine I could make one good one . Mine has a good top part ,that secures it to the wood firewall . The bottom is rusted out were the tire sets . There are a lot of option for tire carriers on ebay right now . wpgoble@hotmail.com

Hey All!

Short update. Yesterday I pulled the head a noticed carbon all over the pistons and valves. Looked like a chunk on No3 keeping a valve open. Cleared it off and it seals better now. Also drained the remaining coolant from the engine (top radiator hose was rotten / loose). After that I took a break for the day. Fast forward to this morning.

Started it up and got it warm, and switched over to mag. Runs! Runs much better. However, it sounds like I may have a bit of knocking in the engine. It looks like it may still have the original pistons and two-piece valves. I have a new head gasket coming soon, so I'll be tearing the engine down again and will snap pics that time I swear!

This weekend I plan on draining the oil (smells WAY old) and dropping the inspection plate to see if I have any shims left. As it was the cylinder walls are smooth, and she's burning a bit of oil. Might be time for a rebuild, but maybe I can get a year or so of 'fun' out of it before then.

I've cycled the engine up to warm a couple of times and its running much better but its still running on borrowed time!

Also took a few more pics.

Body number looks like it could be:
458 792
468 792

Videos of it running:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vELp13glWts

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swX071M00JI

When I rev it up you can hear a bit of a knock.

I’m very new to the Model T world, but in the videos, the arcing on the #2 coil, and occasionally on #1, doesn’t seem normal to me.

Ryan,
Glad to see you are back in the swing. I used to enjoy reading your posts.
: ^ )
Keith

Hey Keith! Long time no see! Yeah, it's been a while! Glad to be a T owner again. Teddy's a nice little car - a bit neglected but I'll work on that.

mbowen - I've got an order in for some rebuilt coils and will pull the timer to see how gunky it is in there as well.

That is a nice old T, thanks for sharing.

I've been reaquainting myself with Model T's this last week. First of all, while these cars are old and have been through a lot, sometimes they just need the proper care and maintenance to bring out their best. For the first part, I actually got down and cleaned the carburetor as good as I could. Blew out all the passages, cleaned the bowl out and made certain the float and needle were free. Second, I made certain the needle wasn't buggered up from someone tightening it down too much. Also put the proper copper gaskets and steel rings in the manifold (I think I didn't get one on properly and will have to re-do them after my exhaust nut wrench comes in. Then?

I did something I should have done years ago. I bought a set of rebuilt coils and put them in. The following video is after dialing in the carb. Sure runs sweet!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB2sHmMXPtg

Not only that but it will start on mag! Hot-dog!

So since I'm waiting on some more parts to come in before I tackle the cooling system, I pulled the T out and got some degreaser and went over the engine pretty well, then did the hogs head area. Other than a light coating of grease, it pretty much looks the same. Guess it just got dirty / rusty from sitting.

That side-mount carrier is something else! I think I'm missing a top part that holds the tire in place. Still need to get the windshield turned around, and that steering wheel is definitely aftermarket. Anyone familiar with it? Too bad the metal cracked!

A few more

nice looking car should be fun .I see in the video you crank with your left, I have tried to crank with the left but I guess I have been cranking with the right for 45 years I just can not crank with my left. enjoy your new car.

I do crank with my left - for the most part. I've known two people who've ended up breaking their arm / wrist from cranking with their right. However - with both the backfire happened on the downward push (from 3o'clock position to 6'oclock position). The only time I came close to that was on the same position and the backfire jamed my thumb back and I ended up getting a nasty bruise / cut on the end of my thumb cause by the force of the kick.

I've broken a vertibre, my leg, and my ankle (all different times) and don't want to add in my arm. Before those friends got injured I also cranked with my right and the only time I came close to that was on the same position (3-6) and the backfire jamed my thumb back and I ended up getting a nasty bruise / cut on the end of my thumb cause by the force of the kick.

So, yeah. I tend to crank left to right unless I'm 'feeling lucky.'

More progress: Today I was able to install the upper water inlet and 'test' the radiator out as well as flushed it out as well. First time I've had Teddy run for more than a couple of minutes at a time. Total running time was about 20 minutes at fast idle. No problem at all. Did get to a boil - eventually but not overly hot. Then flushed the coolant/flushing solution out. I have a new head gasket ready to go. So, tomorrow I'll pull the side inlet off and replace the old hoses there so it'll have all new cooling parts (sans radiator which looks like its original to the car - or at least a round tube original).

Also fully titled, insured, and licensed and ready for a short test drive tomorrow as well!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjB7EqFWn5k

I see it has the briefly used double button upholstery style used for a while in 1917.
Looking good Ryan.

