MTFCA Forum

Does anyone know whether new headgaskets are available now?
Norm

In the past month I have called numerous vendors and head gasket company’s and the words “out of stock” have become the norm. I believe you can find fel-pro kits on flee-bay. They don’t have copper head gaskets thou. Headgaskets.com can make solid copper ones. Price is high but they can do it. Happy hunting

As I mentioned a while back in a similar post about head gaskets, a reputable vendor told me the "machining" for these gaskets was finally "wore out"...some may recall the "last batch" turned out some defective, not-long-lasting gaskets. And so far new machining for these has yet to surface. Not a good omen at this point. As Bryant said, may have to bite the bullet and go "custom make" at that website. And yes, good luck.

Well, I just typed in that link and got a "website domain for sale" page instead.

Hurry! HOT!! Get $uper cash flow from your very own web domain at no cost to you!!! Buy and sell cool products and services WORLD WIDE right from your own basement room using other peoples' money! No investment required**!! NO CREDIT CHECK!! But you must act NOW so have credit visa mastercard card* ready and call right now our 24 hr international operators are standing by to assist you!! **Service fees, franchise fees, and toll fees may apply. *Your credit card information will be made available to the same Bulgarian syndicate that is bringing this $uper offer to you!! DONTDELAYACTGNOWBEFORETHEYFORCEUSTOTAKETHISOOFERAWAY!

You're feelin your oats today!!

I hadn't seen anything posted about it for several months and was hoping the problem had gone away. I have about 10 used ones, but I am reluctant to install one on a car which I use for tours .
Norm

TWrenn wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 20, 2022 8:41 am

Well, I just typed in that link and got a "website domain for sale" page instead.

I don’t know what’s up with that site try gasketworks.com it’s the place Iam talking about.

Bryant, I just tried the other link, and this time it sent me to some SHOE website!! Lemme try it again.

Yuuup....NO luck! The URL box starts out with the gasketworks.com in it then quickly shifts to this!

If you cant get a head gasget, you will need those Tim!

Yeezy Boost ? what in the world? I don’t know I type it in and it comes right up. My search engine is duck duck go.

From there website under contact info
Copper@headgasket.com (email)
626-358-1616 (phone)
626-628-3777 (fax)

Thisone worked for me: http://www.headgasket.com/

Not to throw a wrench in the works.
Norm, you're handy, you could make one if need be. Parts store has gasket material.

dykker5502 wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:36 pm

Thisone worked for me: http://www.headgasket.com/

Skærmbillede 2022-06-22 05.34.48.png

That’s the one! Contact them

What Steve Jelf Said
Contact Adam Doleshal

I contacted him also with a reply of no copper head gaskets. Not sure about other types

KirkieP wrote: ↑

Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:34 pm

What Steve Jelf Said
Contact Adam Doleshal

20220613_154346.jpg

This is what Adam uses and sells. It has worked for me.

That gasket looks very similar to what Ford used on the later model flathead V8 engines. Those were a black, graphited, laminated gasket with a perforated steel core, asbestos, or other fiberous material laminate, and steel fire rings. They were trademarked "Graflex" and "Ford". They were not very thick.

Could an adequate head gasket be made from Graphite gasket sheet stock?

Tod

Maybe. I've never seen a multi-cylinder head gasket that did not have fire rings. It's fairly easy to cut head gaskets for low power stationary engines from suitable gasket material. Such engines may or may not have originally had fire rings of copper or steel. They were similar to a T engine in construction, but they typically did not produce as much power per cubic inch as a T engine or run at anywhere near the speed of a T engine. I'm pretty sure a well-cut, hand made gasket cut from a suitable material and sprayed with Coppercoat or a similar product would work on a T... for a while. I'd think it would fail prematurely, however, and probably from burning through at the point where the material is narrowest between cylinders.

