MTFCA Forum

Anyone recognise this car?

https://www.handh.co.uk/auction/lot/lot ... 2&pn=2&g=1

If there were more than one picture I suspect we would see more than color and fenders that are not 1909. £30,000 = $41,400 USD. I won't be bidding.

Winning bid plus buyers premium at 12.5 percent. HmmmHmmmm

I would say they are 1909 fenders and to me it looks like it is a 1pc. front end with the spindles swapped side for side. Is that possible? Would be better with a 6 rivet. I suppose the 2-speed helps the weight.

I see lots of little things I would be concerned with for what the estimate indicates it should bring. The car doesn't have a Speedometer. The Spindle Bolts do not have the proper "oilers" & I am unable to see the Tie rod bolts. The Pedals are not Lettered. The left latch for the coil box is incomplete. I am not commenting on the starter, hogshead. crankcase or 2pc. drive shaft. Clearly a nice car, but a creation & as such should not command big money. George

What's "Craftsmans of San Diego" coach work ?!?
Looks like a pastiche.

Rich Bingham wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 22, 2021 3:06 pm

What's "Craftsmans of San Diego" coach work ?!?
Looks like a pastiche.

That sounds like Ray Wells. Excellent antique body replicas and repairs since the 1980’s.

http://www.the-craftsman.biz/home.html

Eric

Rich Bingham wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 22, 2021 3:06 pm

What's "Craftsmans of San Diego" coach work ?!?
Looks like a pastiche.

That is most likely Ray Wells.

It's a bitsa Town Car.

There's a late '12 also being auctioned that looks to be a more correct restoration. Correct or not, I'd sure like to have that Town Car in my garage!

The body alone is currently 12 grand.

The first line states it’s not a real town car. Looks nice and 99999 out of 10,000 wouldn’t know the difference and could care less.

What would it cost to assemble that town car today?
12K for the body, plus fenders, hood, aprons, new brass radiator, new lights, Ruckstell, top, paint, upholstery, wheels, tires, engine and everything else equals WAY MORE than 50K and that doesn't include 100s of hours of labor.
I think it is one of the nicer assembled town cars I have seen in a long time. It's got a great look to it and the fact that it is right hand drive makes it even more fun.

This clearly more Model T than I can afford, my concern is down the road this car will be assumed as Original, 2 of my drivers are "Bitsa" cars, and I make that apparent to those believing they are as Henry's people made them. the Coach work looks to be Suburb & as stated "Fitted with Craftsmans of San Diego coachwork" that in itself is very expensive to create. But it still the little things that would bother me if I was able & interested in owning, Rubber valve stems & all. I am sure who gets to buy this will enjoy their purchase of a rare body style. George

I built a very similar Town car 50 years ago, this one like mine is a mixture of parts and not correct in lots of ways But like mine would be great to drive if the mechanics are done properly. Several builders supplies these bodies originally , they all vary slightly and as is often the case some restorers get details wrong. This one, no back window, no jump seats inside, windscreen does not slide up over drivers head., Laundau irons on roof fold wrong way to name a few. As to weight these bodies were not much heavier than a touring , mine is actually lighter.

I can see a few mistakes but they can be changed if one has to have it "correct" , my TC also has the wrong year block in it but it has always been a driver has done thousands of miles, still starts first pull of the crank even after months in storage. As mentioned most have no concept if something is exactly as it is supposed to be but this TC has had lots of money and attention applied to it and as Ron Mac stated all those bits add up to heaps of money plus the labor.

Having one for so long and also having been able to see original ones I consider I have a good knowledge of these early Town Cars. If someone had the ability to purchase this TC it would be a good buy, I really object to the loading of the price with a 12.5 % premium. Owner may find that stops it selling.

Well, I hoped to provoke discussion and I did! Couple of points others haven't made: RHD - to the best of my knowledge there are none from 1909, the first RHD import to the UK was in 1910, I will check what 'The English Model T Ford' says. There is no paperwork, no registration document, no frame no - it might be impossible to register in the UK, the authorities are getting tricky here with 'assembled' cars. Indeed, what evidence is there that it should be called 1909 at all?

Anybody noticed those brass dome nuts on the wheels? Back in the day, English buyers were used to being able to change a wheel, not take a tyre off at the side of the road, so the selling dealer would offer to convert the US wheels by using 3 original bolts to hold the hub together and fitting 3 studs to the hub with dome nuts. So, if it has a demountable conversion, there should only be 3 dome nuts. Something wrong with those wheels.

The spark & gas levers look odd, should have a hard rubber knob. The lights are doubtless repro, but the rear lamp is a correct RHD configuration, must have been special order. Someone mentioned lack of 6 rivet rearend, for 1909 it should be a no-rivet. Did the original donor car have a motor or rear axle at all?

Pretty car but very much a bitza of unknown provenance.

Oh, and 12.5% buyers premium is the standard here, being an auctioneer is thirsty work, they need plenty of champagne!

Well for what I can see in the photo's the Ford half of the rear axle housing has a low filler plug and tapered axle hubs. Would love to see some engine photos to see if it has been changed to open valve

https://www.handh.co.uk/auction/lot/76- ... 54841&sd=1

Sold for £33,750 Inc premium. I didn't go to view, would have liked to know if the frame was 1909. Still think the new owner might have trouble getting a UK registration. The more genuine 1912 seems unsold.