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STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:51 pm
by lirogo27
If anyone has an extra out there please let me know. The part has been on back order for quite some time. I will purchase the lesser item as replacement (5014) but i know this unit tends to wear out quickly. 5014RE is the better unit.
Thank you.!!
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 8:17 pm
by Professor Fate
If you have a switch, try one of these. Just get the pin or tab one that's correct for your switch. There's some good clean up and rebuild info around.
https://www.modeltford.com/item/5012PBQ.aspx
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 10:39 pm
by lirogo27
Thank You. Problem is if the units are on back order for 4 plus months, my guess is the plate is too. I did find a starter switch through a vendor. It looks like it might be the cheaper version but at least it will be something.....THX!
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 9:02 am
by TWrenn
FWIW I sure couldn't find that part # in Langs catalog. Just "5012's"....any rate, try Ben Martin he restores/repairs switches. 770-938-3376
He's in Georgia
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 11:59 am
by MWalker
There seems to be some confusion here. The original poster is inquiring about a starter switch, part #5014RE. That's the foot button on the floor. The responses above are talking about the ignition switch, which is on the instrument panel.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
by MWalker
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:16 pm
by TRDxB2
Switch semantics There seems is confusion on what she is asking for.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:25 pm
by JvanMaanen
I probably have an original one kicking around. I'll check the barn tomorrow and send you an email if I find a good one, and if so it is yours for the cost of shipping.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:37 pm
by jiminbartow
I am selling a new, unused 5014 floor mounted starter button on eBay. Item #115353097273. Jim Patrick
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:38 pm
by TRDxB2
MWalker wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
I agree 1000% Unless they have changed the guts of the repro switch I would stay away from them.
some previous discussions
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p216124
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p215691
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:03 pm
by JvanMaanen
Just wandered out to the barn and I do have one. VOM says it checks ok. This is just the switch, not the mounting bracket. Email me shipping info, I am a little hard of hearing, so email is best. I'll send it off to you and you can send me the shipping cost once I know what it is.
Van
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:17 pm
by JvanMaanen
Adding to previous comments. With a 6v system if everything on the cable to the starter is not squeeky clean, the voltage drop is significant. You can check the switch and they do get a little unreliable. But make sure the contacts are good. Offer still stands, you can have the switch for the cost of shipping, but check your current switch with a VOM just to see if it is getting good contact.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:21 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:38 pm
MWalker wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
I agree 1000% Unless they have changed the guts of the repro switch I would stay away from them.
some previous discussions
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p216124
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p215691
TRDBx - Yes Agreed the guys do know how to do it and have done it. I wanted to try to keep the T 'original' but we are trending towards the push button which really works well from what I have seen on a couple of the cars.
I will speak with the Long Beach guys about moving towards that and gathering up and ordering the parts. I was able to find both an old version (Langs had one) and supposedly a new version (Ecklers) although I will believe it (the latter) when I see it when it arrives. No one I have contacted has a new reinforced version - although the picture in Ecklers catalog is the new version. Holding my breath.
Thank you for the suggestion. I am all in on the push button as long as there are no other draw backs. Thank you again!
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:41 pm
by lirogo27
JvanMaanen wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:03 pm
Just wandered out to the barn and I do have one. VOM says it checks ok. This is just the switch, not the mounting bracket. Email me shipping info, I am a little hard of hearing, so email is best. I'll send it off to you and you can send me the shipping cost once I know what it is.
Van
Van
Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Hold it aside for a minute or two. I THINK i found one new. But I am VERY TOUCHED you offered.
The plunger part and wiring is heating up - causing a short to the starting process - per Martyn - because the unit is flimsy and they do not last? As I am new, I am learning....but I will know more when I am under the car once the switch arrives and i see what he is talking about. The car does start and has - starter itself is a new rebuilt version.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:42 pm
by lirogo27
JvanMaanen wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:17 pm
Adding to previous comments. With a 6v system if everything on the cable to the starter is not squeeky clean, the voltage drop is significant. You can check the switch and they do get a little unreliable. But make sure the contacts are good. Offer still stands, you can have the switch for the cost of shipping, but check your current switch with a VOM just to see if it is getting good contact.
Roger that! Will do!
