That Pig of a Timer

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Jugster
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That Pig of a Timer

Post by Jugster » Fri Nov 26, 2021 12:43 pm

For a good many of us, the experience of driving a century-old car isn't about convenience or reliability. In fact, historical purists see frequently required maintenance and inconvenient breakdowns as part of the game. Other folks are just looking for some reliable fun. They're okay with putting demountable wheel rims and spare tires on a car that was not manufactured with them and feel the same about replacing an original, truffle-snuffling commutator with a Volkswagen distributor. Such modifications certainly improve the reliability of the car and if you're going to do a lot of touring, reliability counts for a lot.

I'm not a devout purist. For safety reasons, my car has extra stop-lights, 4-way flashers, turn-signals and a 12-volt electrical system which also powers a self-starter. Hand-cranking is a no-no for me because I'm in personal possession of a stack of vertebra and discs evidently in need of major surgery and titanium reinforcement every eight years, so I can't afford to be a purist. But hey, neither have I crossed over to the dark side! See, I'm of the opinion that part of the warp & woof of the Model T Ford is its famously cantankerous pig of an ignition system—one seemingly having been inspired by that British titan of automotive electrical systems, Lucas. Okay, okay; nothing is really that bad. In fact, the porcine coil & commutator ignition system on Henry's pride and joy was designed by a Ford patriarch by the name of Ed "Spider" Huff—though Henry did try to hog all the credit for it (Sorry, couldn't resist). The flywheel-magneto, coil and commutator ignition system was a unique beast unto the Model T, its primary purpose, that of avoiding payment of royalties to the patent-holders of industry-standard magnetos—which were simple, self-contained, extremely powerful and dead reliable. Oh, well.

Yes, the Ford roller-timer is the kind of piggy which only a muppet frog could love. The fact that a new timer design has come out every year since the Ford Model T started rolling off the assembly line, and continues to this very day, is clearly indicative of that. Could it really be that in over a century, nobody has come out with a timer that does not create a need for next year's new-and-improved model?

My Flivver came with an original roller-timer and it caused no end of trouble. Unfortunately, I, being a newbie to the hobby, didn't know enough to point an accusing finger at the true culprit and whenever my engine would misbehave, I'd wind up shipping coils off to be tuned, replacing the ignition harness, cleaning and re-gapping spark-plugs and taking apart every accessible ignition component to clean and polish all the terminals. On one occasion, a friend came in from out of state to help me diagnose my balky engine and did a compression check which, unexpectedly, turned out perfectly normal. From all appearances, the timer seemed okay, but out of frustration, and not knowing what the heck else to do, I purchased a replacement. Turned out, this little piggy actually fixed the problem.

The old timer sits in a cardboard box on my work-bench and every now and then, when I feel especially boared (Sorry, couldn't resist again), I'll check it over for the umpteenth time, trying to find the hidden flaw. Now, I'm the son of an aerospace machinist, so I know a micrometer from a dial indicator, but darned if I can figure out why this slop-snorting thing doesn't work. It's not out of round, the terminals are all solid, the roller spins free and true—I don't get it.

The new commutator is one of the last rebuilt and overhauled by an old-school machinist/timer guru of sterling reputation before he retired. Though it imparts a smooth idle and good acceleration, it needs to be cleaned with the same monotonous frequency as the porcine unit it replaced—a chore which is a boar (Somebody stop me). I give it a squirt of 5W-30 motor oil every other day of driving and use WD-40 as a solvent when it comes time to clean it. That'll usually keep it behaving for another 170 miles. The lesson learned is that when my engine starts acting up, the most probable culprit will be that swine of a timer; the proverbial fly in the oinkment.

That's all, folks!
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TXGOAT2
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by TXGOAT2 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:06 pm

A weak spring could cause problems with an otherwise good timer. An off-center timing cover can also impair timer performance. Actually, the Ford system works pretty good for a 1907 design, and it offers some advantages, like the "free start". Its large, accessible components and open, accessible design were probably easier for early day mechanics to deal with than the high tension magnetos of the era, and it did not require a battery to function. Having multiple coils and points offered some protection against a complete shut down due to any single part failing. A coil or coils that are out of proper adjustment can cause timer issues due to drawing too much current. Timers can be a headache, but people back in the day probably had more trouble with tires than timers.


Rich Bingham
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by Rich Bingham » Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:54 pm

While the Model T in its native state may be "tetchy", and while it's true that some gripes originate with an OEM timer, posts I have read on these boards through the past six-seven years have indicated numerous failures of distributor conversion contraptions, mostly on tours, and beyond the ability of helpful hands to remedy when far from the hime garage. Interesting, no ?
"Get a horse !"