If you could get a sheet of steel-core gasket material like some exhaust manifod gaskets are made of, it might make a good head gasket. I'd think it would be very difficult to cut, and it would still lack fire rings, which all composite automotive head gaskets I've ever seen do have.

I agree with your last 2 posts, but was just wondering if something could be made to get someone by. I still find it incredible that so plentiful a car is short of head gasket supply. It makes me wonder how hard I should push my cylinder head projects.

Tod

blockheads2014 wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:59 am

I agree with your last 2 posts, but was just wondering if something could be made to get someone by. I still find it incredible that so plentiful a car is short of head gasket supply. It makes me wonder how hard I should push my cylinder head projects.

Tod

Tod, I understand your concern about the nonavailability of head gaskets affecting you decision to proceed with your Miller head production. Unless a developer/manufacturer is flush with funds and can withstand the delay, regardless of the time period that may be, he doesn't want to invest in a product that his buyers can't use, right away. That said, T head gaskets are bound to become available again. If they don't, every T owner is screwed. Both Kevin Prus, and Steven Zajicek are in a similar boat, with the only difference that their heads have been in production and use for years and probably long enough to recoup their initial expenses. If a potential buyer takes a chance on when head gaskets are available, the head can be held and stored until such time as they can be used. Wishing you good luck and good luck to all T owners on the availability of T head gaskets. This might be a "wake up" call to the major vendors to 'stock up' on 'critical need' items in the future. I can see vendors not carrying a lot of items that don't wear out or need replacing on a "as needed" basis, but head gaskets will always be needed.

There are some YouTube videos of guys making solid copper head gaskets for 4 cylinder motorcycle engines. i pondered trying it for the T engine. 99%copper, make all the cuts, anneal and install. they made it look easy in times like these i think we should be trying to make things when there is a need. experimentation. you just don't know. the material cost is up but what would the experience be worth? and if it was successful? i wish i had a test stand engine, i would give it ago....

I've been running one of Les Schubert's solid copper head gaskets on my '19 Centerdoor with large valves & Ricardo head for several years - not a problem !

As I mentioned in another thread, if you have material and fusion 360, this is a simple water jet job.

Andy

I can't remember how to anneal solid copper gaskets so they're soft enough to keep working.. Can anyone help out??

I take all this as a sign that we should abandon our flatheads and move on to overheads. Fronty and Rajo gaskets are readily available.

This week I received both a Felpro and a solid copper gasket. Both look good. The copper gasket comes annealed. I was told to clean thoroughly, give 5 or 6 dusting coats of copper spray sealant, lay down while still a bit tacky, finger tighten head bolts then torque down as you normally would. There is no need for retightening. The two end water passages have a bridge that I will remove using a dremel cut off wheel and an asbestos/copper gasket as a template. The gasket is .062" thick
The Felpro gasket is a solid piece of asbestos like material with what appears to be steel fire rings. The gasket is .065 " thick.
I have no problem using either.
The cost of the solid copper gasket is $150. Less is you get the thinner material, which I recall is .040" thick. The cost of the Felpro gasket set is about $192.00, and it includes some cork gaskets and an upgrade manifold set with rings on one side integral. All that said, I have not tried them for fit. That's tomorrow.

RGould1910 wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:38 pm

This week I received both a Felpro and a solid copper gasket. Both look good. The copper gasket comes annealed. I was told to clean thoroughly, give 5 or 6 dusting coats of copper spray sealant, lay down while still a bit tacky, finger tighten head bolts then torque down as you normally would. There is no need for retightening. The gasket is .062" thick
The Felpro gasket is a solid piece of asbestos like material with what appears to be steel fire rings. The gasket is .065 " thick.
I have no problem using either.
The cost of the solid copper gasket is $150. Less is you get the thinner material. The cost of the Fel pro gasket set is about $192.00, and it includes some cork gaskets and an upgrade manifold set with rings on one side integral.

20220624_181738.jpg

looking good! Glad to see they made it to you

Susanne wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:25 pm

I can't remember how to anneal solid copper gaskets so they're soft enough to keep working.. Can anyone help out??