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:45 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:38 pm
MWalker wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
I agree 1000% Unless they have changed the guts of the repro switch I would stay away from them.
some previous discussions
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p216124
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p215691
M Walker - I am trending towards doing that! The Long Beach club guys have done that and it is great! Effortless. I will get the parts for that mid year and install either the 5014 or ideally the 5014 RE until. I have one of each coming to the house - although I am skeptical that Ecklers really has the RE as no one else had it....and it has been back ordered since January.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:47 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:16 pm
Switch semantics There seems is confusion on what she is asking for.
Correct. 5014 is easier to find than the 5014RE but the 5014 is flimsy and prone to failure. you are correct I was not asking for anything ignition related.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:50 pm
by lirogo27
TWrenn wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 9:02 am
FWIW I sure couldn't find that part # in Langs catalog. Just "5012's"....any rate, try Ben Martin he restores/repairs switches. 770-938-3376
He's in Georgia
Twrenn
I do not have a paper copy of the Lang Catalog. I went to their site, put 'starter switch' in the search box on the left side and 5014RE was the first thing that came up on page 1 of 18 pages. The 5014 was three of four pictures down from the RE.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 2:29 pm
by FATMAN
I have the T-5014-RE In stock, Bob
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 3:02 pm
by JvanMaanen
do check the cable and all contact surfaces. Ask me how I know after pulling starter, switches, etc tracking everything multiple times over the years and it almost always was contacts that were just dirty. It doesn't take much on a 6v system with the high amp draw to heat things up.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:27 pm
by lirogo27
FATMAN wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 2:29 pm
I have the T-5014-RE In stock, Bob
YOU DO?! How did I not know? What site? I tried all I knew of! Let me know ! GREAT. THANK YOU.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:28 pm
by lirogo27
JvanMaanen wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 3:02 pm
do check the cable and all contact surfaces. Ask me how I know after pulling starter, switches, etc tracking everything multiple times over the years and it almost always was contacts that were just dirty. It doesn't take much on a 6v system with the high amp draw to heat things up.
Will do! I believe we tightened up all the connections but will do a deeper dive.!
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:32 pm
by lirogo27
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:27 pm
FATMAN wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 2:29 pm
I have the T-5014-RE In stock, Bob
YOU DO?! How did I not know? I tried all I knew of! Let me know ! GREAT. THANK YOU. You are Bob's Antique Auto? I don't see a formal site. I have a few other items I would like to ask if you have......will PM you.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:56 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:38 pm
MWalker wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
I agree 1000% Unless they have changed the guts of the repro switch I would stay away from them.
some previous discussions
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p216124
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p215691
THANK YOU~! I will read all this tonight. Great information and I cant believe I did not find these on the forum first. MY bad. It will not happen again. It appears the push button is more and more the way to go.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:56 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:38 pm
MWalker wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 12:07 pm
Lisa -- The original-type starter switch is prone to failure due to burned contacts, as you apparently already know. A much better solution is to replace that switch with a push-button starter switch as used in cars of the 30's and 40's, in conjunction with a starter solenoid. The push-button switch is usually mounted on the heel panel below the front seat, or on the instrument panel. This is a much better, longer-lasting setup. It does require a bit of re-wiring to install those parts, but it's not a big job. Someone in your local Model T club probably has done this to his car and can walk you through it or do it for you.
I agree 1000% Unless they have changed the guts of the repro switch I would stay away from them.
some previous discussions
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p216124
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php? ... er#p215691
THANK YOU~! I will read all this tonight. Great information and I cant believe I did not find these on the forum first. MY bad. It will not happen again. It appears the push button is more and more the way to go.
STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 1:57 pm
by lirogo27
Hi All. Well it looks like there are NO 5014RE new fangled starter switches out there. I ordered one at Ecklers last Friday as they said they had them in STOCK. WELLLLLLLLL, they do not as I called for the status of the shipping and was told there was a back order. No more shopping at Ecklers....they let down more than they come through. 5014RE is on back order. I realize FATMAN (aka Bob) had two but they are now sold. SOOOOO If anyone knows of a new fangled Starter switch out there Part 5014RE, PLEASE, PLEASE reach out to me. I would be happy to buy it. In the interim I purchased a new one of the old fangled switches and will install that - and start CLEAN. The next step would be to install the push button version on the dash or floor as suggested on this thread. But in the short term, I will have the new old fangled unit (5014) installed and hope for the best.
THANK YOU AGAIN.
