Engine identification help needed

[Edy]

Anyone know how to find out what year my T motor is... 2980125 is the number stamped on the block... it does have a 1 in front of the numbers but to me it looks like it was stamped on later as it is barely imprinted into the block and I have heard that sometimes a mechanic would add a number when working on them back in the day... the T was sold to me as a 1915 with a 1919 motor but going through the T and reading a lot of posts here ( best place in the world for T info by the way.... thanks guys) I'm thinking that I have a 24 frame with a after market brass radiator... any help would be greatly appreciated... as far as I can find out this truck was put together by Lenard B Smith and Mike Fortunato of Townsend Massachusetts... unfortunately Mr. Smith has passed away (some on here may remember him) but I have talked with Mr. Fortunato and sent him some pictures of my T and he said it looks like one of theirs that they had built and sold ... I've also been in touch with Mr. Smith's son Kevin but no one has any records .... and the man that bought this T from them has passed on also with no real records... all paper work has the wrong numbers nothing's matching up and driving me nuts but I'm not gonna stop loving my T... just want to know all I can about it...thanks in advance guys

[ThreePedalTapDancer]

March 1919 number.

[Don D]

RAlph,

Thanks for sharing the history of your quest to determine what you have. It is an interesting story. It is said a picture is worth a thousand words. Would you consider sharing a few photos of your vehicle?

Have a great day,

Dom

[Edy]

Dom I'll see what I can do to post my pictures as I love showing it... have put it in 4 car shows so far with two second place and one first place trophies ...

[Edy]

March 1919 number.

Thank you Ed

[Edy]

Dom here we go my first attempt to post pictures on this forum

[ThreePedalTapDancer]

That looks like a fun T. I like the wood cab and bed.

[George Hand]

Ah the 1915 Model T Ford, seems like if you check all the Automotive trade papers & Internet sites at any given time there are more 1915 Fords for sale than Henry himself had the Ford Factory's produce. In the 1980's prices of Brass T's were high enough to engage Cloned creations. One can find '17-23 Cowl panels with the inverted !/2 moon cutout designed to allow the Radiator support rod to be drawn in to the inside of the car, this 1/2 moon cutout was not necessary on those cars with Hood Formers. The other common clone procedure has to do with touring body's that have the "3 panel" rear sheet metal that started in about '21 thru '23 in place of the "5 panel " rear sheet metal used from '14-20, and that is just some of the body ruses. Caveat emptor my friends.
George

[Edy]

[TRDxB2]

Looks like a dull #1 bouncing on a second strike. I'd say the number is 12980125 without question. A single cylinder valve cover is from 1921-27 and can also be used to confirm the date. The hand written Bill of Sale shows a different 1924 number 12893609

These indicate that the front axle is 1919+and the front spring clip is 1921-25

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[Wayne Sheldon]

The truck is almost certainly a put-together mix of pieces. What is sometimes referred to as a "parts salad". Nothing wrong with that. Model T Fords lent themselves to widely different and changing needs over many decades.
The radiator, hood and hood former all appear to be 1915 or 1916. Fenders are 1917 or later. Most of the chassis could be anything in the 1919 to 1925 eras. The running board brackets are 1920 or later. The wooden body looks really good, however is not done quite how original era truck bodies were usually done.
Somebody that really knows model Ts should be able to look over the engine block and narrow it down to about two years time-frame. Look for a casting date behind the serial number embossment. Ford stopped using those on USA blocks about 1920 or '21. Generator mounting on the right side front or not? (That change was made in 1919.) Valve side cover a single long panel? Or two short panels? There was a crossover time when both were used around 1921 and 1922. Minor casting detail changes around 1923, followed by the long run of 1923 through 1925 model year blocks. Significant changes in the block for 1926 and in 1927.

Looks like a good model T to have a lot of fun with!

[Don D]

Ralph,

Thanks for sharing the photos of this unique T. I'm glad it brings joy to you and those who cross your path.

I have a 1919 Roadster pickup that brings smiles to many faces.

Have a great day,

Dom

[Edy]

Thanks to everyone that replied and thanks for pointing out the little things that I overlooked I knew after talking with Mike Fortunato that it was built from several different T parts and who knows how many more oddities I will find going forward.... either way you look at it ya gotta love those T's

[John kuehn]

That’s a neat looking T you have! A head turner! A word of advice if you plan to get it registered and get some plates for it. When you go to your tax office or DMV use the engine number that’s on the engine and the bill of sale or title. DO NOT explain that your T has some different year parts on it and tell them it was ‘built up’.
Give them the minimal information that you have and that’s it. Some folks at your tax office or DMV will start asking to many questions about your car if you give them a lot of unnecessary information. The wrong person can make things complicated. Not trying to be negative but this happens more than you think when it comes to old cars.
Good luck and have fun!

[Steve Jelf]

Yep, a real parts salad for sure. But as dude Lester said, "That don't hurt the runnin' of it none."

I agree with John on how to approach registration. Use the number on the engine and don't volunteer any information that isn't asked for. It can lead to confusion and complications.

[TRDxB2]

If you need a BofS to title the truck take the fancy one and let it work for you without explanation. The engine date/# can be corrected 2 years from now.
IF and ONLY IF they're going to look the car over or look at the BofS or question the year...
"Say well, the Executor of the estate misread the engine number (hard to read where its at) and missed the leading hand stamped number 1. The engine is really a 1924 but the rest is 1915. So isn't this like a modern car when the engine is replaced under warranty? Doesn't change the year, its not a Hot Rod

[John kuehn]

Here in Texas when trying to acquire a title with or without a bill sale you have to go to the DMV and have it inspected. I had to do this 3 times with old cars without a clear title or no title at all. It’s required for them to check the vehicle I’d number and see if it’s stolen. I came out OK but finally had to use a bonded title service to get a title for one of my T ‘s.
I don’t know what you may have to do in your state but the one thing that may cause the DMV to question your information would be the engine number.
IF they look closely at the number they can see that the number may have been altered. It will depend who is looking at the number what may happen.

Hope they don’t look to close at your engine number and they may not even care BUT this is something that could happen. Good luck and at least you have a bill of sale.