From what I gather you heat the to a dull red and then drop them in water.

I have watched this discussion about the availability of head gaskets for the past few weeks with interest.
There seems to be a lot of speculation and a lot of opinions amd a lot of Google searches.
FACT 1: The regular suppliers of copper head gaskets have none in stock.
FACT 2: None of the regular suppliers with the exception of Adam have the "fiber" head gaskets in stock.
FACT 3: The current eBay selling price for a copper gasket is in the order of $150 .
FACT 4: The need for head gaskets has not gone down.
FACT 5 : There are some alternatives including solid copper but no one is prepared to make the investment.
RUMOUR: There are no copper clad gaskets because the dies broke or wore out.
With the size and strength of the MTFCA should somone (or group) take on a project to research the true reason for the lack of
copper clad head gaskets and seek a solution?
Diemakers are making and repairing dies all the time. I did a lot of work with a forge shop early in my career.
They were continiously "welding in" the dies to convert to new product.
Surely someone has the capability to repair these dies and make these gaskets.
The next question becomes "at what cost?" Many have suggested there is now a new norm in
the value of a head gasket; likely over $100 each.
Perhaps the MTFCA should study this situationi which is critical to the comtiuance of our hobby and
help find a solution?
I would invite your thoughts on this serious matter.
Harry Lillo
Calgary

Harry, I see your in Calgary? This place is also.
Laser Equations (operations) Ltd
“Cutting edge solutions”
2018 41st Avenue N.E
Calgary, AB. T2E 8Z7
Tel: (403) 250-2603
Fax: (403) 735-5123
Email: quotes@laserequation.com
This place quoted a minimum 22 piece order solid copper 0.040 thick gasket. Unit price $111.95 each totaling at $2462.90 before shipping. (Prices subject to change) Maybe larger orders would be cheaper? It’s a risk investment with probably no profit. Selling of the order would be stressful. Who gets one first? But I think it’s far from over. The power has been shifted to the patrons….

a 1/16" sheet of annealed copper the size needed for a T gasket is somewhat over $60 just for the raw stock.

A $111 laser cut solid gasket is a screaming deal.

Bryant,
I am very familiar with Laser Equations.
I believe they cut with laser and waterjet.
There is another company that has similar capacity close to me as well.
Do you know if the quote is in US or Canadian dollars.
If it was in Canadian dollars that would equlate to 86 US dollars.
Twenty years ago I experienced and others here experienced failures in
copper clad head gaskets when the asbestos was removed and replaced
with a fiberglass like material.
I researched the current head gasket makers, and had minimum order of
100 gaskets made with the same elastomer core as modern V8 gaskets.
Yesterday I looked to see if the maker's name was on the packing box
but it was not. I expect they were the suppliers to the vendors after we got
the product right.
Does anyone here know the name of the company that made the gaskets for our hobby?
That company is the one we need to approach to possibly get the gaskets back into production.
Failing that we need to promote a high quality fiber gasket with good fire rings. Who makes those?
Harry

Harry,
The old quote was from there company so I guess it was not US dollars? It doesn’t confirm that on the quote.
So we have a bulk gasket option (laser equations)
The Felpro kit option
Adam’s supply (mentioned by Steve)
The gasket works single unit option (rgould example)
And the rare out in the wild option

Reporting on the solid copper head gasket I purchased last week. Last night I set the gasket on the block and installed the head bolts, all but one. One of the headbolt holes didn't line up. In addition, one piston and at least one valve head comes very close to hitting the head gasket as you turn the motor over. I have a standard bore engine. If I keep the gasket I will open the hole for the bolt and valve and widen the opening for at least one piston. I wanted to alert those who may be interested in buying one of these of the issues with mine.

For comparison, I also set the Felpro gasket on the block and it lines up perfectly.