Re: LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 1:59 pm
by lirogo27
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:32 pm
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:27 pm
FATMAN wrote: ↑Tue Apr 26, 2022 2:29 pm
I have the T-5014-RE In stock, Bob
YOU DO?! How did I not know? I tried all I knew of! Let me know ! GREAT. THANK YOU. You are Bob's Antique Auto? I don't see a formal site. I have a few other items I would like to ask if you have......will PM you.
BOB, WHEN YOU get the item back in stock, please let me know. I would be happy to buy one from you. THX. (And thank you for the Turtle Deck Lock which I ordered yesterday). Lisa
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:26 pm
by Scott_Conger
My experience with original starter switches is that they are prone to failure after 40+ years of use.
they are rebuildable
I will not likely see the day when one of mine fails again.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 4:45 pm
by lirogo27
Scott_Conger wrote: ↑Fri Apr 29, 2022 2:26 pm
My experience with original starters is that they are prone to failure
after 40+ years of use.
they are rebuildable
I will not likely see the day when one of mine fails again.
Starter Switch. Not Starter. The Starter is fine!
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:14 pm
by Scott_Conger
yeah, "switches" I corrected it.
the originals can be, and usually are, very long-lived
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:49 pm
by lirogo27
Scott_Conger wrote: ↑Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:14 pm
yeah, "switches" I corrected it.
the originals can be, and usually are, very long-lived
this appears to be shorting out to the battery and housing it APPEARS. And the plunger and wires underneath becoming 'hot'. I don't know how old this one switch is. Hmmmmm. I might need to have it towed to the Long Beach guys so they can take a look at it.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:54 pm
by RajoRacer
Can you post a photo of the current switch, Lisa ? I might have an original, early "take apart" I could send you. Be careful about installing the "less costly" (notice I didn't write CHEAP) as I had one come apart at the top rivet that holds the button and it shorted out and STUCK ON !!!
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:05 pm
by lirogo27
RajoRacer wrote: ↑Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:54 pm
Can you post a photo of the current switch, Lisa ? I might have an original, early "take apart" I could send you. Be careful about installing the "less costly" (notice I didn't write CHEAP) as I had one come apart at the top rivet that holds the button and it shorted out and STUCK ON !!!
Yes. I will try to this weekend. The car was pushed into the garage at my house because I did not want to keep trying to start the car and wear out the battery. I tried for quite a bit of time. The heat from the plunger and the wires being hot underneath lead us to believe the switch is shorting out the efforts. I do have a NEW OLD version/ 5014 from Langs. We will give that a shot.
It will be hard given the spacing in the garage to get underneath with the car inside but I will do my best. At the worst, I will get you a picture a few days later when I can get a friend over to push the car out with me and allow me underneath! STAY TUNED. THANK YOU
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 8:39 am
by J1MGOLDEN
I had a problem with the better switch about 40 years ago.
I would sometimes put my foot back and kick the extender used for the shorter switch.
That action loosened the rivet on top of the switch and that top piece came off.
That engaged the starter as I'm driving along at 30 mph.
I quicky pulled off the road, and turned off the Ignition with the engine still turning over.
The battery box was on the running board, so it made removing the battery terminal a little easier.
Crank starting the engine on Mag was easy with the warm engine, so the trip continued with the battery cable off.
That has never happened since, but another friend had a similar experience and left the extension off.
He cut off a short section of an old broom handle that worked good to reach through the floor board to start the engine.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 12:45 pm
by lirogo27
J1MGOLDEN wrote: ↑Sun May 01, 2022 8:39 am
I had a problem with the better switch about 40 years ago.
I would sometimes put my foot back and kick the extender used for the shorter switch.
That action loosened the rivet on top of the switch and that top piece came off.
That engaged the starter as I'm driving along at 30 mph.
I quicky pulled off the road, and turned off the Ignition with the engine still turning over.
The battery box was on the running board, so it made removing the battery terminal a little easier.
Crank starting the engine on Mag was easy with the warm engine, so the trip continued with the battery cable off.
That has never happened since, but another friend had a similar experience and left the extension off.
He cut off a short section of an old broom handle that worked good to reach through the floor board to start the engine.
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Jim, I print all your emails and descriptions for my Model T File. Thank YOU!
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 1:59 pm
by mike catlin
Do you still need the switch have two 5014re contact me at58six 3zero61887
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 7:55 pm
by lirogo27
It looks like I might have one! I believe I do. So, hold tight. Will confirm they are sending it to me! THANK YOU for reaching out....