Double button upholstery!? Huh - hadn't heard of that before.

So today was a good day - took it for a short drive. Plenty of power, but yikes the bands are BAD. Figured as such - but it was enough to get it up to enough speed to say 'ok, she's not half bad.' Plenty of pep, didn't burn a lot of oil. So now - we get to have more fun. Time to replace those bands. Easier with the hogshead off, plus I get to do a bit of inspection.

The bands were pretty well burned out. Hard as rocks and thin. Some scoring on the transmission drums, but it'll do for now until I can get a rebuild going. More to follow by end of weekend!

I hope you enjoy your car as much as I do. I drove my car for 17 years, then let it set for 23 years. I pushed it out of the garage in 2016 and got it started after about 2 hours.
It didn't run very well because the valves were leaking. After grinding them the car ran quite well, but the rods were talking to me.
I rebuilt the engine and transmission and have been enjoying it since 2017. Over 6000 miles since.
Wish I would have got it out after the kids were out of high school in 2001. They had no interest then. Now they do.
There is nothing like taking a 60 mile drive while stopping for a packed lunch in a park, or stopping at an ice cream stand or letting a child sit in the car.
Art Mirtes

Art -

Driving these cars is why I'm here. "Years ago" (1993-2003) I owned a 1916 Model T Touring my father bought me. Great car, but in need of restoration. It had sat in a museum from 1959 until 1993 and had been "Restored" in 1959. By restored I mean painted and reupholstered. Thats it. The engine was really tired and the body wood, this being the South West (Arizona / New Mexico) was dried out. We put a rebuilt short block in, put new bushings in the transmission, clutch disks, the works, and got it back on the road.

In about 2000 or so I took it on its last big jorney. I drove from Tucson Arizona, over Reddington Pass to the other side of the mountains, down the old dirt highway through Reddington Az, down through Benson, to Whetstone Az, Hwy 82 to Sonoita, back up to Corona De Tucson, through Vail Az, and back home. I have three witnesses to this folly, two friends who went with me. As you can see on the map and screenshot from Google, that was abour 176 miles. Half of that unimproved roads, the rest were two lane highways. We left at about 6am, and got in at about 7pm with two stops for gas. That works out to an average speed of 13mph. It was a rough trip on the old T too, but she made it running on coils the entire way (sans magneto - battery only).

Don't think I'll be doing that kind of trip again any time soon. I was young and full of vigour. Today? A bit more cautious.

Teddy will be back on the road this week with new bands, a cleaned up engine bay, and new mounts for the radiator to replace the solid bolts holding it in currently Pics will be forthcoming!

Now - I know being clean and pretty doesn't mean the same as mechanically sound, but I do appreciate an engine being clean so I don't get all kinds of greasy when I'm working on it!

So since I was doing the hogshead and band replacement, I figured I might as well do some cleanup as well.

Pressure wash, and a wire brush were all I used. I painted the engine with Rustoleum High-Heat protective paint. Same paint used on the exterior of new grills. I also took a minute and swapped the windshield around and removed the exterior horn. It may be the original magneto horn. Possibly. Will have to look closer.

Did it turn out perfect? No, but I am happy to say that I was able to get everything back together and it looks much cleaner. Fired up just fine, and took it for about a mile cruise. Its nice having brakes and a clutch that doesn't chatter due to burnt bands. The steering is a little sloppy and it looks like my steering mount (down on the frame) is the culprit. I do see they have new bushings to replace the old, so that will be the next big task. Possibly even new quandrant gears and pins.

I am sorry, but I have to disagree with you on the windshield. If I stood in front of the car and poured water on the upper windshield, would it drop between the upper and lower pane and drip all over your pants. That is what it looks like to me. It appears that the lower windshield bracket is in front of the upper windshield bracket.

The engine looks great.

Yep.
The windshield is put together incorrectly.
Keith

*sigh* - whelp that'll be another project I'll put on the list. Good thing is the windshield isn't overly complicated to take out.

Also have a new set of emergency brake shoes. The 'enthusiastic nuzzling' after cranking it up is cute and all, but not too cute on an incline or if the engine is cold (end up jacking one wheel up to start).

Back to the windshield. I believe its the original glass. It's got those waves you find on old glass. Nice, but yeah, not safe. Another project, replace with safty glass.

I saw in your October 11 post you mention cranking from the 3 o'clock to the 6 o'clock position. Whether you crank with your left or your right hand (I have a non-starter and have always cranked with my right) NEVER push down when hand starting.
FWIW, I use my right hand and crank from 7 to 11 o'clock.

Ryan, do you know the name of the first Model T Dealer in Baltimore?