Richard , I believe your first picture shows the gasket put on backwards. There is a front and back to the gasket. That wouldn’t effect the bolt holes, of course , but if an annealed copper gasket was dropped on its edge in the package, it could certainly distort that much. I’d just try using a good size tapered punch on the hole , and see if you can’t walk it that little bit.

Richard, I viewed your copper sample in your 6-24 post, and that gasket is symmetrical. The original is not. So, you are losing a bit of gasket surface in its use. I still think that hole could probably be walked into place, but perhaps better would be whoever made it, to be aware of the mistake in the shape they cut before they cut a thousand of them. . JMHO

That looks like damage to me. As for the tight clearance at the edge of the bores or valves, those area could be relieved as needed with a dremel tool or with hand tools.

I agree the gasket either warped in the annealing process or was dropped. One end was bent when I got it although the packaging was perfect. I tried reversing the gasket before I posted my findings. Same result on the rear hole. I am reluctant to stretch the gasket into place for fear of thinning it. Although I could relieve the touching areas, I shouldn't have to modify a gasket to fit properly. If the gasket was dropped, it likely was not done in transit. Regardless, the seller is responsible for curing the defect under UCC.

Does Felpro sell just head gaskets, rather than whole engine sets? If so, who carries them?

Tod

blockheads2014 wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:02 am

Does Felpro sell just head gaskets, rather than whole engine sets? If so, who carries them?

Tod

Felpro sells just head gaskets for some car/models like a Model A but not for a Model T.

Some many discussions on the same issue


Best prices & Free shipping

Thank you all very much. A friend has loaned me a copper gasket, and I hope to be able to pay him back when they are again being manufactured.
Norm

Looks like MAC’s ford auto parts have the composite style head gaskets listed “in stock”
Could it be….?

All this about head gaskets, I have used about every kind made all with good success. When needed on some small engines I have reused head gaskets more than once with good results. But I have never tried doing it on a Model T ( it has crossed my mind ) as I had one gasket come off very nice.
When this head gasket thing first started over a year ago I was able to find enough to cover my projected needs. Not all of them where copper but??
Like I said I've had good success with all of them. I cleaned up the used gasket I have & soaked it in a cement mixing tub with some water in it in the Az. sun. Would anyone like to try using it? and if so what would it be worth?
Crag.

Greetings,

I just got a call from Smith and Jones in SC regarding a gasket I've had on backorder for some time. Their supplier has advised them that they should have copper available in about 8 weeks.

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Their supplier has advised them that they should have copper available in about 8 weeks.

I expect that will apply to the other parts dealers too. I imagine that copper has been out of stock everywhere because one source was supplying all of them.

Meanwhile, I don't know any reason not the use the East Shore MT-100 gasket. It works for me.

Regarding the Fel-Pro blue colored head gaskets, these gaskets, or similar looking Fel Pro gaskets were not intended to need re-torquing, at least on modern applications, such as a Ford FE V8. I'm guessing that would not apply to using one of these gaskets on a Model T when installing a new aluminum head. Does anyone have experience doing this?

IMO, It's hard to believe that a modern head gasket design made to withstand 4X the combustion pressure and a cooling system pressurized to 16 psi can't hold up to Model T use.

Here are my findings here is the silicone style from Ecklers. Looks and feels great. Placed on a stock head it fits very nicely. Fire rings don’t putrid into the combustion zone. IMO they look like high quality gaskets that I would trust to work on a stock set up.(provided it’s true) here is the same gasket on an aluminum higher compression head (Prus head) the gasket putrids into the combustion zone in spots due to a different combustion design. IMO I think this would wear this style gasket down causing it to fail. Now the copper gasket fits nicely on both stock and modified.
Bryant

Too bad Victor stopped making the 101!

I respectfully submit for your approval a new copper head gasket on top of a new silicon head gasket if you look close you will see that there is very little if any difference between the two. I suggest the issue is more the aluminum heads than the gaskets. Sorry they are not for sale. They are needed for up coming projects.
Craig.