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 01, 2022 8:55 pm
by lirogo27
mike catlin wrote: ↑Sun May 01, 2022 1:59 pm
Do you still need the switch have two 5014re contact me at58six 3zero61887
Mike! Thank you again. I just confirmed that someone else is shipping me an extra they had! I THANK YOU for being so kind to offer. My guess is you will have QUITE a few inquiries and offers for the two you do have! I should have the tracking number from Jim by morning ..... If something should drastically change, I will reach back out to you...Lisa
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue May 03, 2022 10:01 pm
by lirogo27
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 29, 2022 10:05 pm
RajoRacer wrote: ↑Fri Apr 29, 2022 5:54 pm
Can you post a photo of the current switch, Lisa ? I might have an original, early "take apart" I could send you. Be careful about installing the "less costly" (notice I didn't write CHEAP) as I had one come apart at the top rivet that holds the button and it shorted out and STUCK ON !!!
Yes. I will try to this weekend. The car was pushed into the garage at my house because I did not want to keep trying to start the car and wear out the battery. I tried for quite a bit of time. The heat from the plunger and the wires being hot underneath lead us to believe the switch is shorting out the efforts. I do have a NEW OLD version/ 5014 from Langs. We will give that a shot.
It will be hard given the spacing in the garage to get underneath with the car inside but I will do my best. At the worst, I will get you a picture a few days later when I can get a friend over to push the car out with me and allow me underneath! STAY TUNED. THANK YOU
Rajo, I have not forgotten you. I was side tracked. I took off Thursday and we will be installing the new starter switch then. I will get pictures for you as requested. Sorry for delay.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Tue May 03, 2022 10:23 pm
by RajoRacer
No worries Lisa - was just curious as to what was installed !
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 3:43 pm
by lirogo27
RajoRacer wrote: ↑Tue May 03, 2022 10:23 pm
No worries Lisa - was just curious as to what was installed !
You will know by Tomorrow! A local T guy is coming over. The car has been dormant two weeks. I will try to start it again. If wires get hot we will push the car out of garage and start the work to replace Switch! I have an old version here with me and a new version arriving tomorrow. SOOOOOO Stay tuned. THX!
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 5:36 pm
by TRDxB2
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Wed May 04, 2022 3:43 pm
RajoRacer wrote: ↑Tue May 03, 2022 10:23 pm
No worries Lisa - was just curious as to what was installed !
You will know by Tomorrow! A local T guy is coming over. The car has been dormant two weeks. I will try to start it again. If wires get hot we will push the car out of garage and start the work to replace Switch! I have an old version here with me and a new version arriving tomorrow. SOOOOOO Stay tuned. THX!
I would appreciate it if you would post a picture of it. Looking to see how the plunger is attached to the base. WHY? I have 2 of them and could not in good conscious sell or even give you them for free because of the design of the ones I have. The problem is caused by the foot slightly pushing the plunger forward instead of straight down to make, bridge, across the internal contacts. This is fixable by reinforcing the plunder tube at its base. I have posted many pictures about this issue, see above, so take heed.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Wed May 04, 2022 10:18 pm
by Scott_Conger
If your switch gets hot...I'd suspect the switch
If your WIRES get hot...I'd suspect that they were skinny old 12V cables...6V cables are huge compared to 12V cables
check the gauge of the cables and measure the voltage drop at each connection while starter is engaged.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 10:26 am
by TRDxB2
Could also be tried to start it too many times in a row since it wouldn't start. Never said if the starter itself tried to turn the engine over
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 12:02 pm
by TXGOAT2
Be sure the battery is in good condition and of the proper capacity and also fully charged. The starter must also be in good condition. ALL battery/starter cables and their terminals and hardware MUST be in good condition. The engine must be electrically grounded to the frame and the negative battery cable must make a good electrical connection to the frame.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 8:07 pm
by lirogo27
WELLLLLL it was not the wiring. The wiring is all new - every component is....as is the starter. The 6v battery was purchased on 3/25 but will all the attempts at starting unsuccessfully here and there I am guessing the battery was also taxed.
As requested - picture of wiring is attached. What the problem was was indeed the starter switch. The unit plate was corroded as was part f the insides of the plunger. There were insect nests in there and also one of the metal pieces that is depressed inside the plunger was cut in half and floating around in the plunger unit. It was this broken piece that when it came in contact with the housing shorted out the process and caused the switch to heat up. Martynn took the plunger and mounting plate home to examine them further but somehow age did the unit in.