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DanTreace
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by DanTreace » Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:55 pm

Could it really be that in over a century, nobody has come out with a timer that does not create a need for next year's new-and-improved model?



The answer, yes. Have been running this timer for 4 years, never a peek at the insides, flawless performance, never a miss. ;)

IMG_3978 (1024x768).jpg
The best way is always the simplest. The attics of the world are cluttered up with complicated failures. Henry Ford
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Inthegarage
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by Inthegarage » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:20 pm

DanTreace wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 1:55 pm
Could it really be that in over a century, nobody has come out with a timer that does not create a need for next year's new-and-improved model?



The answer, yes. Have been running this timer for 4 years, never a peek at the insides, flawless performance, never a miss. ;)

IMG_3978 (1024x768).jpg
I use the same timer!!
Thanks for showing me the inside.I forgot what it looked like. Mine has been on for 3 years now and I haven’t touched it n


Mark Osterman
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by Mark Osterman » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:45 pm

I have been driving my 23 runabout nearly every day for the past few years and an average of 100 miles a week except when the snow is deep on the road, which isn’t very often these days.

I have found it to be very reliable transportation and am often curious how others don’t have the same experience with their cars. I use a New Day timer and wipe out the track with very fine sand paper about every 2000 miles. At that time I also clean the plugs and check the original wood box coils (w/ new capacitors) on a hand crank coil tester. I make sure all the connections are clean and tight. Regular maintenance is how you get a reliable car. The more you drive your car the better you can tell when it’s not up to par … and what to do about it.

It was 30 degrees out when I started the car to go shopping this morning. I step on the starter with the ignition off and full choke for three revolutions and then back off on the choke a little and turn the ignition to battery and it almost always starts on compression (no starter motor needed). At the end of my drives I leave the lever forward to squeeze out the crankcase oil and hook up the battery to a trickle charger. Both of the latter make it easier to start the next morning.
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Jerry VanOoteghem
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by Jerry VanOoteghem » Fri Nov 26, 2021 5:37 pm

When I ran a timer & coils, I used an original ANCO timer for about 5 years, with essentially zero maintenance done during that time. By the time I removed it, it looked fairly worn, but still worked great.

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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by JohnH » Fri Nov 26, 2021 5:52 pm

In my 19 years of T ownership I've never had any reliability problems with the ignition or any other part of the electrical system. As an electrical engineer, it was obvious that the typical Model T electrics would be a source of frustration if they were left in their original 'barn find' condition. So I went through the whole lot, rebuilt the ignition coils and installed an Anderson timer. And, I went through the fuel system and rebuilt what was necessary there also.
The Anderson timer was perfectly reliable in that it would always make contact. Its downfall was the cylinder to cylinder timing would change over time as the contacts wore. Then I tried a TW timer which improved on that, and finally a few years ago an E-Timer. In all that time I've only re-adjusted the coils about once or twice.
For my car it's only the mechanical reliability I need to worry about, and usually any faults there are the original parts breaking from metal fatigue.


John kuehn
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by John kuehn » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:03 pm

And then there are those that use a distributor! But that’s another story! Me, I will stick with the NewDay , Anderson or a roller timer. For me it’s closer to being original. I’m not a purist but not real far from it.


Norman Kling
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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by Norman Kling » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:10 pm

Regardless of which type timer or distributor you have on your T, you will not likely find one at any local auto parts store. And even others on tours might not have one to match, so it is a very good idea to carry a spare timer and rotor along or if you have a distributor, carry points, condenser, rotor and cap and maybe even a spare coil.
Yes, I said coil. Many years ago, I had bought an old De Soto from my uncle. He couldn't figure what was wrong with it. He could start it and drive a few blocks and it would stop running. After at sat for a while, it would start up and run a few blocks more. I got it cheap and since the front end was smashed from his having an accident, I decided to scrap it. I also had a Plymouth of the same year and so I removed everything I thought could be used on the Plymouth and then called a wrecker to tow it away. Later, one day I was working on the Plymouth and accidently broke the small stud where the low voltage wire is connected to the coil. So I replaced it with the coil I had taken off the De Soto. In a few blocks I found out what had been wrong with the De Soto! :lol:
Norm

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Re: That Pig of a Timer

Post by MKossor » Sun Nov 28, 2021 4:37 pm

Nice to see the Ideal Timer is living up to its name and its claim. Thanks for sharing your experiences using it.
I-Timer + ECCT Adjusted Coils = Best Model T Engine Performance Possible!
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