He also owned a 1909 Touring Model T.

I have a photo of his family in it.

I also have an early Model T ad for his company.

Hint: His last name was Price.

John - you are absolutely correct - I meant to say never crank from 3 to 6. Never heard 7 to 11 - dad always used to say 7 to 9 and you're fine!

Jim - didn't know that - very cool! No relation I'm sure - our family was from Illinois about then. I am actually looking at a picture of my Great Grandfather, Great Grandmother, Grandfather (born 1909) and my Great Aunt on the day they took delivery of our family's first Model T, a 1914 Touring (great Aunt was a babe in arms). Grandpa used to tell lots of stories about driving the Model TT bus his dad owned in the late 20's. When I was about 14 I egged my grandpa on - we were sitting next to my dad's running 21 roadster while my dad stepped inside for just a second. "Come on grandpa, you know how to drive, how about just one drive around the block."

He looked around, "ok."

And he did - one nice quick drive aroudn the block. Backed it out, drove through low, into high, all of it. Dad was frantic when we pulled up. Grandpa shut it off, handed him the keys and just said "runs fine, son." Grandpa was about 81 at the time and hadn't driven a T since he was about 30 or so. Some things you never forget!

In the indominidable words of Buster Scrugs (if you havent seen it - watch it - quite entertaining), "That aint good."

Recently on one of my shakedown trips as I ready Teddy for some good Sunday driving, the magneto quit with a bit of a crunchy sound. Thankfully it was brief, and he's run fine since, albeit on battery. Sadly, the mag has been 100% dead. I did pull off the mag post and found a long thin strip of cloth embedded up there and removed, but still no mag functionality, so fearing the worst I pulled the hogshead today. The pics say it all.

Now I'm in a quandry. The engine (1918 stamped) looks to be unrebuilt to my untrained eye. It has the old two piece valves, and for the most part runs OK, but does have some slight bottom end noise at higher RPMs (even with spark retarded a bit) and at about 35 he developes a bit of a shudder - gotta love those old cast pistons! To fix the mag requires pulling the engine, and if I'm going that far, I should do a rebuild - at least a top end job if not a full rebuild. But if I'm going 1/2 way I should go all the way right?

Aged mag, done to a T; time for the BBQ sauce.

Well, its been a while since I posted anything so its time for a short update.

Since I pulled the engine I shopped around and decided to go with a short-block rebuild and went with Joe Bell in Ohio. Contacted him, loaded up the engine and headed up this last weekend. It was a L O N G trip, but it was actually kind of nice considering its the most I've been out of the house in a while.

He took a quick look and told me I had a 'Sure Mike' crank. Don't know why I didn't notice it before but I do (see attached). It may be a later one. Unknown for sure, but Joe said he'd check on it and report back before doing any work.

So thats about it for now. Definitely explains why the T ran so smooth, even if the counterbalance technology was a bit crude!

DO NOT KEEP THIS CRANK. Sure break crank. They all break.
Heres the deal. They made 3 different styles, the last with the biggest counter weights.(best of them)
Several have been experienced in my area over the last 30+ years. All broke. Even knowing this I tempted fate.
I bought a motor with one in. It was std/std, no wear, like new, large radius. #3 style. Magnafluxed & ring test. Didnt get 100 miles out of it.
No pan alignment issues. Full boat premium rebuilt motor.

I agree with getting rid of that crank. I had an engine with the same crank and it broke between the 3rd and 4th rod. This broke the rear main. Get rid of that Crank. Tom

Enlighten me: So is the sure mike an aftermarket product or??

It was an aftermarket replacement. Counter weighted for a smoother running motor.

It's been a bit since I posted on here. I have posted this in the Facebook page but thought I would share here for those who are not part of the FB online community.

I did get Teddy back on the road. Joe did fantastic work! I did take some pics of the progress as well. Some pics didn't turn out as well and are not included. The transmission was in decent shape and not work (Teddy was LOW mileage), and after cleaning up went back in. I did take the precaution and replaced the transmission spring and adjusted the fingers per spec. Also got the engine put in with minimal effort. I went through the steps and believe it or not, Teddy fired off on the first pull. In fact I wasn't ready as I didn't think it would catch. I primed it with eight full revolutions, set it to BAT and away Teddy went. I let it run a good ten minutes, let it cool down, and then tried again. Same result (with less priming).

The good news, the Mag works fine! There was a bit of resin on the contact I had to clean off, but once done, runs fine (yes I know my wireing is on wrong in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/cMGBIeiV5wE

A few days later everything was torqued back down properly (after a few heat cycles):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Da2KAsq0-9c

Last fall:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGT8D6QSLhI