I will ask Martynn to take a picture of the plate and plunger inside so you can see the condition but the broken metal plate in the plunger is the culprit....
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 9:36 pm
by Scott_Conger
glad you found the problem with the starter switch.
that said, the cable to your starter looks too small
you want 1/0 or 2/0 on both cables and it should be crimped AND soldered
the wire to your barrier strip (ignition switch, lights) from the "hot" side is almost certainly too small of a gauge (the other wire doesn't even belong there but that's for another day) - it should be 12 gauge and that certainly doesn't look like 12 gauge
sizes are here:
https://www.engineersedge.com/copper_wire.htm
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Thu May 05, 2022 10:20 pm
by TRDxB2
I assume the first picture is your new switch in place.
If the attached picture is a before shot prior to you folks looked inside.... it shows signs of being tampered with. The arrows point to two of the four tabs hold the cover that should be bent over, not broken off.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 12:19 am
by lirogo27
I will look into the wire gauge and the type of wires. The first picture is the new switch installed. The picture you have a close up of is indeed the old switch from underneath. All the wiring was replaced in exact positions and locations as to where they were on the old switch.It is clear that most of the wiring is new. But yes the bottom of the old switch was in horrible condition. I asked Martynn for pictures of the plate and the inside of the plunger...he took them home to look at them closer Both the plate and plunger were in horrible condition.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 12:21 am
by lirogo27
Scott_Conger wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 9:36 pm
glad you found the problem with the starter switch.
that said, the cable to your starter looks too small
you want 1/0 or 2/0 on both cables and it should be crimped AND soldered
the wire to your barrier strip (ignition switch, lights) from the "hot" side is almost certainly too small of a gauge (the other wire doesn't even belong there but that's for another day) - it should be 12 gauge and that certainly doesn't look like 12 gauge
sizes are here:
https://www.engineersedge.com/copper_wire.htm
I will find out where to buy the type and gauge you recommend.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 9:08 am
by Scott_Conger
Just call Lang's and order the heavier of the two cables they offer. That will be oversize to the original and will guarantee minimal voltage drop during use.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 9:22 am
by cwlittle
Lang's
Item Number: WS4ORH
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 12:30 pm
by lirogo27
THANK YOU ALL. ORDERING TODAY!
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 12:40 pm
by lirogo27
OK Folks - here are the promised pictures of the starter switch removed. If you look closely, The upside down picture of the base of the plunger unit you will see one half of the metal pieces is missing. That is the piece I sent a picture of yesterday. That piece when dislodged from its customary location was coming in contact with the housing causing the short.
The NEW 6V battery is on a trickle charge right now and it is still showing yellow after 12 hrs. I will leave it on until mid day today and have a friend unplug it for me noonish. I will attempt to restart the car tonight when I get home from work and drive it around the neighborhood for 15 -20 min when I get home from work tonight. Hopefully that will help.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 12:57 pm
by George House
Lisa- throw that junk starter switch away but retain the trapezoid looking base. Then go to Tractor Supply (TSC) and buy a GOOD starter switch and mate it to that base. Good advice on 6V heavier cables.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 1:46 pm
by TRDxB2
I'm back on my soap box.
The switch mechanism that Tractor Supply sells is essentially the same as what is on the repro's that the vendors sell. In fact its also available at most Auto Parts Stores. Now that you realize that, when the switch on the #5014RE fails you can just buy the switch body and replace it on the plate that came with the #5014RE. No need to try an fabricate a switch plate from the old one. Here is what Tractor Supply sells and a picture of the 5014RE for comparison.
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Here is link to Tractor Supply
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/produ ... tch-dr405c
The switch they sell has a 1 year Warranty
So save your sales receipt.
Here are some reviews
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This is what's inside - look familiar
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 1:53 pm
by Dropacent
Lisa, I didn’t read the whole thread, but IMHO originals like this are the only ones worth using. Note they come apart easily and don’t have the cheap copper in them. I do have an extra spare, and I’d be glad to send to you.
Tmorsher@icloud.com to reach me.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 6:51 pm
by lirogo27
Dropacent wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 1:53 pm
Lisa, I didn’t read the whole thread, but IMHO originals like this are the only ones worth using. Note they come apart easily and don’t have the cheap copper in them. I do have an extra spare, and I’d be glad to send to you.
Tmorsher@icloud.com to reach me. 374FC003-6430-45CE-9B5E-99C057BEF4C7.jpeg
Thank you Tim - the 5014RE is already installed. I am thinking this will work for quite some time. no?
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 7:03 pm
by RajoRacer
Yes, it should last years - I installed them years ago when they became available but then I have small feet !
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 7:16 pm
by TRDxB2
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 6:51 pm
Dropacent wrote: ↑Fri May 06, 2022 1:53 pm
Lisa, I didn’t read the whole thread, but IMHO originals like this are the only ones worth using. Note they come apart easily and don’t have the cheap copper in them. I do have an extra spare, and I’d be glad to send to you.
Tmorsher@icloud.com to reach me. 374FC003-6430-45CE-9B5E-99C057BEF4C7.jpeg
Thank you Tim - the 5014RE is already installed. I am thinking this will work for quite some time. no?
Just make sure you push straight down and not rock it forward.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Fri May 06, 2022 7:50 pm
by RajoRacer
I believe a "too long" of a switch extension could play a major role in one's foot pushing forward on any switch ! The switch and/or extension should clear the kick panel/floorboard just enough to fully engage.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 9:11 am
by J1MGOLDEN
It did play a role on my T when I accidently kicked it and the top came off the switch and the spring to popped out.
That let it drop down and engage the starter while I was driving at 30 mph.
Lucky for me, the battery box was on the running board and the terminal was not on the battery very tight.
That was the end of my tour that day! The battery was also done for the day.
Another friend solved a possible problem with a 4 inch piece of a small broom handle and not using the extension.
There was a hole drilled across the rounded top end with a loop of rawhide through it for easy access (or a wrist ornament).
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sat May 07, 2022 8:10 pm
by lirogo27
Well the car is starting now on the second or third try. I put it back in the garage and will drive it tomorrow. Let us see how it starts up then. It is back on trickle charger and I will pick up a 6v battery charger to keep here in the event of problems. Tomorrow I will drive it around and hopefully get some charging.
The wires - the wires were changed to 6v wiring. The wiring is correct to a 1926 T 6v. They are indeed the thicker wires.....
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Sun May 08, 2022 1:27 am
by TRDxB2
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 8:10 pm
Well the car is starting now on the second or third try. I put it back in the garage and will drive it tomorrow. Let us see how it starts up then. It is back on trickle charger and I will pick up a 6v battery charger to keep here in the event of problems. Tomorrow I will drive it around and hopefully get some charging.
The wires - the wires were changed to 6v wiring. The wiring is correct to a 1926 T 6v. They are indeed the thicker wires.....
You don't need to trickle charge the battery 24/7 when your not driving it. The Model T doesn't use that much. In fact your generator may actually over charge your batter so keep an eye on the amp meter. Don't worry if it goes negative when yo u turn the lights on.
When you do trickle charge the battery disconnect the negative terminal.
https://mtfca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=28109
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 12:43 pm
by lirogo27
amp meter is showing WELL above 6-10 amps. I disconnected the trickle this morning. Some of the newer ones automatically turn off and I bought one of those last night. I will drive the car around tonight a bit to see how it is doing......
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 9:17 pm
by TRDxB2
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 12:43 pm
amp meter is showing WELL above 6-10 amps. I disconnected the trickle this morning. Some of the newer ones automatically turn off and I bought one of those last night. I will drive the car around tonight a bit to see how it is doing......
Model T Ammeters are not that accurate and the just measure what is being output from your generator minus any load. You don't want to pump 6-10amps into your battery while driving, suggest you turn on the lights to put a load on the system and drop the ammeter down. Its also a point of safety, like Modern Cars having daytime running lights. Just remember to turn them off.
Re: STILL LOOKING FOR LANG'S STARTER SWITCH UNIT # 5014RE
Posted: Mon May 09, 2022 10:18 pm
by lirogo27
TRDxB2 wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:17 pm
lirogo27 wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 12:43 pm
amp meter is showing WELL above 6-10 amps. I disconnected the trickle this morning. Some of the newer ones automatically turn off and I bought one of those last night. I will drive the car around tonight a bit to see how it is doing......
Model T Ammeters are not that accurate and the just measure what is being output from your generator minus any load. You don't want to pump 6-10amps into your battery while driving, suggest you turn on the lights to put a load on the system and drop the ammeter down. Its also a point of safety, like Modern Cars having daytime running lights. Just remember to turn them off.
Will do!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! thank you!